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Re: [sig] Names around 10th Century Novgorod

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  • Paul W Goldschmidt
    If you haven t tried it already, you might want to check out this page: http://www.goldschp.net/archive/archive.html In Service, Paul Wickenden of Thanet
    Message 1 of 6 , Jul 16, 2009
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      If you haven't tried it already, you might want to check out this page:

      http://www.goldschp.net/archive/archive.html


      In Service,
      Paul Wickenden of Thanet

      At 12:11 AM 7/16/2009, you wrote:
      >Heilsa!
      >
      >Please forgive my ignorance, if this information exists elsewhere,
      >please point me towards it. The husband and I are looking for names
      >for ourselves, from a late 9th and early 10th century, preferably
      >around Novgorod and the surrounding Slav tribes. I don't think we
      >will ever lose the names we are using now, we've been called them
      >for too long, but we both feel we've finally decided on time/region
      >and would like to finalize it with official, documentable, names. I
      >have been perusing Paul Wickendan's very expansive dictionary of
      >names, but wondering if there might be a better/simpler way than
      >clicking through pages. I really don't know even where to begin.
      >
      >Any help would be greatly appreciated.
      >
      >Thanks in advance!
      >Brenna Haldana & Thorrinn Eikanskaldisson (a bit too "Viking", eh? :p)
    • Jenna
      Yes, thank you, however I now have grammar questions! I have enough issues with English grammar, so Russian is a doozy. ;) I would like to achieve Vladimir
      Message 2 of 6 , Jul 17, 2009
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        Yes, thank you, however I now have grammar questions! I have enough issues with English grammar, so Russian is a doozy. ;)

        I would like to achieve "Vladimir son of Dmitrii Bratovich", which version is correct/best?

        Vladimir Dmitr'ev Bratovich
        Vladimir syn Dmitrii Bratovich
        Vladimir Dmitrego Bratovich
        Vladimir Dmitr'evich
        Vladimir Dmitr'evich Bratovich
        Vladimir Dmitr'ev syn Bratovich

        Also, what would be the best form for "Ilariia the Baker, wife of Vladimir Dmitr'evich" (or whichever of the above are correct)?

        Ilariia Kolachnikova Vladimiria zhena Dmitr'eva
        Ilariia Vladimiria zhena Dmitr'eva Kolachnikova
        Ilariia Vladimiria zhena Dmitr'ev

        or something else?

        I greatly appreciate the help!

        Thanks,
        Brenna
      • Paul W Goldschmidt
        First of all, let s be clear that we are not doing 10th century or Novgorodian names. If you want a period 10th century Novgorod name, you two would just be
        Message 3 of 6 , Jul 18, 2009
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          First of all, let's be clear that we are not doing 10th century or
          Novgorodian names.

          If you want a period 10th century Novgorod name, you two would just
          be Vladimir and Ilariia, but the SCA will want a byname.

          So, instead, let's talk about 16th century Moscovite names....


          At 11:28 PM 7/17/2009, you wrote:
          >Yes, thank you, however I now have grammar questions! I have enough
          >issues with English grammar, so Russian is a doozy. ;)
          >
          >I would like to achieve "Vladimir son of Dmitrii Bratovich", which
          >version is correct/best?
          >
          >Vladimir Dmitr'ev Bratovich
          >Vladimir syn Dmitrii Bratovich
          >Vladimir Dmitrego Bratovich
          >Vladimir Dmitr'evich
          >Vladimir Dmitr'evich Bratovich
          >Vladimir Dmitr'ev syn Bratovich

          Of the examples above, I like the last one (Vladimir Dmitr'ev syn
          Bratovich) best. #4 (Vladimir Dmitr'evich) is grammatically correct
          and appropriate for 14th century Novgorod or 10th century Kiev.

          >Also, what would be the best form for "Ilariia the Baker, wife of
          >Vladimir Dmitr'evich" (or whichever of the above are correct)?
          >
          >Ilariia Kolachnikova Vladimiria zhena Dmitr'eva
          >Ilariia Vladimiria zhena Dmitr'eva Kolachnikova
          >Ilariia Vladimiria zhena Dmitr'ev

          I'm assuming that Vladimir is the baker (in period, Ilariia would
          hardly want to advertise the idea of being a free agent, especially
          if she is already attaching herself to her husband), so I like option
          #2 the best. One could layer more on it, but I think it tells the
          story sufficiently well.

          Without the baker-bit, you could go with Ilariia Vladimira zhena
          Dmitr'eva or Ilariia Vladimira zhena Dmitr'eva syna Bratovicha.


          In Service,
          Paul Wickenden
        • Jenna
          Understandable, sounds like a plan :) Where to begin? Again, thank you very much for the help & advice.
          Message 4 of 6 , Jul 19, 2009
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            Understandable, sounds like a plan :)

            Where to begin?

            Again, thank you very much for the help & advice.

            --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, Paul W Goldschmidt <goldschp@...> wrote:
            >
            > First of all, let's be clear that we are not doing 10th century or
            > Novgorodian names.
            >
            > If you want a period 10th century Novgorod name, you two would just
            > be Vladimir and Ilariia, but the SCA will want a byname.
            >
            > So, instead, let's talk about 16th century Moscovite names....
          • spmaiorca@cox.net
            ... Is a name and patricnomic
            Message 5 of 6 , Jul 20, 2009
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              ---- Jenna <jenna.baranowski@...> wrote:
              > Yes, thank you, however I now have grammar questions! I have enough issues with English grammar, so Russian is a doozy. ;)
              >
              > I would like to achieve "Vladimir son of Dmitrii Bratovich", which version is correct/best?
              >

              > Vladimir Dmitr'evich
              >
              Is a name and patricnomic
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