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Re: [sig] Seam Finishes

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  • Sfandra
    Thanks for all the great advice. I think I was just frustrated, because I have a tendency towards heavy fabrics -- heavy linens, decorator cottons etc, -- and
    Message 1 of 17 , May 10, 2006
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      Thanks for all the great advice. I think I was just
      frustrated, because I have a tendency towards heavy
      fabrics -- heavy linens, decorator cottons etc, -- and
      that leads to bulky seams!

      I'm going to try flat felling more, instead of french.
      And larger seam allowances too. :-)

      --Sfandra



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      Kingdom of the East
      ******************
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    • Sfandra
      Thanks for all the great advice. I think I was just frustrated, because I have a tendency towards heavy fabrics -- heavy linens, decorator cottons etc, -- and
      Message 2 of 17 , May 10, 2006
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        Thanks for all the great advice. I think I was just
        frustrated, because I have a tendency towards heavy
        fabrics -- heavy linens, decorator cottons etc, -- and
        that leads to bulky seams!

        I'm going to try flat felling more, instead of french.
        And larger seam allowances too. :-)

        --Sfandra



        ******************
        Sfandra Dmitrieva iz Chernigova
        Kingdom of the East
        ******************
        Never 'pearl' your butt.

        __________________________________________________
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      • Rick Orli
        Do you really take a heavy wool and boil it? what are you making, shoe soles? That happened at my house by accident last year when my size 44 sweater was
        Message 3 of 17 , May 11, 2006
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          Do you really take a heavy wool and boil it? what are you making,
          shoe soles? That happened at my house by accident last year when my
          size 44 sweater was accidently washed in hot water, and came out size
          4T. The thought that passed though my mind was, ah! so this is how
          to get suitable material to make felt boots.

          But, if the wool is more typically thick,and the construction press
          is done right, the only time I have really had trouble is if a coat I
          had loaned out was machine washed, treatment no wool coat deserves.
          for that matter, wool coats should be very seldom washed, wool does
          not absorb sweat and oils and aromatics like cotton, and if allowed
          to air well will have just the right, er, quality, for the 16-17th
          C.
          -Rick

          --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, "Lente" <lente@...> wrote:
          >
          > that's what I did on my long wool coat, but I have found since that
          my wool
          > is so thick (prewashed 3x's in hot) the seam allowances will not
          lay flat so
          > now I am going back and doing a herringbone (or catchstitch) on the
          inside
          > down each side of the seam to keep the seam allowances flat. since
          I'm using
          > a matching color in sewing thread its not showing on the outside,
          not
          > certain it will show on the outside. I also used the same stich for
          the hem,
          > keeps it all nice and flat so I don't catch the hem on stuff.
          >
          > Kathws
          >
          > Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 7:38 AM
          > Subject: RE : Re: [sig] Seam Finishes
          >
          >
          > > The majority of my tailoring is with coats, using heavy wool cloth
          > > that is so felted that you need to inspect closely to see
          evidence of
          > > the weave. If its the good stuff it does not need any sort of
          edge
          > > finishing, (nor did they do so in period, at least with soldier's
          > > coats, although I don't know one way or the other for rich men's
          > > clothes - but in truth it does not need it. just needs to be
          pressed
          > > flat.)
          >
        • historian@reconstructinghistory.com
          Actually if your seam allowances are so thick that they are not at all ravelly, you can trim the seeam allowances down as close to the seam as you can get
          Message 4 of 17 , May 11, 2006
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            Actually if your seam allowances are so thick that they are not at all
            ravelly, you can trim the seeam allowances down as close to the seam
            as you can get without cutting the seam stitching. Many extant wool
            garments made from thick textiles have barely any seam allowances at
            all (1/8" and they stand straight up), and some are even butted
            together instead of folded over into a seam.

            The seam finish you're doing, Kathws, will certainly hold the seam
            allowances open and flat, but there will still be bulk. If you don't
            want that bulk, you can trim it without much fear of unravelling in
            this case.

