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Re: Need advice on persona

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  • hl_katalena
    Vitasha, thank you! I will start looking for a good last name. The links you gave me are a great start. My russian persona is going to be much easier than I
    Message 1 of 19 , Apr 23, 2011
      Vitasha, thank you! I will start looking for a good last name. The links you gave me are a great start. My russian persona is going to be much easier than I thought. The help I'm finding here with the SIG group is WONDERFUL! :)

      Katalena
    • Lisa Kies
      The doch is useful to distinguish you from Vitasha Ivanova zhena, i.e. daugher of... vs wife of... A woman s name usually changed when she got married. Sofya
      Message 2 of 19 , Apr 23, 2011
        The doch' is useful to distinguish you from Vitasha Ivanova zhena, i.e.
        daugher of... vs wife of...

        A woman's name usually changed when she got married.
        Sofya
        On Sat, Apr 23, 2011 at 7:21 PM, Amy Tubbs <ivanova.doch@...> wrote:

        > I love working on period names. It seems to have been a convention of the
        > earlier period to have only had a first and last name (as we would call
        > them
        > today). My name is Vitasha Ivanova doch'. First name: Vitasha. Last
        > name:
        > Ivanova. doch' is an ending used to signify that I am the daughter...which
        > seems kind of redundant to me, but looks nice anyways.
        >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Amy Tubbs
        So, before I married, I was Vitasha Ivanova doch . Now that I am married, should I be Vitasha Ivanova doch Ilina zhena (wife of Ilia) or even Vitasha Ilina
        Message 3 of 19 , Apr 23, 2011
          So, before I married, I was Vitasha Ivanova doch'. Now that I am married,
          should I be Vitasha Ivanova doch' Ilina zhena (wife of Ilia) or even Vitasha
          Ilina zhena? Would it be allowable in period to be Vitasha Ivanova doch'
          but sometimes be referred to as Vitasha Ilina zhena?

          -- Vitasha

          On Sat, Apr 23, 2011 at 5:59 PM, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:

          >
          >
          > The doch' is useful to distinguish you from Vitasha Ivanova zhena, i.e.
          > daugher of... vs wife of...
          >
          > A woman's name usually changed when she got married.
          > Sofya
          >
          > On Sat, Apr 23, 2011 at 7:21 PM, Amy Tubbs <ivanova.doch@...> wrote:
          >
          > > I love working on period names. It seems to have been a convention of the
          > > earlier period to have only had a first and last name (as we would call
          > > them
          > > today). My name is Vitasha Ivanova doch'. First name: Vitasha. Last
          > > name:
          > > Ivanova. doch' is an ending used to signify that I am the
          > daughter...which
          > > seems kind of redundant to me, but looks nice anyways.
          > >
          > >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • hl_katalena
          How would Wife of Edward look? Katalena
          Message 4 of 19 , Apr 23, 2011
            How would "Wife of Edward" look?

            Katalena

            --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:
            >
            > The doch' is useful to distinguish you from Vitasha Ivanova zhena, i.e.
            > daugher of... vs wife of...
            >
            > A woman's name usually changed when she got married.
            > Sofya
          • Lisa Kies
            Yes, yes, and yes. Wickenden discusses some of the possibilities, some of them quite unwieldy. http://heraldry.sca.org/paul/zgrammar.html And perhaps I should
            Message 5 of 19 , Apr 24, 2011
              Yes, yes, and yes. Wickenden discusses some of the possibilities, some of
              them quite unwieldy.
              http://heraldry.sca.org/paul/zgrammar.html

              And perhaps I should have said a woman's name _often_ changed after marriage
              instead of "usually."

              Sofya
              On Sat, Apr 23, 2011 at 8:15 PM, Amy Tubbs <ivanova.doch@...> wrote:

              > So, before I married, I was Vitasha Ivanova doch'. Now that I am married,
              > should I be Vitasha Ivanova doch' Ilina zhena (wife of Ilia) or even
              > Vitasha
              > Ilina zhena? Would it be allowable in period to be Vitasha Ivanova doch'
              > but sometimes be referred to as Vitasha Ilina zhena?
              >
              > -- Vitasha
              >
              > On Sat, Apr 23, 2011 at 5:59 PM, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:
              >
              > >
              > >
              > > The doch' is useful to distinguish you from Vitasha Ivanova zhena, i.e.
              > > daugher of... vs wife of...
              > >
              > > A woman's name usually changed when she got married.
              > >


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Lisa Kies
              Oh, that s a tough one. Edward is a Catholic saint, but he doesn t seem to be on my lists of Eastern Orthodox saints. In modern Russian, the name is Eduard,
              Message 6 of 19 , Apr 24, 2011
                Oh, that's a tough one. Edward is a Catholic saint, but he doesn't seem to
                be on my lists of Eastern Orthodox saints. In modern Russian, the name
                is Eduard, which would give us Katalena Eduardova zhena.

