Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Translation help

Expand Messages
  • Joseph Belcher
    I’m looking for the correct translation to “strong green wine”. In my research of Russia I have come across the term “strong green wine”. It is
    Message 1 of 22 , May 16, 2013
    • 0 Attachment
      I’m looking for the correct translation to “strong green wine”.

      In my research of Russia I have come across the term “strong green wine”. It is mentioned in the English versions of the bylinas, specifically in Dobrynya and the Dragon. Not being able to read Russian (or Ukranian) I’m not sure of the correct translation.

      I assume the bylinas I find in English (Folk Tales from the Russian and The epic songs of Russia, printed in 1906 and 1913) are translations of earlier printed Cyrillic books. If I can get the original term used in those books I can further my research.

      Thank you to anyone that can help with the translation and/or Slavic language sources.

      -Halbrust



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Alexey Kiyaikin aka Posadnik
      Greetings! Зелено вино, the late-period moonshine. It is also mentioned in the Sadko (пил зелено вино). The ethimology must be explained
      Message 2 of 22 , May 16, 2013
      • 0 Attachment
        Greetings!


        Зелено вино, the late-period moonshine.
        It is also mentioned in the Sadko (пил зелено вино). The ethimology must be explained in the Pokhlyobkin's History of Vodka. AFAIR the explanations, originally it referred to зелье (poison/potion), not зеленый (green).





        Четверг, 16 мая 2013, 17:31 -04:00 от Joseph Belcher <iegrappling@...>:

        >
        >I’m looking for the correct translation to “strong green wine”.
        >
        >In my research of Russia I have come across the term “strong green wine”. It is mentioned in the English versions of the bylinas, specifically in Dobrynya and the Dragon. Not being able to read Russian (or Ukranian) I’m not sure of the correct translation.
        >
        >I assume the bylinas I find in English (Folk Tales from the Russian and The epic songs of Russia, printed in 1906 and 1913) are translations of earlier printed Cyrillic books. If I can get the original term used in those books I can further my research.
        >
        >Thank you to anyone that can help with the translation and/or Slavic language sources.
        >
        >-Halbrust
        >
        >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Joseph Belcher
        Thank you Alexey! I will continue my research, but have another question that may help me along. According to Isabel Hapgood the lays of Vladimir (including
        Message 3 of 22 , May 20, 2013
        • 0 Attachment
          Thank you Alexey!
          I will continue my research, but have another question that may help me along.

          According to Isabel Hapgood the lays of Vladimir (including Dobrynya and the Dragon, but not Sadko) were composed in the 10th-12th century and represent a time between 988 and 1147. This is obviously too early to be vodka, or any other distilled drink.

          If the original 12th century term was Зелено вино, what could it have been?
          Or what could the 12th century term be if it was not Зелено вино?

          -Halbrust

          -----Original Message-----
          From: Alexey Kiyaikin aka Posadnik <Posadnik@...>
          To: sig <sig@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Thu, May 16, 2013 10:27 pm
          Subject: Re: [sig] Translation help





          Greetings!

          Зелено вино, the late-period moonshine.
          It is also mentioned in the Sadko (пил зелено вино). The ethimology must be explained in the Pokhlyobkin's History of Vodka. AFAIR the explanations, originally it referred to зелье (poison/potion), not зеленый (green).

          Четверг, 16 мая 2013, 17:31 -04:00 от Joseph Belcher <iegrappling@...>:
          >
          >
          >I’m looking for the correct translation to “strong green wine”.
          >
          >In my research of Russia I have come across the term “strong green wine”. It is mentioned in the English versions of the bylinas, specifically in Dobrynya and the Dragon. Not being able to read Russian (or Ukranian) I’m not sure of the correct translation.
          >
          >I assume the bylinas I find in English (Folk Tales from the Russian and The epic songs of Russia, printed in 1906 and 1913) are translations of earlier printed Cyrillic books. If I can get the original term used in those books I can further my research.
          >
          >Thank you to anyone that can help with the translation and/or Slavic language sources.
          >
          >-Halbrust
          >
          >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Alexey Kiyaikin aka Posadnik
          Greetings! Actually, the Kievan cycle bylinas were composed in 9 to 14 centuries, Dobrynia & the Serpent being (one of )the oldest. The Green Wine is the
          Message 4 of 22 , May 20, 2013
          • 0 Attachment
            Greetings!


