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Re: Slavic bowing?

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  • Kinjal of Moravia
    ... curious if the slavic cultures had a specific type of bow? Just a pondering of an idle mind. ... I have done extensive research and may be of help. The
    Message 1 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
      --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick Jarrett" <gtg346g@m...> wrote:
      > Well I couldn't come up with anything on the web, but I was
      curious if the slavic cultures had a specific type of bow? Just a
      pondering of an idle mind.
      >
      > Mikhail Nicholaev
      > mka Patrick Jarrett

      I have done extensive research and may be of help. The whole Slavic
      area is a hotbed of development of many bow types. May I suggest
      that you first become familiar with all medieval bows used in the
      area, then we can discuss your area and development. One good
      source is a manufacturer in Finland. You can learn a lot here.
      http://www.traditional-archery-scandinavia.com/englisch/englisch.html
      >
      You might also join the SCA-Archery Yahoo group and ask specific
      questions.

      Kinjal of Moravia
    • Alexey Kiyaikin
      Greetings! Monday, March 31, 2003, 9:53:37 AM, you wrote: PJ Well I couldn t come up with anything on the web, but I was curious PJ if the slavic cultures
      Message 2 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
        Greetings!

        Monday, March 31, 2003, 9:53:37 AM, you wrote:

        PJ> Well I couldn't come up with anything on the web, but I was curious
        PJ> if the slavic cultures had a specific type of bow? Just a pondering of an idle mind.


        No bow. No sword. No axe. NOTHING of specifically slavic pattern. The
        Slavic world was the source of somebody else's ideas compiled in an
        unusual way, but it invented nothing of its own.

        --
        Bye,
        Alex mailto:Posadnik@...
      • LiudmilaV@aol.com
        In a message dated 4/2/2003 8:06:58 PM Pacific Standard Time, ... Do you mean bowing to be polite? From your waist down, right hand goring from the heart down.
        Message 3 of 14 , Apr 3, 2003
          In a message dated 4/2/2003 8:06:58 PM Pacific Standard Time,
          gtg346g@... writes:


          >
          > Well I couldn't come up with anything on the web, but I was curious if the
          > slavic cultures had a specific type of bow? Just a pondering of an idle
          > mind.
          >
          > Mikhail Nicholaev
          > mka Patrick Jarrett
          >

          Do you mean bowing to be polite? From your waist down, right hand goring from
          the heart down. The more important the person you are bowing to, the lower
          you go.

          That is an extrapolation, though -- there are certainly references to bowing
          in various period sources, but what I describe is really an authentic Russian
          post-period bow.

          Liudmila

          Liudmila


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Lente
          So would this be used in hungary too? Have an early period magyar persona means to me curtseying in pants seems a little weird. Kathws ... From:
          Message 4 of 14 , Apr 3, 2003
            So would this be used in hungary too? Have an early period magyar persona
            means to me curtseying in pants seems a little weird.

            Kathws

            ----- Original Message -----
            From: <LiudmilaV@...>
            To: <sig@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2003 8:40 AM
            Subject: Re: [sig] Slavic bowing?


            > In a message dated 4/2/2003 8:06:58 PM Pacific Standard Time,
            > gtg346g@... writes:
            >
            >
            > >
            > > Well I couldn't come up with anything on the web, but I was curious if
            the
            > > slavic cultures had a specific type of bow? Just a pondering of an idle
            > > mind.
            > >
            > > Mikhail Nicholaev
            > > mka Patrick Jarrett
            > >
            >
            > Do you mean bowing to be polite? From your waist down, right hand goring
            from
            > the heart down. The more important the person you are bowing to, the lower
            > you go.
            >
            > That is an extrapolation, though -- there are certainly references to
            bowing
            > in various period sources, but what I describe is really an authentic
            Russian
            > post-period bow.
            >
            > Liudmila
            >
            > Liudmila
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            >
            >
            >
          • pan_landolf
            While I was in Poland, I was bowed to by a gentleman in a museum. He bowed as described by Liudmila, except he clicked his heels prior to bending at the
            Message 5 of 14 , Apr 3, 2003
              While I was in Poland, I was bowed to by a gentleman in a museum. He
              bowed as described by Liudmila, except he clicked his heels prior to
              bending at the waist.
              Is the heel click a post-period affectation?
              Landolf

