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Sorry for the nag

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  • Rosie (aka Nawojka)
    I m just checking, is no one able to help me with a paragraph of translation from Polish to English? It s really a very small paragraph! Also, has anyone any
    Message 1 of 7 , Nov 13, 2007
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      I'm just checking, is no one able to help me with a paragraph of
      translation from Polish to English? It's really a very small paragraph!

      Also, has anyone any ideas about finding a "period" text for the byname
      of Opalinska (with tick thingy over the n)? Obviously as I don't know
      Polish that's going to make it tricky. I have a source from a modern
      history book, but I'm told that isn't acceptable.

      Polish heraldry: other than the spiffy website
      http://www.szlachta.org/heraldry.htm can anyone recommend anything? I'm
      trying to find out if the charge I'm wanting to use, the lekawika was
      in use before 1600. I tried emailing the creator of the website, but no
      answer.

      Congratulations to the new Laurel!!

      Rosie- who hopes to actually have something to CONTRIBUTE one day!
    • quokkaqueen
      ... Is the problem with the modern history book that it s written in Polish, or that it might be a modern interpretation of that byname? It isn t the be all
      Message 2 of 7 , Nov 14, 2007
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        --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, "Rosie (aka Nawojka)" <Rosie_0801@...> wrote:
        > Also, has anyone any ideas about finding a "period" text for the byname
        > of Opalinska (with tick thingy over the n)? Obviously as I don't know
        > Polish that's going to make it tricky. I have a source from a modern
        > history book, but I'm told that isn't acceptable.

        Is the problem with the modern history book that it's written in
        Polish, or that it might be a modern interpretation of that byname?


        It isn't the be all and end all, but Wikipedia may be able to help.

        Jan Opaliński was a Polish nobleman, who had two daughters, Anna and
        Zofia.
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Opali%C5%84ski_%281546-1598%29

        So, the daughters were known as Anna and Zofia Opalińska
        See: http://www.bkpan.poznan.pl/htbins/osoby.pl?06211936
        (The link Symbolae has a translation of what the coloured dots and
        abbreviations mean.)

        The above link is from the The Kórnik Library of the Polish Academy of
        Sciences. So it might be a bit more authoritative in terms of
        websites, and it comes with an English translation.

        As for books that would have this sort of information, I might have a
        book on the Polish-Lithuanian commonwealth that could help, so I'll
        pull it out and look it up for you.

        ~Asfridhr
      • quokkaqueen
        Sorry, I m very forgetful. There are two books available in Australia that you might be able to ILL: Schlimpert, Gerhard, _Slawische Personennamen in
        Message 3 of 7 , Nov 14, 2007
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          Sorry, I'm very forgetful. There are two books available in Australia
          that you might be able to ILL:

          Schlimpert, Gerhard, _Slawische Personennamen in Mittelalterlichen
          Quellen zur Deutschen Geschichte_ (Berlin: Akademie-Verlag, 1978)
          at the National Library of Australia

          and

          Taszycki, Witold (ed.), _Sl/ownik Staropolskich Nazw Osobowych_
          (Dictionary of Old Polish Personal Names), vols. I-VII (Wrocl/aw:
          Zakl/ad Narodowy Imienia Ossolin'skich, Polska Akademia Nauk,
          1965-1987)
          Which is also at the National Library and Monash uni.

          The second book looks promising, since in some recent St. Gabriel
          reports, they were using that book to show patronymics.

          ~Asfridhr, the very forgetful.

          --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, "Rosie (aka Nawojka)" <Rosie_0801@...> wrote:
          > Also, has anyone any ideas about finding a "period" text for the byname
          > of Opalinska (with tick thingy over the n)? Obviously as I don't know
          > Polish that's going to make it tricky. I have a source from a modern
          > history book, but I'm told that isn't acceptable.
          >
        • quokkaqueen
          I think I may have just gone from helpful to annoying, but I went on a search for references to lekawikas . From
          Message 4 of 7 , Nov 14, 2007
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            I think I may have just gone from helpful to annoying, but I went on a
            search for references to lekawikas'.

