Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

FW: [object-technology] [Jeff Sutherland's Object Technology Web Site] Agile Development: Reforming Project Management

Expand Messages
  • Ken Schwaber
    ... From: Jeff Sutherland [mailto:jeff.sutherland@computer.org] Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 4:13 PM To: object-technology@yahoogroups.com Subject:
    Message 1 of 4 , Oct 11, 2002
    • 0 Attachment
       
      -----Original Message-----
      From: Jeff Sutherland [mailto:jeff.sutherland@...]
      Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 4:13 PM
      To: object-technology@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [object-technology] [Jeff Sutherland's Object Technology Web Site] Agile Development: Reforming Project Management


      Hal Malcomber has an interesting blog on "Reforming Project Management" that focuses on lean project delivery. If you run projects you might want to be reading this. Here is an interesting recent comment that explains why SCRUM avoids GANT charts. They are guaranteed to make agile projects late!

      "Experienced project managers will tell you the critical path moves on a project. Why? Tasks don’t start and finish as represented in the project schedule. This would be fine if all the performers for critical path tasks were always available to perform on the project, but this is not the case. In most organizations people are working on more than one project at a time or project work is in addition to their normal work responsibilities. This creates the situation where they must manage priorities – “Do I spend my time on this or on that?”

      "We don’t know all of what must be done. Oftentimes ad hoc work (those tasks that seem to arise in the course of doing the other work) encompasses as much time as the planned work of the project. To the extent that this ad hoc work requires the same resources as the work on the plan we see projects get behind. Performing this work often shifts the critical path.

      "Task durations therefore are probabilistic. They will range from times that are as short as the actual time applied performing the task to as long as multiples of the task times depending on how much waiting time and distraction time is incurred. Projects by their nature make it difficult to gauge those probability distributions because each project is unique. Our only avenue is to manage the project to minimize the variability."

      --
      Posted by Jeff Sutherland to Jeff Sutherland's Object Technology Web Site at 10/7/2002 2:54:45 PM

      Powered by Blogger Pro

      To Post a message, send it to:   object-technology@...

      To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: object-technology-unsubscribe@...


      Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
    • Mike Cohn
      I don t see anything in the text below that means Gantt charts suddenly become completely worthless. It is just a matter of knowing what value to attribute to
      Message 2 of 4 , Oct 11, 2002
      • 0 Attachment

        I don’t see anything in the text below that means Gantt charts suddenly become completely worthless. It is just a matter of knowing what value to attribute to them and knowing what a Gantt does and does not tell you.

         

        If someone is on the critical path of a project and is also on other projects then move him off one of the projects. Clark and Wheelwright have great metrics on how horrible multitasking is and with Scrum in general people are told to be on or off a Scrum team. (Even so, old teams have questions, etc. that impinge upon the ideal situation).

         

        I’ve always interpreted Scrum as being all about managing priorities already so I don’t see the use of Gantt charts as creating the need to manage priorities.

         

        The last paragraph in this quote is the best and it is totally true. Yes, task durations do range but:

        a)       if the task is on the critical path (the only type of tasks that matter) then if there is “waiting time” your project is already in trouble

        b)       projects are unique but many tasks on a project are not that unique and can be estimated within a range (not a point estimate) with sufficient accuracy as to be useful.

         

        Goldratt’s work on “Theory of Constraints” / “Critical Chain” totally addresses these concerns. A Gantt chart that is created with an eye toward the critical chain addresses these criticisms. If you use ranges of estimates, feeding buffers and project buffers there is no reason a Gantt chart makes an agile project late. The MISUSE of Gantt charts will make an agile project late.

         

        All this being said—it’s been months since I’ve made a Gantt chart but when doing the initial planning on a project I find Critical Chain-driven Gantt charts useful and so far they haven’t led to late projects.