              --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, LiudmilaV@a... wrote:
              > In a message dated 4/2/2003 8:06:58 PM Pacific Standard Time,
              > gtg346g@m... writes:
              >
              >
              > >
              > > Well I couldn't come up with anything on the web, but I was
              curious if the
              > > slavic cultures had a specific type of bow? Just a pondering of
              an idle
              > > mind.
              > >
              > > Mikhail Nicholaev
              > > mka Patrick Jarrett
              > >
              >
              > Do you mean bowing to be polite? From your waist down, right hand
              goring from
              > the heart down. The more important the person you are bowing to,
              the lower
              > you go.
              >
              > That is an extrapolation, though -- there are certainly references
              to bowing
              > in various period sources, but what I describe is really an
              authentic Russian
              > post-period bow.
              >
              > Liudmila
              >
              > Liudmila
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Marilee Humason
              ... Russian way is from the waist with arms and hands to the side. Alex, what do you say??? Baroness Anstasia ...
              Message 6 of 14 , Apr 3, 2003
                --- LiudmilaV@... wrote:
                > In a message dated 4/2/2003 8:06:58 PM Pacific
                > Standard Time,
                > gtg346g@... writes:
                >
                >
                > >
                > > Well I couldn't come up with anything on the web,
                > but I was curious if the
                > > slavic cultures had a specific type of bow? Just a
                > pondering of an idle
                > > mind.
                > >
                > > Mikhail Nicholaev
                > > mka Patrick Jarrett
                > >
                >
                > Do you mean bowing to be polite? From your waist
                > down, right hand goring from
                > the heart down. The more important the person you
                > are bowing to, the lower
                > you go.
                > > Liudmila
                >
                > I read that the hand over the heart was Persian. The
                Russian way is from the waist with arms and hands to
                the side.
                Alex, what do you say???
                Baroness Anstasia>
                >


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              • Kinjal of Moravia
                I recall an ancient Thracian practice that could have influnce here,
                Message 7 of 14 , Apr 3, 2003
                  <snipped extensively by moderator. Watch the length of quoted material, folks.>

                  I recall an ancient Thracian practice that could have influnce
                  here, especially Kievan. The thumbs were hooked in the belt or sash
                  and the upper body bent horizontal to the floor. The idea was to
                  present the neck in a completely defenceless state.

                  Kinjal
                • LiudmilaV@aol.com
                  In a message dated 4/3/2003 1:35:11 PM Pacific Standard Time, ... I d like to know what Alex says, too. But I d like to remind you that I happen to be from
                  Message 8 of 14 , Apr 3, 2003
                    In a message dated 4/3/2003 1:35:11 PM Pacific Standard Time,
                    stasiwa@... writes:


                    > > I read that the hand over the heart was Persian. The
                    > Russian way is from the waist with arms and hands to
                    > the side.
                    > Alex, what do you say???
                    > Baroness Anstasia>
                    >

                    I'd like to know what Alex says, too. But I'd like to remind you that I
                    happen to be from there as well :)

                    Liudmila


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Jeanne Papanastasiou
                    For some reason I get a chest type salute not bowing. It does seem weird. Soffya Appollonia Tudja http://www.aeonline.biz/Links.htm Argent, a patriarchal
                    Message 9 of 14 , Apr 4, 2003
                      For some reason I get a chest type salute not bowing. It does seem weird.

