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Re: [sig] Re: i need ideas for a dress......

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  • Catherine Olanich Raymond
    ... since i made me sleeves WAY too long (long even for the Rus), he suggested that i hem the sleeve then turn it outwards so it could work as a pocket, to
    Message 1 of 8 , Jun 13, 2011
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      On 06/13/2011 07:23 PM, mustangkar03 wrote:
      > ok, the colors have been chosen (think cheeseheads), and my dad had a suggestion.

      since i made me sleeves WAY too long (long even for the Rus), he
      suggested that i

      hem the sleeve then turn it outwards so it could work as a pocket, to
      quote him,

      "to hold your hankies". I think it would work, if i hid the seam and
      embroidered

      over it so it would look almost like a cuff. WOuld this be period?


      I don't know of any evidence that they actually made "pockets" like
      this, but from your description it would *look* like a decorated period
      sleeve, since the "pocket" would be unobtrusive. If you need such a
      pocket, that might would be a good way to work one in. (Though if
      you're planning to put something small but heavy in the "pocket", be
      careful not to whack yourself in the body or head!)


      --
      Cathy Raymond
      cathy@...

      "Beware how you take away hope from another human being."
      --Oliver Wendell Holmes
    • Elaine Manyoki
      Serafina, Doing that with your sleeves is very like the sleeves of a Hungarian Szur.  It is a herdsman s coat that also doubles as a horse blanket, tent, and
      Message 2 of 8 , Jun 13, 2011
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        Serafina,
        Doing that with your sleeves is very like the sleeves of a Hungarian Szur.  It is a herdsman's coat that also doubles as a horse blanket, tent, and picnic carrier.  If you look at a photo or pattern for a szur, the sleeves are sewn shut and decorated, and this was done to carry the owner's food and other needed items.  It seems like that would be period, since the szur is about six or seven hundred years old in design.
        Katya



        ________________________________
        From: mustangkar03 <mustangkar03@...>
        To: sig@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Monday, June 13, 2011 7:23 PM
        Subject: [sig] Re: i need ideas for a dress......


         
        ok, the colors have been chosen (think cheeseheads), and my dad had a suggestion. since i made me sleeves WAY too long (long even for the Rus), he suggested that i hem the sleeve then turn it outwards so it could work as a pocket, to quote him, "to hold your hankies". I think it would work, if i hid the seam and embroidered over it so it would look almost like a cuff. WOuld this be period?

        Serafima

        --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Catherine Olanich Raymond <cathy@...> wrote:
        >
        > On 06/07/2011 09:35 PM, mustangkar03 wrote:
        > > Greetings! I'm artistically stuck trying to come up with a new idea for a dress.
        >
        > I've made a Rus-style dress in the past but it didn't come out like i
        > had hoped (brocade nearly made me CRAZY).
        >
        > so anyways, i'm hoping to make a new dress before my local event new
        > weekend. I've got just about every color in
        >
        > the spectrum except white, and i'm trying to come up with some good
        > color combos that aren't completely off-base.
        >
        > I really don't want to go with the back-updresses cuz they aren't my
        > persona and everyone has seen them before.
        >
        > I'm early Russian around 9th century if that helps any.
        > >
        > > does anyone have any ideas to help out a new (almost) crazy russian gal?
        >
        >
        > You're familiar with Lisa Kies's pages on Rus clothing, right?
        >
        > This one gives information about the various layers for women in early Rus:
        >
        > http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser/Russia/KWC.html#Layers
        >
        > You haven't mentioned whether your persona is noble or peasant. If you
        > don't want to muck with brocade, you might want to shoot for a city
        > dweller or wealthy peasant. This subpage gives some basic information
        > about such class distinctions:
        >
        > http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser/Russia/KWC.html#Class
        >
        > Colors...well, you can never go wrong with red for a Rus character. You
        > said you don't have anything white, and a white linen underdress is
        > period for Rus women, except perhaps the nobles/royalty (who might well
        > use silk for the purpose). Red and blue were favorites, but in general
        > the primary colors could be obtained with available dyes:
        >
        >
        > http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser/Russia/KRCfabricdye.html
        >
        > My own Rus costume is white and blue; I should get a picture taken while
        > I'm wearing it so I can post it.
        >
        > Lisa has pictures of Rus costumes she wears, which might inspire you:
        >
        > http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser/Russia/wardrobe.html
        >
        > You can find print sources for further information, but this should get
        > you started. Have fun!
        >
        >
        > --
        > Cathy Raymond
        > cathy@...
        >
        > "Beware how you take away hope from another human being."
        > --Oliver Wendell Holmes
        >




