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classification by birth vs. by area vs.by ancestry

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  • ssaucer@juno.com
    I have wondered the same about families. For instance, how long would it take a German family become French after the land is taken over and is officially
    Message 1 of 3 , Jul 26, 2004
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      I have wondered the same about families. For instance, how long would it take a "German" family become "French" after the land is taken over and is officially part of France? Did the Poles become German or Russian or Austrian(?) when their land was divvied up? Did the Germans become Polish when the land becam Poland again?

      >but they (usually) were not Slavic in origin. So, I don't know if they >can be considered Slavic or not for this purpose.

      >Interesting thought -- is a shaman classified by place of birth or area of >activity?
    • Susan Koziel
      Or from the Canadian side... you become a citizen of the country when your passport says you are - your cultural heritage remains something entirely different
      Message 2 of 3 , Jul 26, 2004
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        Or from the Canadian side...
        you become a citizen of the country when your passport
        says you are - your cultural heritage remains
        something entirely different and it can take many many
        generations for that to change (and it sometimes never
        does).
        Canadians speak of their heritage thusly:
        Russian Canadian
        Polish Canadian
        German Canadian
        Ukrainian Canadian
        etc

        I am proud to be Canadian - but I am also proud of my
        cultural heritage.

        Maybe that's a Canuck thing, but my guess is that
        people from a conquered nation usually don't stop
        practicing their culture (if they are not forced to
        assimilate). Thus a Pole in Germany will maintain
        Polish cultural practices within the confines of their
        families and over time will adopt certain German
        cultural norms, so his children and possibly his
        grandchildren will be Polish Germans... I'd say 5 or 6
        generations at least before the people become German
        (if they are allowed to).

        Also this depends on how actively you can pass your
        culture to the next generation. If the conquered are
        not allowed citizenship to the country in question
        then it is very unlikely they will ever loose their
        origional cultural identity. Alternately if a family
        is very active/strict in passing their culture they
        will hold onto it longer.

        -Kataryna
      • P&MSulisz
        ... Poles become German or Russian or Austrian(?) when their land was divvied up? Did the Germans become Polish when the land becam Poland again? Comment from
        Message 3 of 3 , Jul 27, 2004
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          > I have wondered the same about families. For instance, how long Did the
          Poles become German or Russian or
          Austrian(?) when their land was divvied up? Did the Germans become Polish
          when the land becam Poland again?


          Comment from Poland: good american question!
          Please apologize me.
          My personal answer is: NEVER. It depends only on the person/family in
          question.
          Sense of nationality in Europe (identity/nationality can be described by
          your 'small fatherland'=heimat in German, or be double like
          Kaschubian/Polish) was and still is very strong. If spanish speaking indian
          catholic obtains U.S. passport he isn't automatically turned into W.A.S.P.
          It will take some time, or some generations... If they will allow it. Poles
          were given foreign passports, sometimes the names were changed by the
          officials into German/Russian but they naver stopped to be Poles, if they
          want to be them. You can try to turn into somone you are not but (Michael
          Jackson is such a person. The result is widely known...) you will be always
          recognized as foreign/strange person.
          Other example are Jews in Europe. In they own eyes they are European but for
          many other 'europeans' they are and always will be simply strange Jews, and
          after many generations people will ask you: Aren't your ancestors Jews?
          Magdalena z Wroclawia
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