            Kass
            Reconstructing History
            http://reconstructinghistory.com

            Quoting Rick Orli <orlirva@...>:

            > Do you really take a heavy wool and boil it? what are you making,
            > shoe soles? That happened at my house by accident last year when my
            > size 44 sweater was accidently washed in hot water, and came out size
            >
            > 4T. The thought that passed though my mind was, ah! so this is how
            > to get suitable material to make felt boots.
            >
            > But, if the wool is more typically thick,and the construction press
            > is done right, the only time I have really had trouble is if a coat I
            >
            > had loaned out was machine washed, treatment no wool coat deserves.
            >
            > for that matter, wool coats should be very seldom washed, wool does
            > not absorb sweat and oils and aromatics like cotton, and if allowed
            > to air well will have just the right, er, quality, for the 16-17th
            > C.
            > -Rick
            >
            > --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, "Lente" <lente@...> wrote:
            >>
            >> that's what I did on my long wool coat, but I have found since that
            >
            > my wool
            >> is so thick (prewashed 3x's in hot) the seam allowances will not
            > lay flat so
            >> now I am going back and doing a herringbone (or catchstitch) on the
            >
            > inside
            >> down each side of the seam to keep the seam allowances flat. since
            > I'm using
            >> a matching color in sewing thread its not showing on the outside,
            > not
            >> certain it will show on the outside. I also used the same stich for
            >
            > the hem,
            >> keeps it all nice and flat so I don't catch the hem on stuff.
            >>
            >> Kathws
            >>
            >> Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 7:38 AM
            >> Subject: RE : Re: [sig] Seam Finishes
            >>
            >>
            >> > The majority of my tailoring is with coats, using heavy wool
            > cloth
            >> > that is so felted that you need to inspect closely to see
            > evidence of
            >> > the weave. If its the good stuff it does not need any sort of
            > edge
            >> > finishing, (nor did they do so in period, at least with soldier's
            >> > coats, although I don't know one way or the other for rich men's
            >> > clothes - but in truth it does not need it. just needs to be
            > pressed
            >> > flat.)
          • Tim Nalley
            Most of the serious 14C people felt thier wool, most especially for their hose. The hoods are quite thick as are their winter wieght coate hardies, but not
            Message 5 of 17 , May 11, 2006
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              Most of the serious 14C people felt thier wool, most
              especially for their hose. The hoods are quite thick
              as are their winter wieght coate hardies, but not
              felted x4! They count on a third shrinkage on average.
              'dok

              --- Rick Orli <orlirva@...> wrote:

              > Do you really take a heavy wool and boil it? what
              > are you making,
              > shoe soles? That happened at my house by accident
              > last year when my
              > size 44 sweater was accidently washed in hot water,
              > and came out size
              > 4T. The thought that passed though my mind was, ah!
              > so this is how
              > to get suitable material to make felt boots.
              >
              > But, if the wool is more typically thick,and the
              > construction press
              > is done right, the only time I have really had
              > trouble is if a coat I
              > had loaned out was machine washed, treatment no wool
              > coat deserves.
              > for that matter, wool coats should be very seldom
              > washed, wool does
              > not absorb sweat and oils and aromatics like
              > cotton, and if allowed
              > to air well will have just the right, er, quality,
              > for the 16-17th
              > C.
              > -Rick
              >
              > --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, "Lente" <lente@...>
              > wrote:
              > >
              > > that's what I did on my long wool coat, but I have
              > found since that
              > my wool
              > > is so thick (prewashed 3x's in hot) the seam
              > allowances will not
              > lay flat so
              > > now I am going back and doing a herringbone (or
              > catchstitch) on the
              > inside
              > > down each side of the seam to keep the seam
              > allowances flat. since
              > I'm using
              > > a matching color in sewing thread its not showing
              > on the outside,
              > not
              > > certain it will show on the outside. I also used
              > the same stich for
              > the hem,
              > > keeps it all nice and flat so I don't catch the
              > hem on stuff.
              > >
              > > Kathws
              > >
              > > Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 7:38 AM
              > > Subject: RE : Re: [sig] Seam Finishes
              > >
              > >
              > > > The majority of my tailoring is with coats,
              > using heavy wool cloth
              > > > that is so felted that you need to inspect
              > closely to see
              > evidence of
              > > > the weave. If its the good stuff it does not
              > need any sort of
              > edge
              > > > finishing, (nor did they do so in period, at
              > least with soldier's
              > > > coats, although I don't know one way or the
              > other for rich men's
              > > > clothes - but in truth it does not need it. just
              > needs to be
              > pressed
              > > > flat.)
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >


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            • historian@reconstructinghistory.com
              Tim, The 4X Rick experienced is because he shrunk a sweater (which is knit), not something woven, which won t shrink nearly as much. =) Rick, They aren t
              Message 6 of 17 , May 11, 2006
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                Tim,

                The 4X Rick experienced is because he shrunk a sweater (which is
                knit), not something woven, which won't shrink nearly as much. =)

                Rick,

                They aren't boiling their wool as much as they are "shocking" it with
                a hot wash and cold rinse in the washing machine. While this doesn't
                exactly full the wool as it would have been fulled in the 14th
                century, it thickens modern wool to the point where it more closely
                resembles medieval wool and doesn't ravel, so you can leave your hems
                unsewn and do the seam finishes as they were done in period without
                fear of your clothing fraying.

                Kass
                Reconstructing History
                http://reconstructinghistory.com

                Quoting Tim Nalley <mordakus@...>:

                > Most of the serious 14C people felt thier wool, most
                > especially for their hose. The hoods are quite thick
                > as are their winter wieght coate hardies, but not
                > felted x4! They count on a third shrinkage on average.
                > 'dok
                >
                > --- Rick Orli <orlirva@...> wrote:
                >
                >> Do you really take a heavy wool and boil it? what
                >> are you making,
                >> shoe soles? That happened at my house by accident
                >> last year when my
                >> size 44 sweater was accidently washed in hot water,
                >> and came out size
                >> 4T. The thought that passed though my mind was, ah!
                >> so this is how
                >> to get suitable material to make felt boots.
                >>
                >> But, if the wool is more typically thick,and the
                >> construction press
                >> is done right, the only time I have really had
                >> trouble is if a coat I
                >> had loaned out was machine washed, treatment no wool
                >> coat deserves.
                >> for that matter, wool coats should be very seldom
                >> washed, wool does
                >> not absorb sweat and oils and aromatics like
                >> cotton, and if allowed
                >> to air well will have just the right, er, quality,
                >> for the 16-17th
                >> C.
                >> -Rick
                >>
                >> --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, "Lente" <lente@...>
                >> wrote:
                >> >
                >> > that's what I did on my long wool coat, but I have
                >> found since that
                >> my wool
                >> > is so thick (prewashed 3x's in hot) the seam
                >> allowances will not
                >> lay flat so
                >> > now I am going back and doing a herringbone (or
                >> catchstitch) on the
                >> inside
                >> > down each side of the seam to keep the seam
                >> allowances flat. since
                >> I'm using
                >> > a matching color in sewing thread its not showing
                >> on the outside,
                >> not
                >> > certain it will show on the outside. I also used
                >> the same stich for
                >> the hem,
                >> > keeps it all nice and flat so I don't catch the
                >> hem on stuff.
                >> >
                >> > Kathws
                >> >
                >> > Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 7:38 AM
                >> > Subject: RE : Re: [sig] Seam Finishes
                >> >
                >> >
                >> > > The majority of my tailoring is with coats,
                >> using heavy wool cloth
                >> > > that is so felted that you need to inspect
                >> closely to see
                >> evidence of
                >> > > the weave. If its the good stuff it does not
                >> need any sort of
                >> edge
                >> > > finishing, (nor did they do so in period, at
                >> least with soldier's
                >> > > coats, although I don't know one way or the
                >> other for rich men's
                >> > > clothes - but in truth it does not need it. just
                >> needs to be
                >> pressed
                >> > > flat.)
                >> >
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >
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              • Lente
                Okay I just saw this message. I started out with 100% wool that I bought at hancocks several years back, I think it was a plain weave (call it a jacket weight)
                Message 7 of 17 , May 11, 2006
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                  Okay I just saw this message. I started out with 100% wool that I bought at
                  hancocks several years back, I think it was a plain weave (call it a jacket
                  weight) that was 5 1/2 yds by 60" wide. And yes I meant to full the wool,
                  basically I washed it in the hottest water my washer does three times, I
                  didn't dry it between washes, just pulled it out of the washer to get the
                  twists out then put it right back in. After that I tossed it in the dryer
                  and dried the wool until dry, probably a couple of hours with lots of
                  checking to clean out the lint trap. After all that the wool ended up being
                  4 7/8 yds by 45" wide with ripply edges which did make me figure out a new
                  layout using the unshrunk selvage edges, I ended up putting all of them
                  along the back seam and one the shoulder seams of the sleeves. I then made
                  it into a full length coat since I don't like cloaks; it also works great as
                  an extra layer on the air mattress. Since it is so bulky if I need to wash
                  it I will probably do it the bathtub with cold water. I have had to get some
                  juice my kids spilled on it out once and when I looked closely at it the
                  juice had just set on the surface and dried all goey, so it really was more
                  of a rinse out in the shower, but it took a week of hanging to dry fully.