                I'm having trouble finding a medieval Russian equivalent of Edward. Going
                to the original Old English for inspiration... we see there are lots of
                different spellings (http://eagle.cch.kcl.ac.uk:8080/pase/persons/index.html ),
                none of which seem to be found in Wickenden, but here are some names that
                are evocative:

                Edviga... (although that's more like a different Anglo-Saxon name)
                Ed'.... Edor... Edrei
                Iador... Iadrei... Iabred... Idar... Idui... Obara... Obrad...
                Odor... Odur... Odo... Odoi... Odol... Ovad... Otrad...
                Udo... Udr... Uvar...
                Vardei... Vardamai...
                So you could also use one of the above as the basis of your Russian
                "patronymic" name.

                I just kept my father's name for my "Russian" name - Sofya Iakovleva
                doch' (James' daughter) instead of Sofya Sifridova zhena (Sifrid's wife). I
                would be known to my husband's people (Germans) as Sophia Sifridin.

                So there are lots of options. :-)

                Sofya

                On Sat, Apr 23, 2011 at 9:42 PM, hl_katalena <hl_katalena@...> wrote:

                > How would "Wife of Edward" look?
                >
                > Katalena
                >
                > --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:
                > >
                > > The doch' is useful to distinguish you from Vitasha Ivanova zhena, i.e.
                > > daugher of... vs wife of...
                > >
                > > A woman's name usually changed when she got married.
                > > Sofya
                >
                >
                >


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • hl_katalena
                I thought Wife of Edward would be easier than Daughter of Elton . :) Thank you for the information. It gives me something to work on. Katalena
                Message 7 of 19 , Apr 24, 2011
                  I thought "Wife of Edward" would be easier than "Daughter of Elton". :)

                  Thank you for the information. It gives me something to work on.

                  Katalena


                  --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Oh, that's a tough one. Edward is a Catholic saint, but he doesn't seem to
                  > be on my lists of Eastern Orthodox saints. In modern Russian, the name
                  > is Eduard, which would give us Katalena Eduardova zhena.
                  >
                  > I'm having trouble finding a medieval Russian equivalent of Edward. Going
                  > to the original Old English for inspiration... we see there are lots of
                  > different spellings (http://eagle.cch.kcl.ac.uk:8080/pase/persons/index.html ),
                  > none of which seem to be found in Wickenden, but here are some names that
                  > are evocative:
                  >
                  > Edviga... (although that's more like a different Anglo-Saxon name)
                  > Ed'.... Edor... Edrei
                  > Iador... Iadrei... Iabred... Idar... Idui... Obara... Obrad...
                  > Odor... Odur... Odo... Odoi... Odol... Ovad... Otrad...
                  > Udo... Udr... Uvar...
                  > Vardei... Vardamai...
                  > So you could also use one of the above as the basis of your Russian
                  > "patronymic" name.
                  >
                  > I just kept my father's name for my "Russian" name - Sofya Iakovleva
                  > doch' (James' daughter) instead of Sofya Sifridova zhena (Sifrid's wife). I
                  > would be known to my husband's people (Germans) as Sophia Sifridin.
                  >
                  > So there are lots of options. :-)
                  >
                  > Sofya
                  >
                • Lisa Kies
                  *laugh* Yeah, I think a Russianized Eduard would be easier than Elton. Of course, there are often middle names to work from, too... Sofya ... [Non-text
                  Message 8 of 19 , Apr 24, 2011
                    *laugh*

                    Yeah, I think a Russianized Eduard would be easier than Elton. Of course,
                    there are often middle names to work from, too...