         

        --Mike

         

         

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Ken Schwaber [mailto:ken.schwaber@...]
        Sent:
        Friday, October 11, 2002 11:34 AM
        To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [scrumdevelopment] FW: [object-technology] [Jeff Sutherland's Object Technology Web Site] Agile Development: Reforming Project Management

         

         

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Jeff Sutherland [mailto:jeff.sutherland@...]
        Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 4:13 PM
        To: object-technology@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [object-technology] [Jeff Sutherland's Object Technology Web Site] Agile Development: Reforming Project Management


        Hal Malcomber has an interesting blog on "Reforming Project Management" that focuses on lean project delivery. If you run projects you might want to be reading this. Here is an interesting recent comment that explains why SCRUM avoids GANT charts. They are guaranteed to make agile projects late!

        "Experienced project managers will tell you the critical path moves on a project. Why? Tasks don’t start and finish as represented in the project schedule. This would be fine if all the performers for critical path tasks were always available to perform on the project, but this is not the case. In most organizations people are working on more than one project at a time or project work is in addition to their normal work responsibilities. This creates the situation where they must manage priorities – “Do I spend my time on this or on that?”

        "We don’t know all of what must be done. Oftentimes ad hoc work (those tasks that seem to arise in the course of doing the other work) encompasses as much time as the planned work of the project. To the extent that this ad hoc work requires the same resources as the work on the plan we see projects get behind. Performing this work often shifts the critical path.

        "Task durations therefore are probabilistic. They will range from times that are as short as the actual time applied performing the task to as long as multiples of the task times depending on how much waiting time and distraction time is incurred. Projects by their nature make it difficult to gauge those probability distributions because each project is unique. Our only avenue is to manage the project to minimize the variability."

        --
        Posted by Jeff Sutherland to Jeff Sutherland's Object Technology Web Site at 10/7/2002 2:54:45 PM

         

      • Mary Poppendieck
        Hi Mike, I read Hal s Blog on Reforming Project Management, and I also find it excellent, as Jeff says. I think in the construction industry, where Hal comes
        Message 3 of 4 , Oct 11, 2002
        • 0 Attachment
          Hi Mike,

          I read Hal's Blog on Reforming Project Management, and I also find
          it excellent, as Jeff says. I think in the construction industry,
          where Hal comes from, the real problem is that too many people try
          to drive daily work from a Gantt Chart. We don't drive daily word
          from such a chart with Scrum either.

          Mary Poppendieck
        • Mike Cohn
          Agreed--I don t come anywhere close to using a Gantt chart to drive daily activities. I do use it to try to find the critical chain in a project and then I use
          Message 4 of 4 , Oct 11, 2002
          • 0 Attachment
            Agreed--I don't come anywhere close to using a Gantt chart to drive
            daily activities. I do use it to try to find the critical chain in a
            project and then I use that as part of the macro-planning process. Even
            on agile projects there can be dependencies between tasks that can delay
            a project. These types of things are not hard to find with just the
            tiniest bit of upfront consideration.

            I also checked. My most recent Gantt chart was January 25 and outlined 6
            sprints for a project predicted to end on 7/19 (which actually shipped
            to its beta sites on 7/17). So--I hope no one thinks I'm Gantt-happy; I
            just don't write them off entirely.

            --Mike

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Mary Poppendieck [mailto:mary@...]
            Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 9:19 PM
            To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [scrumdevelopment] Re: FW: [object-technology] [Jeff
            Sutherland's Object Technology Web Site] Agile Development: Reforming
            Project Management

            Hi Mike,

            I read Hal's Blog on Reforming Project Management, and I also find
            it excellent, as Jeff says. I think in the construction industry,
            where Hal comes from, the real problem is that too many people try
            to drive daily work from a Gantt Chart. We don't drive daily word
            from such a chart with Scrum either.

            Mary Poppendieck



            To Post a message, send it to: scrumdevelopment@...
            To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
            scrumdevelopment-unsubscribe@...

            Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
            http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.