            Actually, the Kievan cycle bylinas were composed in 9 to 14 centuries, Dobrynia & the Serpent being (one of )the oldest. The "Green Wine" is the obvious late-period (and/or post-period) re-edition of the story. All the same, the oldest known published source of Bylinas is afair Kisha Danilov's Songs, about 1740; so there's no "original text" available.
            The original source could refer to meads, beers jr wines, there was not a great variety of alcoholic drinks in Kievan Russia: wines were imported, meads and beers were home-made.


            Понедельник, 20 мая 2013, 12:27 -04:00 от Joseph Belcher <iegrappling@...>:

            >
            >Thank you Alexey!
            >I will continue my research, but have another question that may help me along.
            >
            >According to Isabel Hapgood the lays of Vladimir (including Dobrynya and the Dragon, but not Sadko) were composed in the 10th-12th century and represent a time between 988 and 1147. This is obviously too early to be vodka, or any other distilled drink.
            >
            >If the original 12th century term was Зелено вино, what could it have been?
            >Or what could the 12th century term be if it was not Зелено вино?
            >
            >-Halbrust
            >
            >-----Original Message-----
            >From: Alexey Kiyaikin aka Posadnik < Posadnik@... >
            >To: sig < sig@yahoogroups.com >
            >Sent: Thu, May 16, 2013 10:27 pm
            >Subject: Re: [sig] Translation help
            >
            >Greetings!
            >
            >Зелено вино, the late-period moonshine.
            >It is also mentioned in the Sadko (пил зелено вино). The ethimology must be explained in the Pokhlyobkin's History of Vodka. AFAIR the explanations, originally it referred to зелье (poison/potion), not зеленый (green).
            >
            >Четверг, 16 мая 2013, 17:31 -04:00 от Joseph Belcher < iegrappling@... >:
            >>
            >>
            >>I’m looking for the correct translation to “strong green wine”.
            >>
            >>In my research of Russia I have come across the term “strong green wine”. It is mentioned in the English versions of the bylinas, specifically in Dobrynya and the Dragon. Not being able to read Russian (or Ukranian) I’m not sure of the correct translation.
            >>
            >>I assume the bylinas I find in English (Folk Tales from the Russian and The epic songs of Russia, printed in 1906 and 1913) are translations of earlier printed Cyrillic books. If I can get the original term used in those books I can further my research.
            >>
            >>Thank you to anyone that can help with the translation and/or Slavic language sources.
            >>
            >>-Halbrust
            >>
            >>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >>
            >>
            >
            >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Joseph Belcher
            More questions asked off-list -Halbrust ... From: Alexey Kiyaikin aka Posadnik To: sig Sent: Mon, May 20, 2013 12:41
            Message 5 of 22 , May 23, 2013
            • 0 Attachment
              More questions asked off-list

              -Halbrust

              -----Original Message-----
              From: Alexey Kiyaikin aka Posadnik <Posadnik@...>
              To: sig <sig@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Mon, May 20, 2013 12:41 pm
              Subject: Re[2]: [sig] Translation help




              Greetings!

              Actually, the Kievan cycle bylinas were composed in 9 to 14 centuries, Dobrynia & the Serpent being (one of )the oldest. The "Green Wine" is the obvious late-period (and/or post-period) re-edition of the story. All the same, the oldest known published source of Bylinas is afair Kisha Danilov's Songs, about 1740; so there's no "original text" available.
              The original source could refer to meads, beers jr wines, there was not a great variety of alcoholic drinks in Kievan Russia: wines were imported, meads and beers were home-made.