        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Quokkaqueen
        WOuld this be period? Without knowing what time period you are looking at (although I m assuming with mention of brocades, probably 16th
        Message 3 of 8 , Jun 14, 2011
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          <<snip>>
          WOuld this be period?
          <<snip>>

          Without knowing what time period you are looking at (although I'm assuming with mention of brocades, probably 16th century-ish?), there seems to have been a western-european-influenced fashion for hanging sleeves.

          eg.
          http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v244/quokkaqueen/image_comparison/danzigcomparison3.jpg
          http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v244/quokkaqueen/image_comparison/danzigcomparison4.jpg

          Russian isn't my area of expertise at all, but ultra-long hanging sleeves also show up in photos of the 1903 Russian costume ball:
          http://www.kingandwilson.com/1903CostumeBallBook/index.htm
          And in this translation of Sofya's, about 15th century dress:
          http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser/Russia/PartizanWoman.html

          The second part of the question, if they closed the sleeves since they were decorative? Not a clue, sorry.

          Asfridhr
        • Catherine Olanich Raymond
          ... there seems to have been a western-european-influenced fashion for hanging sleeves. She ll have to specify, but I thought she meant not the second pair of
          Message 4 of 8 , Jun 14, 2011
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            On 06/14/2011 06:47 AM, Quokkaqueen wrote:
            > <<snip>>
            > WOuld this be period?
            > <<snip>>
            >
            > Without knowing what time period you are looking at (although I'm assuming with mention of brocades, probably 16th century-ish?),

            there seems to have been a western-european-influenced fashion for
            hanging sleeves.

            She'll have to specify, but I thought she meant not the second pair of
            "hanging sleeves" seen in the 16th c or so, but the long sleeves of
            Kievan Rus that are usually braceleted up, but can be let down to cover
            the hand. I can't hunt for a picture right now, but I'll try to get one
            later.



            --
            Cathy Raymond
            cathy@...

            "Beware how you take away hope from another human being."
            --Oliver Wendell Holmes
          • mustangkar03
            OK, since i m kinda pressed for time and have been staring at the sleeves trying to figure out how i could make it work, I ve decided to put these on the back
            Message 5 of 8 , Jun 14, 2011
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              OK, since i'm kinda pressed for time and have been staring at the sleeves trying to figure out how i could make it work, I've decided to put these on the back burner for now. I think when the snows come and all the homework has been done and i'm sitting around twiddling my thumbs, i'll try it again.

              Thank you to everyone who have given me advice on this. I greatly appreciate it. :) Hope to see some of you Easterners at Vinland Raids this weekend!

              YIS,
              Serafima

              --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Catherine Olanich Raymond <cathy@...> wrote:
              >
              > On 06/14/2011 06:47 AM, Quokkaqueen wrote:
              > > <<snip>>
              > > WOuld this be period?
              > > <<snip>>
              > >
              > > Without knowing what time period you are looking at (although I'm assuming with mention of brocades, probably 16th century-ish?),
              >
              > there seems to have been a western-european-influenced fashion for
              > hanging sleeves.
              >
              > She'll have to specify, but I thought she meant not the second pair of
              > "hanging sleeves" seen in the 16th c or so, but the long sleeves of
              > Kievan Rus that are usually braceleted up, but can be let down to cover
              > the hand. I can't hunt for a picture right now, but I'll try to get one
              > later.
              >
              >
              >
              > --
              > Cathy Raymond
              > cathy@...
              >
              > "Beware how you take away hope from another human being."
              > --Oliver Wendell Holmes
              >
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