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RE: Re: [sig] early rubakha/sorochka in silk

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  • L.M. Kies
    Poklon ot Sofya! ... What an amazing notion. This L.N. Gumiliov seems to have a wonderfully colorful perspective on life in early Rus. From another source:
    Message 1 of 4 , Feb 6, 2007
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      Poklon ot Sofya!

      >>From: elfkinau
      >>
      >>Im trying to find out if it is known if silk was used for
      >>rubakha/sorochka in the 10th - 11th century by boyarinas?
      >>Thankyou so much
      >>Tamara
      >
      >------- Original Message -------
      >From : aldo[mailto:turanomar@...]
      >
      >Of course yes! But only the élite classes did as silk was considered (this is L.N. Gumiliov's idea) a kind of profilactica >against scabies which could be easily infected from pigs! It was totally imported from Constantinoples.
      >Aldo

      What an amazing notion. This L.N. Gumiliov seems to have a wonderfully colorful perspective on life in early Rus.

      From another source:
      "The over garment of princesses and boyarinas in 10-13th cent. was sewn of eastern embroidered silk ("pavolok") or tightly woven vorsistoj (napped) fabric with gold or silver threads, similar to velvet ("aksamita"). The Arab travelor of the 10th cent., Ibn-Fadlan, noted that noble women of the Slavs wore the "xilu" (oriental robe) - a upper silk garment. Such a garment is mentioned in the chronicles under description of holiday clothes of women and is called "rizy". (Pushkareva89) "
      http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser/Russia/KRCfabric.html (this webpage is in the process of being re-organized to make it a little easier to navigate)

      The following quotes pertain to the 9th-13th cent from my translation of Rabinovich's Drevyaya Odezheda Narodov Vostochnoj Evropy:

      "Imported (mainly Byzantine or eastern) material presented itself mainly in the form of silk or gold fabric, aksamite, pavoloki [аксамит, паволока] and others. They were very expensive and accessible only to wealthy people. Not for nothing did the “Lay of Igor’s Campaign” record among the most valuable booty, along with slaves, “zlato and pavoloki and expensive oksamit” (SPI, p. 10-11). But even for city dwellers and peasants, as we will see below, could be found, as decoration of clothing, smaller pieces of these fabrics, often with local embroidery (Fekhner, 1976, p. 222-225)."

      "Rubakha, sorochitsa[рубахаь сорочица] were for many sometimes the only object of clothing. It was sewn of linen, or thin wool (tsatri [цатры] –goat fluff [козъего пуха], ascetics–monks wore even rough vasyanitsu of horse hair), for the wealthy it could be even of silk material. "
      http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser/Russia/rabinovich86a.html

      K tvoim uslugam,

      Sofya

      --------------------------------------------------------------------
      Lisa M. Kies, MD aka Lady Sofya la Rus
      Mason City, IA aka Shire of Heraldshill, Calontir
      http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser
      "Si no necare, sana."
      --------------------------------------------------------------------



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • aldo
      Biyu chelom Sofie! Thanks a lot for your information which is at the moment very useful to me as I am collecting materials for an article upon clothes of
      Message 2 of 4 , Feb 6, 2007
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        Biyu chelom Sofie! Thanks a lot for your information which is at the moment very useful to me as I am collecting materials for an article upon clothes of Eastern Slavs and I find it hard to avail of something really serious in the net! Especially in Italian the information is very poor! I could not find any copy of Rabinovitch's work even tho I know it from many mentions in many sources whereas Pushkareva's is in my hand but the period she covers is not really the early Middle Ages. Thanks again.
        Anyhow as to silk profilactic I would like to emphasize that also Ibn Sina (Avicenne) mentions it.
        Ciao

        Aldo
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: L.M. Kies
        To: sig@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 1:51 AM
        Subject: RE: Re: [sig] early rubakha/sorochka in silk


        Poklon ot Sofya!

        >>From: elfkinau
        >>
        >>Im trying to find out if it is known if silk was used for
        >>rubakha/sorochka in the 10th - 11th century by boyarinas?
        >>Thankyou so much
        >>Tamara
        >
        >------- Original Message -------
        >From : aldo[mailto:turanomar@...]
        >
        >Of course yes! But only the élite classes did as silk was considered (this is L.N. Gumiliov's idea) a kind of profilactica >against scabies which could be easily infected from pigs! It was totally imported from Constantinoples.
        >Aldo

        What an amazing notion. This L.N. Gumiliov seems to have a wonderfully colorful perspective on life in early Rus.

        From another source:
        "The over garment of princesses and boyarinas in 10-13th cent. was sewn of eastern embroidered silk ("pavolok") or tightly woven vorsistoj (napped) fabric with gold or silver threads, similar to velvet ("aksamita"). The Arab travelor of the 10th cent., Ibn-Fadlan, noted that noble women of the Slavs wore the "xilu" (oriental robe) - a upper silk garment. Such a garment is mentioned in the chronicles under description of holiday clothes of women and is called "rizy". (Pushkareva89) "
        http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser/Russia/KRCfabric.html (this webpage is in the process of being re-organized to make it a little easier to navigate)

        The following quotes pertain to the 9th-13th cent from my translation of Rabinovich's Drevyaya Odezheda Narodov Vostochnoj Evropy:

        "Imported (mainly Byzantine or eastern) material presented itself mainly in the form of silk or gold fabric, aksamite, pavoloki [аксамит, паволока] and others. They were very expensive and accessible only to wealthy people. Not for nothing did the “Lay of Igor’s Campaign” record among the most valuable booty, along with slaves, “zlato and pavoloki and expensive oksamit” (SPI, p. 10-11). But even for city dwellers and peasants, as we will see below, could be found, as decoration of clothing, smaller pieces of these fabrics, often with local embroidery (Fekhner, 1976, p. 222-225)."

        "Rubakha, sorochitsa[рубахаь сорочица] were for many sometimes the only object of clothing. It was sewn of linen, or thin wool (tsatri [цатры] –goat fluff [козъего пуха], ascetics–monks wore even rough vasyanitsu of horse hair), for the wealthy it could be even of silk material. "
        http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser/Russia/rabinovich86a.html

        K tvoim uslugam,

        Sofya

        ----------------------------------------------------------
        Lisa M. Kies, MD aka Lady Sofya la Rus
        Mason City, IA aka Shire of Heraldshill, Calontir
        http://www.strangelove.net/~kieser
        "Si no necare, sana."
        ----------------------------------------------------------

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





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