              Понедельник, 20 мая 2013, 12:27 -04:00 от Joseph Belcher <iegrappling@...>:
              >
              >
              >Thank you Alexey!
              >I will continue my research, but have another question that may help me along.
              >
              >According to Isabel Hapgood the lays of Vladimir (including Dobrynya and the Dragon, but not Sadko) were composed in the 10th-12th century and represent a time between 988 and 1147. This is obviously too early to be vodka, or any other distilled drink.
              >
              >If the original 12th century term was Зелено вино, what could it have been?
              >Or what could the 12th century term be if it was not Зелено вино?
              >
              >-Halbrust
              >
              >-----Original Message-----
              >From: Alexey Kiyaikin aka Posadnik < Posadnik@... >
              >To: sig < sig@yahoogroups.com >
              >Sent: Thu, May 16, 2013 10:27 pm
              >Subject: Re: [sig] Translation help
              >
              >Greetings!
              >
              >Зелено вино, the late-period moonshine.
              >It is also mentioned in the Sadko (пил зелено вино). The ethimology must be explained in the Pokhlyobkin's History of Vodka. AFAIR the explanations, originally it referred to зелье (poison/potion), not зеленый (green).
              >
              >Четверг, 16 мая 2013, 17:31 -04:00 от Joseph Belcher < iegrappling@... >:
              >>
              >>
              >>I’m looking for the correct translation to “strong green wine”.
              >>
              >>In my research of Russia I have come across the term “strong green wine”. It is mentioned in the English versions of the bylinas, specifically in Dobrynya and the Dragon. Not being able to read Russian (or Ukranian) I’m not sure of the correct translation.
              >>
              >>I assume the bylinas I find in English (Folk Tales from the Russian and The epic songs of Russia, printed in 1906 and 1913) are translations of earlier printed Cyrillic books. If I can get the original term used in those books I can further my research.
              >>
              >>Thank you to anyone that can help with the translation and/or Slavic language sources.
              >>
              >>-Halbrust
              >>
              >>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >>
              >>
              >
              >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Joseph Belcher
              I m digging and digging for evidence that doma or domu is the correct pre-1600 term for a Russian household or family. I have several passages from a 1617 book
              Message 6 of 22 , Jun 17, 2013
              • 0 Attachment
                I'm digging and digging for evidence that doma or domu is the correct pre-1600 term for a Russian household or family.

                I have several passages from a 1617 book using the term дома. Is anyone willing to look over some scans and see if any of the uses apply in the way I want/need them to?

                I've attempted using Google translate, but I'm having little to no luck. The images are scanned, and so I can not cut and paste text. Trying to type in the correct letters is not working very well.

                -Halbrust

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Anya Stickney
                I m willing to help. If you are on facebook, you cat post them to the facebook SIG page. That way, multiple people can see them and help. Always good to have
                Message 7 of 22 , Jun 18, 2013
                • 0 Attachment
                  I'm willing to help. If you are on facebook, you cat post them to the
                  facebook SIG page. That way, multiple people can see them and help. Always
                  good to have multiple people's opinions with this sort of thing. Or perhaps
                  you can post them to the file section of this group?

                  Anya


                  On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 4:52 PM, Joseph Belcher <iegrappling@...> wrote:

                  > **
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > I'm digging and digging for evidence that doma or domu is the correct
                  > pre-1600 term for a Russian household or family.
                  >
                  > I have several passages from a 1617 book using the term дома. Is anyone
                  > willing to look over some scans and see if any of the uses apply in the way
                  > I want/need them to?
                  >
                  > I've attempted using Google translate, but I'm having little to no luck.
                  > The images are scanned, and so I can not cut and paste text. Trying to type
                  > in the correct letters is not working very well.
                  >
                  > -Halbrust
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.