                  This isn't the first piece of wool I have washed. Some of the things I have
                  found out washing wool are these: Plain weave fulls the best, don't EVER do
                  a wool crepe unless your looking for a really dense peice that will have
                  shrunk a lot (2 1/2 yds by 60" down to 32" by 36"), a twill that I have
                  prewashed shrunk the smallest amount about 4 inches in the length and
                  nothing in the width, got a little fuzzy but that is about all. When you
                  have your garment made up from that point on if washing your wool garment in
                  a washing machine use the gentle/hand wash cycle in cold water only. Don't
                  be surprised if when your wool is dry clean if the dye changes, I had one
                  that changed from tan to grey, I understand the dry clean fabrics don't
                  alwasy have a washing safe dye used on them.

                  for felting boots from wool roving go check outthe renaissance tailor site,
                  she has a tutorial on making boots, making boots from wool yardage might
                  entail sewing them as lether boots are.

                  Kathws

                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "Rick Orli" <orlirva@...>
                  To: <sig@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 1:39 PM
                  Subject: Re: [sig] Seam Finishes


                  Do you really take a heavy wool and boil it? what are you making,
                  shoe soles? That happened at my house by accident last year when my
                  size 44 sweater was accidently washed in hot water, and came out size
                  4T. The thought that passed though my mind was, ah! so this is how
                  to get suitable material to make felt boots.

                  But, if the wool is more typically thick,and the construction press
                  is done right, the only time I have really had trouble is if a coat I
                  had loaned out was machine washed, treatment no wool coat deserves.
                  for that matter, wool coats should be very seldom washed, wool does
                  not absorb sweat and oils and aromatics like cotton, and if allowed
                  to air well will have just the right, er, quality, for the 16-17th
                  C.
                  -Rick

                  --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, "Lente" <lente@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > that's what I did on my long wool coat, but I have found since that
                  my wool
                  > is so thick (prewashed 3x's in hot) the seam allowances will not
                  lay flat so
                  > now I am going back and doing a herringbone (or catchstitch) on the
                  inside
                  > down each side of the seam to keep the seam allowances flat. since
                  I'm using
                  > a matching color in sewing thread its not showing on the outside,
                  not
                  > certain it will show on the outside. I also used the same stich for
                  the hem,
                  > keeps it all nice and flat so I don't catch the hem on stuff.
                  >
                  > Kathws
                • Tim Nalley
                  Hey, thanks for the tips! I have all this second hand as I m a dyed in the wool Russian but I had planed to fill in the shallow spots in my wardrobe with
                  Message 8 of 17 , May 12, 2006
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                    Hey, thanks for the tips! I have all this second hand
                    as I'm a dyed in the wool Russian but I had planed to
                    fill in the shallow spots in my wardrobe with leather,
                    linen and wool this year! This will really help!
                    'dok

                    --- historian@... wrote:

                    > Tim,
                    >
                    > The 4X Rick experienced is because he shrunk a
                    > sweater (which is
                    > knit), not something woven, which won't shrink
                    > nearly as much. =)
                    >
                    > Rick,
                    >
                    > They aren't boiling their wool as much as they are
                    > "shocking" it with
                    > a hot wash and cold rinse in the washing machine.
                    > While this doesn't
                    > exactly full the wool as it would have been fulled
                    > in the 14th
                    > century, it thickens modern wool to the point where
                    > it more closely
                    > resembles medieval wool and doesn't ravel, so you
                    > can leave your hems
                    > unsewn and do the seam finishes as they were done in
                    > period without
                    > fear of your clothing fraying.
                    >
                    > Kass
                    > Reconstructing History
                    > http://reconstructinghistory.com
                    >
                    > Quoting Tim Nalley <mordakus@...>:
                    >
                    > > Most of the serious 14C people felt thier wool,
                    > most
                    > > especially for their hose. The hoods are quite
                    > thick
                    > > as are their winter wieght coate hardies, but not
                    > > felted x4! They count on a third shrinkage on
                    > average.
                    > > 'dok
                    > >
                    > > --- Rick Orli <orlirva@...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > >> Do you really take a heavy wool and boil it?
                    > what
                    > >> are you making,
                    > >> shoe soles? That happened at my house by
                    > accident
                    > >> last year when my
                    > >> size 44 sweater was accidently washed in hot
                    > water,
                    > >> and came out size
                    > >> 4T. The thought that passed though my mind was,
                    > ah!
                    > >> so this is how
                    > >> to get suitable material to make felt boots.
                    > >>
                    > >> But, if the wool is more typically thick,and the
                    > >> construction press
                    > >> is done right, the only time I have really had
                    > >> trouble is if a coat I
                    > >> had loaned out was machine washed, treatment no
                    > wool
                    > >> coat deserves.
                    > >> for that matter, wool coats should be very seldom
                    > >> washed, wool does
                    > >> not absorb sweat and oils and aromatics like
                    > >> cotton, and if allowed
                    > >> to air well will have just the right, er,
                    > quality,
                    > >> for the 16-17th
                    > >> C.
                    > >> -Rick
                    > >>
                    > >> --- In sig@yahoogroups.com, "Lente" <lente@...>
                    > >> wrote:
                    > >> >
                    > >> > that's what I did on my long wool coat, but I
                    > have
                    > >> found since that
                    > >> my wool
                    > >> > is so thick (prewashed 3x's in hot) the seam
                    > >> allowances will not
                    > >> lay flat so
                    > >> > now I am going back and doing a herringbone (or
                    > >> catchstitch) on the
                    > >> inside
                    > >> > down each side of the seam to keep the seam
                    > >> allowances flat. since
                    > >> I'm using
                    > >> > a matching color in sewing thread its not
                    > showing
                    > >> on the outside,
                    > >> not
                    > >> > certain it will show on the outside. I also
                    > used
                    > >> the same stich for
                    > >> the hem,
                    > >> > keeps it all nice and flat so I don't catch the
                    > >> hem on stuff.
                    > >> >
                    > >> > Kathws
                    > >> >
                    > >> > Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 7:38 AM
                    > >> > Subject: RE : Re: [sig] Seam Finishes
                    > >> >
                    > >> >
                    > >> > > The majority of my tailoring is with coats,
                    > >> using heavy wool cloth
                    > >> > > that is so felted that you need to inspect
                    > >> closely to see
                    > >> evidence of
                    > >> > > the weave. If its the good stuff it does not
                    > >> need any sort of
                    > >> edge
                    > >> > > finishing, (nor did they do so in period, at
                    > >> least with soldier's
                    > >> > > coats, although I don't know one way or the
                    > >> other for rich men's
                    > >> > > clothes - but in truth it does not need it.
                    > just
                    > >> needs to be
                    > >> pressed
                    > >> > > flat.)
                    > >> >
                    > >>
                    > >>
                    > >>
                    > >>
                    > >>
                    > >>
                    > >
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                    >


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                    And if you aren t sure you want the effect that fulling will have on wool, try washing swatches of your wool first. Something like a 9 by 9 square should work
                    Message 9 of 17 , May 12, 2006
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                      And if you aren't sure you want the effect that fulling will have on wool,
                      try washing swatches of your wool first. Something like a 9 by 9 square
                      should work fine, half that size might work fine also. I will be probably
                      trying this with some tan coat weight wool that I had bought to make a wool
                      mongol coat for my lord out of; he has since decided for him that will be
                      too much so a chamois flannel coat is in the works. So now I am thinking I
                      will end up using the coat wool to make coats for our 2 kids in the future.
                      Since it is a coat weight and possibly was labeled dry clean (I've had it
                      for 4 years or so) I will use some swatches to test for shrinkage and color
                      loss in both hot, warm and cold water cycles; I'm planning for at least 3
                      swatches.

                      Kathws


                      Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 8:39 AM
                      Subject: Re: [sig] Seam Finishes


                      > Hey, thanks for the tips! I have all this second hand
                      > as I'm a dyed in the wool Russian but I had planed to
                      > fill in the shallow spots in my wardrobe with leather,
                      > linen and wool this year! This will really help!
                      > 'dok
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