                    Sofya

                    On Sun, Apr 24, 2011 at 10:22 AM, hl_katalena <hl_katalena@...> wrote:

                    > I thought "Wife of Edward" would be easier than "Daughter of Elton". :)
                    >
                    > Thank you for the information. It gives me something to work on.
                    >
                    > Katalena
                    >
                    >
                    > --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > Oh, that's a tough one. Edward is a Catholic saint, but he doesn't seem
                    > to
                    > > be on my lists of Eastern Orthodox saints. In modern Russian, the name
                    > > is Eduard, which would give us Katalena Eduardova zhena.
                    > >
                    > > I'm having trouble finding a medieval Russian equivalent of Edward.
                    > Going
                    > > to the original Old English for inspiration... we see there are lots of
                    > > different spellings (
                    > http://eagle.cch.kcl.ac.uk:8080/pase/persons/index.html ),
                    > > none of which seem to be found in Wickenden, but here are some names that
                    > > are evocative:
                    > >
                    > > Edviga... (although that's more like a different Anglo-Saxon name)
                    > > Ed'.... Edor... Edrei
                    > > Iador... Iadrei... Iabred... Idar... Idui... Obara... Obrad...
                    > > Odor... Odur... Odo... Odoi... Odol... Ovad... Otrad...
                    > > Udo... Udr... Uvar...
                    > > Vardei... Vardamai...
                    > > So you could also use one of the above as the basis of your Russian
                    > > "patronymic" name.
                    > >
                    > > I just kept my father's name for my "Russian" name - Sofya Iakovleva
                    > > doch' (James' daughter) instead of Sofya Sifridova zhena (Sifrid's wife).
                    > I
                    > > would be known to my husband's people (Germans) as Sophia Sifridin.
                    > >
                    > > So there are lots of options. :-)
                    > >
                    > > Sofya
                    >


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • hl_katalena
                    Middle names...good idea! :) How about daughter of Hoover, Earl, or Phillips? My grandmother came up with some unusual name combinations for her kids. I
                    Message 9 of 19 , Apr 25, 2011
                      Middle names...good idea! :)

                      How about daughter of Hoover, Earl, or Phillips? My grandmother came up with some unusual name combinations for her kids. I often wondered...What Was She Thinking?! *laugh*

                      Katalena

                      --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > *laugh*
                      >
                      > Yeah, I think a Russianized Eduard would be easier than Elton. Of course,
                      > there are often middle names to work from, too...
                      >
                      > Sofya
                    • Lisa Kies
                      Ah, Phillip! Now we ve got a real Russian name! In Wickenden s 3rd edition: Filipp Iaskominov 1393. also Filipets, Filipka, Filipko, Filka, Filko, Fili,
                      Message 10 of 19 , Apr 25, 2011
                        Ah, Phillip! Now we've got a real Russian name!

                        In Wickenden's 3rd edition: Filipp Iaskominov 1393. also Filipets,
                        Filipka, Filipko, Filka, Filko, Fili, Filip, Filipei, Fip, Pilip...

                        Feminine patronymic forms can be created from any of the above. The ones
                        documented in Wickenden: Filipova, Filipovskaia, Filippovna.

                        Sofya


                        On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 11:59 AM, hl_katalena <hl_katalena@...> wrote:

                        > Middle names...good idea! :)
                        >
                        > How about daughter of Hoover, Earl, or Phillips? My grandmother came up
                        > with some unusual name combinations for her kids. I often wondered...What
                        > Was She Thinking?! *laugh*
                        >
                        > Katalena
                        >
                        > --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > *laugh*
                        > >
                        > > Yeah, I think a Russianized Eduard would be easier than Elton. Of
                        > course,
                        > > there are often middle names to work from, too...
                        > >
                        > > Sofya
                        >
                        >
                        >


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Amy Tubbs
                        Pick some that you like, and then get your local herald to try to pronounce them. My patronymic (Ivanova) is constantly being mispronounced. Haven t any of
                        Message 11 of 19 , Apr 25, 2011
                          Pick some that you like, and then get your local herald to try to pronounce
                          them. My patronymic (Ivanova) is constantly being mispronounced. Haven't
                          any of the heralds watched Babylon 5?!? ;-)
                          -- Vitasha

                          On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 7:18 PM, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:

                          >
                          >
                          > Ah, Phillip! Now we've got a real Russian name!
                          >
                          > In Wickenden's 3rd edition: Filipp Iaskominov 1393. also Filipets,
                          > Filipka, Filipko, Filka, Filko, Fili, Filip, Filipei, Fip, Pilip...
                          >
                          > Feminine patronymic forms can be created from any of the above. The ones
                          > documented in Wickenden: Filipova, Filipovskaia, Filippovna.
                          >
                          > Sofya
                          >
                          >
                          > On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 11:59 AM, hl_katalena <hl_katalena@...>
                          > wrote:
                          >
                          > > Middle names...good idea! :)
                          > >
                          > > How about daughter of Hoover, Earl, or Phillips? My grandmother came up
                          > > with some unusual name combinations for her kids. I often wondered...What
                          > > Was She Thinking?! *laugh*
                          > >
                          > > Katalena
                          > >
                          > > --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > *laugh*
                          > > >
                          > > > Yeah, I think a Russianized Eduard would be easier than Elton. Of
                          > > course,
                          > > > there are often middle names to work from, too...
                          > > >
                          > > > Sofya
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          >
                          >


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • hl_katalena
                          THANK YOU!! That is wonderful. Now it will be easy to find the right last name. I cannot thank you enough. Katalena
                          Message 12 of 19 , Apr 26, 2011
                            THANK YOU!! That is wonderful. Now it will be easy to find the right last name. I cannot thank you enough.

                            Katalena

                            --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > Ah, Phillip! Now we've got a real Russian name!
                            >
                            > In Wickenden's 3rd edition: Filipp Iaskominov 1393. also Filipets,
                            > Filipka, Filipko, Filka, Filko, Fili, Filip, Filipei, Fip, Pilip...
                            >
                            > Feminine patronymic forms can be created from any of the above. The ones
                            > documented in Wickenden: Filipova, Filipovskaia, Filippovna.
                            >
                            > Sofya
                            >
                            >
                            > On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 11:59 AM, hl_katalena <hl_katalena@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > > Middle names...good idea! :)
                            > >
                            > > How about daughter of Hoover, Earl, or Phillips? My grandmother came up
                            > > with some unusual name combinations for her kids. I often wondered...What
                            > > Was She Thinking?! *laugh*
                            > >
                            > > Katalena
                            > >
                            > > --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Kies <lkies319@> wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > *laugh*
                            > > >
                            > > > Yeah, I think a Russianized Eduard would be easier than Elton. Of
                            > > course,
                            > > > there are often middle names to work from, too...
                            > > >
                            > > > Sofya
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            >
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >
                          • hl_katalena
                            Very good idea! It would be wise to hear what the name sounds like before taking one. I will do that. :) Katalena
                            Message 13 of 19 , Apr 26, 2011
                              Very good idea! It would be wise to hear what the name sounds like before taking one. I will do that. :)

                              Katalena


                              --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Amy Tubbs <ivanova.doch@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Pick some that you like, and then get your local herald to try to pronounce
                              > them. My patronymic (Ivanova) is constantly being mispronounced. Haven't
                              > any of the heralds watched Babylon 5?!? ;-)
                              > -- Vitasha
                              >
                              > On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 7:18 PM, Lisa Kies <lkies319@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > Ah, Phillip! Now we've got a real Russian name!
                              > >
                              > > In Wickenden's 3rd edition: Filipp Iaskominov 1393. also Filipets,
                              > > Filipka, Filipko, Filka, Filko, Fili, Filip, Filipei, Fip, Pilip...
                              > >
                              > > Feminine patronymic forms can be created from any of the above. The ones
                              > > documented in Wickenden: Filipova, Filipovskaia, Filippovna.
                              > >
                              > > Sofya
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 11:59 AM, hl_katalena <hl_katalena@...>
                              > > wrote:
                              > >
                              > > > Middle names...good idea! :)
                              > > >
                              > > > How about daughter of Hoover, Earl, or Phillips? My grandmother came up
                              > > > with some unusual name combinations for her kids. I often wondered...What
                              > > > Was She Thinking?! *laugh*
                              > > >
                              > > > Katalena
                              > > >
                              > > > --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Kies <lkies319@> wrote:
                              > > > >
                              > > > > *laugh*
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Yeah, I think a Russianized Eduard would be easier than Elton. Of
                              > > > course,
                              > > > > there are often middle names to work from, too...
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Sofya
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > >
                              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                              >
                              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              >
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