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Re: [sig] Gypsies&Skomorokhi in Central/Eastern Europe

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  • Elizabeth Lear
    ... FYI, Skomorokhi did not reach this low status until the 1600s. I don t have info on the two groups interacting, but my article on Skomorokhi is on the web
    Message 1 of 3 , Jan 3, 2003
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      On Fri, Jan 03, 2003 at 12:37:49PM -0800, Alberta wrote:
      >both groups were along the lower end of the social strata, and as such,
      >both were looked down upon and condemned by the church and local
      >governments for many similar reasons.

      FYI, Skomorokhi did not reach this low status until the 1600s.

      I don't have info on the two groups interacting, but my article on
      Skomorokhi is on the web if you want more info on them. It's at
      http://indra.com/~eliz/SCA/skomorokhi2.txt

      I have more research to add to the article, but it's on my list of
      things to do and hasn't risen to the top yet.

      -Yelizaveta
    • MHoll@aol.com
      In a message dated 1/3/2003 3:23:24 PM Central Standard Time, ... I can t give any facts and figures here, but it s always the case: in a sedentary society,
      Message 2 of 3 , Jan 3, 2003
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        In a message dated 1/3/2003 3:23:24 PM Central Standard Time,
        jadedusoleil@... writes:

        > Something I find of interest is the fact that both the Skomorokhi and the
        > Gypsies traveled about and worked as performers, and both groups were along
        > the lower end of the social strata, and as such, both were looked down upon
        > and condemned by the church and local governments for many similar reasons.

        I can't give any facts and figures here, but it's always the case: in a
        sedentary society, those living a nomadic lifestyle will be considered to be
        at the bottom of the ladder. Same goes for the Irish Travellers.

        An exception were the trouveres and troubadours -- but they were more like
        itinerant stars, and they brought news of the settled world -- they were part
        of mainstream society, they had their place and lived by the "normal" rules.

        > While I know it most likely cannot be proven one way or the other, I do
        > wonder if the Skomorokhi and the Gypsies ever interacted...or were they
        > mutually exclusive?

        The skomorokhi were performers. The Gypsies are a people. I don't think they
        were mutually exclusive, but they were different groups. If the skomorokhi
        were non-Gypsy, then in all likelihood the Gypsies wouldn't have allowed them
        into their society as a rule.

        I don't subscribe to the Andrei Rublev-the-movie theory that the skomorokhi
        were always persecuted, or that they represented some kind of
        proto-revolutionary, political-satyrist group. They were performers, and
        while there was probably some persecution at some point (remember the time
        frame we're dealing with: someone persecuting someone else was a fact of
        life), I tend to believe that they simply faded away/died out as their brand
        of performace stopped being so popular.

        Just my opinion.

        Predslava.


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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