            From 1642,http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grafika:Orbis_Poloni-1.jpg

            16th century -- this guy had a lekawika as his charge, however I don't
            know if he aquired this posthumously or if he was using it at the time.
            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerzy_Jaz%C5%82owiecki

            A seal from 1343 (Text ref. only)
            http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Plains/2739/herbarz-ludzie-a.html

            From the 13th century? http://www.magnuski.org/abdank.html
            (It looks like this is the 1228 reference to a lekawika that wikipedia
            talks about.)

            1109 - talks about the Abdank herby, which was previously known as the
            Skubow
            http://www.polishroots.org/herbarz/abdank.htm

            So, there are lots of references to Lekawicas, but nothing in a book
            yet. I'm sure someone else will be able to help.

            ~Asfridhr


            --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, "Rosie (aka Nawojka)" <Rosie_0801@...> wrote:
            I'm
            > trying to find out if the charge I'm wanting to use, the lekawika was
            > in use before 1600.
          • Pan Zygmunt Nadratowski
            Rosie, It was a common naming practice to indicate a female noble by having a at the end of the name. So, Opalinska is perfectly fine. However, there are
            Message 5 of 7 , Nov 14, 2007
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              Rosie,

              It was a common naming practice to indicate a female noble by having 'a' at
              the end of the name. So, 'Opalinska' is perfectly fine. However, there are
              *some* grammar rules which I see, but can not yet understand, which prevent
              this from happening 100% of the time (e.g., Barbara Radziwill is not
              "Radziwilla" in any of the texts I have seen).

              It would really be handy if some of our list members fluent in Polish could
              comment.
              *Most* of the time, if the name ends in -ski, you can indicate gender by
              using -ska if you are a female.
              --
              Pan Zygmunt Nadratowski
              "Most people live their lives as if they had another one in the bank" - Ben
              Irwin
              "I do not fear death or pain, only a cage. To stay behind bars, until use
              and old age accept them, and all chance of valor has gone beyond recall or
              desire." Eowyn, The Return of the King
              Servant of His Grace Sir Dag Thorgrimsson and Master Mordok Rostovskogo
              SCA Polish Culture Resource: http://www.plcommonwealth.org


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Rosie (aka Nawojka)
              ... Hi Asfridhr, The problem with the by-name is that it s that it might be a modern interpretation. I mean you can plug the name into Google and come up with
              Message 6 of 7 , Nov 14, 2007
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                > Is the problem with the modern history book that it's written in
                > Polish, or that it might be a modern interpretation of that byname?
                >
                Hi Asfridhr,
                The problem with the by-name is that it's that it might be a modern
                interpretation. I mean you can plug the name into Google and come up
                with hits galore that are all spelled the same way, from every time
                period, but our Lady Herald isn't going to accept that. The problem
                with the first name is that it's in Polish.
                See you at the picnic if you're coming! It's on this Saturday!
                :)
                Rosie
              • Amy Tubbs
                Sorry, no Polish. Spanish, Portugues, Italian, and German - yes. Polish, no. ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                Message 7 of 7 , Nov 14, 2007
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                  Sorry, no Polish. Spanish, Portugues, Italian, and German - yes. Polish,
                  no.

                  On 11/13/07, Rosie (aka Nawojka) <Rosie_0801@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > I'm just checking, is no one able to help me with a paragraph of
                  > translation from Polish to English? It's really a very small paragraph!
                  >
                  > Also, has anyone any ideas about finding a "period" text for the byname
                  > of Opalinska (with tick thingy over the n)? Obviously as I don't know
                  > Polish that's going to make it tricky. I have a source from a modern
                  > history book, but I'm told that isn't acceptable.
                  >
                  > Polish heraldry: other than the spiffy website
                  > http://www.szlachta.org/heraldry.htm can anyone recommend anything? I'm
                  > trying to find out if the charge I'm wanting to use, the lekawika was
                  > in use before 1600. I tried emailing the creator of the website, but no
                  > answer.
                  >
                  > Congratulations to the new Laurel!!
                  >
                  > Rosie- who hopes to actually have something to CONTRIBUTE one day!
                  >
                  >
                  >


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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