                      Soffya Appollonia Tudja
                      http://www.aeonline.biz/Links.htm
                      Argent, a patriarchal cross between three crescent gules on a chief sable
                      three fleur-de-lys Or

                      [Snipped extensively by moderator. Do not include an entire chain of posts in your messages.]
                    • Marilee Humason
                      ... Before you get yourself all worked up, I would remind you that no ones OPINION should be treated as Gospel. Not yours, not mine, not anyones. We have on
                      Message 10 of 14 , Apr 4, 2003
                        --- LiudmilaV@... wrote:
                        > In a message dated 4/3/2003 1:35:11 PM Pacific
                        > Standard Time,
                        > stasiwa@... writes:
                        >
                        >
                        > > > I read that the hand over the heart was Persian.
                        > The
                        > > Russian way is from the waist with arms and hands
                        > to
                        > > the side.
                        > > Alex, what do you say???
                        > > Baroness Anstasia>
                        > >
                        >
                        > I'd like to know what Alex says, too. But I'd like
                        > to remind you that I
                        > happen to be from there as well :)
                        >
                        > Liudmila
                        >
                        Before you get yourself all worked up, I would remind
                        you that no ones OPINION should be treated as Gospel.
                        Not yours, not mine, not anyones. We have on this page
                        my opinion, and your opinion, I only thought to get
                        Alex's opinion because he is there.
                        regards,
                        Baroness Anastasia

                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                        > removed]
                        >
                        >


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                      • Yana
                        ... Please be careful of your tone, and avoid all caps (it means that you are shouting). Also, watch for smilies. They are usually added deliberately,
                        Message 11 of 14 , Apr 4, 2003
                          >Before you get yourself all worked up, I would remind
                          >you that no ones OPINION should be treated as Gospel.
                          >Not yours, not mine, not anyones. We have on this page
                          >my opinion, and your opinion, I only thought to get
                          >Alex's opinion because he is there.
                          >regards,
                          >Baroness Anastasia


                          Please be careful of your tone, and avoid all caps (it means that you are
                          shouting). Also, watch for smilies. They are usually added deliberately,
                          because the author knows what they are saying could be taken as criticism.

                          --Yana, moderator
                        • Dmitriy Ryaboy
                          ... Not Alex, but also a native -- I ve only seen/heard what Liudmila described. Unless there s been a cultural revolution I am not aware of during the last
                          Message 12 of 14 , Apr 4, 2003
                            Baroness Anastasia wrote:
                            > I read that the hand over the heart was Persian. The
                            > Russian way is from the waist with arms and hands to
                            > the side.
                            > Alex, what do you say???
                            > Baroness Anstasia>


                            Not Alex, but also a native -- I've only seen/heard what Liudmila
                            described. Unless there's been a cultural revolution I am not aware of
                            during the last couple of years..

                            From personal experience, one better have a strong lower back if
                            performing this in a hat-heavy region :).

                            I don't think the heel-clicking is appropriate for most of the period
                            due to, well, lack of heels. This hurts when done in leather
                            turnshoes! :)
                            A lot of folks seem to be doing 16th century here, though, it might be
                            ok for that time -- not my period of interest, so I can't give you any
                            input.

                            -Dmitriy
                          • LiudmilaV@aol.com
                            In a message dated 4/4/2003 1:32:50 PM Pacific Standard Time, ... Your Excellency, I might be wrong, but I assumed you wanted Alex s opinion because he is
                            Message 13 of 14 , Apr 4, 2003
                              In a message dated 4/4/2003 1:32:50 PM Pacific Standard Time,
                              stasiwa@... writes:


                              > Before you get yourself all worked up, I would remind
                              > you that no ones OPINION should be treated as Gospel.
                              > Not yours, not mine, not anyones. We have on this page
                              > my opinion, and your opinion, I only thought to get
                              > Alex's opinion because he is there.
                              >

                              Your Excellency,

                              I might be wrong, but I assumed you wanted Alex's opinion because he is
                              Russian. Therefore, I chose to remind you that my opinion is based on being a
                              native of that land as well. I never said it was "Gospel" -- in fact, I said
                              it was an extrapolation. That's why I would also like to know what Alex
                              thinks (once we straightened out polite bowing from archery equipment), since
                              he might have access to some info I can no longer obtain.

                              Liudmila



                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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