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Scrum Applied to General Management

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  • Michael Wollin
    I m looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management. To be clear, it would be great to have references for just
    Message 1 of 16 , Nov 30, 2011
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      I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management.  To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects. 

      To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]." 

      I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example. 

      Thanks.

      Michael
    • Bob
      Hi, You may wish to read, The Leader s Guide to Radical Management: Reinventing the Workplace for the 21st Century , by Stephen Dennings. Has a lot of good
      Message 2 of 16 , Nov 30, 2011
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        Hi,

        You may wish to read, "The Leader's Guide to Radical Management: Reinventing the Workplace for the 21st Century", by Stephen Dennings. Has a lot of good examples and has 7 Basic Principles for continous innovation.

        I would recommend this book for anyone. This book was required reading at the company I was at and used to help the sales team adopt a tailored version of Scrum.

        Bob Boyd
        http://implementingagile.blogspot.com/


        --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Michael Wollin <yahoo@...> wrote:
        >
        > I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management. To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects.
        >
        > To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]."
        >
        > I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example.
        >
        > Thanks.
        >
        > Michael
        >
      • Wouter Lagerweij
        I can t really help with anything very practical, but I did do a little experiment with a (partially distributed) management team, which I wrote up in
        Message 3 of 16 , Nov 30, 2011
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          I can't really help with anything very practical, but I did do a little experiment with a (partially distributed) management team, which I wrote up in http://www.lagerweij.com/2011/05/20/scrum-for-management/

          In short: yes, improving communication and splitting work up in smaller parts works also for management teams. No, we didn't get a full cross-functional team (weren't really expecting that to happen), but people did get a better understanding of each-other's work. And yes, Scrums effects of making existing issues painfully obvious also worked well...

          Wouter

          On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 8:09 PM, Michael Wollin <yahoo@...> wrote:
           

          I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management.  To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects. 

          To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]." 

          I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example. 

          Thanks.

          Michael




          --
          Wouter Lagerweij         | wouter@...
        • ag12340@rocketmail.com
          Why do you want to apply Scrum to general management? What benefits do you see or what is not working now that you expect Scrum will fix?
          Message 4 of 16 , Nov 30, 2011
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            Why do you want to apply Scrum to general management?
            What benefits do you see or what is not working now that you expect Scrum will fix?

            --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Michael Wollin <yahoo@...> wrote:
            >
            > I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management. To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects.
            >
            > To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]."
            >
            > I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example.
            >
            > Thanks.
            >
            > Michael
            >
          • Michael Wollin
            Both Jeff and Kenny Rubin made strong statements to us that this was beneficial. On the face of it, it seems worth exploring, and I imagine that there is
            Message 5 of 16 , Nov 30, 2011
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              Both Jeff and Kenny Rubin made strong statements to us that this was beneficial. On the face of it, it seems worth exploring, and I imagine that there is literature out there. 

              On Nov 30, 2011, at 3:47 PM, ag12340@... wrote:

               


              Why do you want to apply Scrum to general management?
              What benefits do you see or what is not working now that you expect Scrum will fix?

              --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Michael Wollin <yahoo@...> wrote:
              >
              > I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management. To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects.
              >
              > To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]."
              >
              > I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example.
              >
              > Thanks.
              >
              > Michael
              >


            • Johanna Rothman
              I have seen better results applying kanban to management. Johanna ... -- Rothman Consulting Group, Inc. 781-641-4046 Speaker, Author, Consultant - Managing
              Message 6 of 16 , Nov 30, 2011
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                I have seen better results applying kanban to management.

                Johanna

                On Nov 30, 2011, at 4:44 PM, Michael Wollin wrote:

                 

                Both Jeff and Kenny Rubin made strong statements to us that this was beneficial. On the face of it, it seems worth exploring, and I imagine that there is literature out there. 


                On Nov 30, 2011, at 3:47 PM, ag12340@... wrote:

                 


                Why do you want to apply Scrum to general management?
                What benefits do you see or what is not working now that you expect Scrum will fix?

                --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Michael Wollin <yahoo@...> wrote:
                >
                > I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management. To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects.
                >
                > To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]."
                >
                > I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example.
                >
                > Thanks.
                >
                > Michael
                >




                --

                Rothman Consulting Group, Inc.     781-641-4046

                Speaker, Author, Consultant - Managing Product Development

                ==========================================

                The Pragmatic Manager newsletter: http://www.jrothman.com/pragmaticmanager

                http://www.ayeconference.com, Oct 30-Nov 3, 2011

                New: Manage Your Project Portfolio: Increase Your Capacity and Finish More Projects





              • Michael Wollin
                Good point. Do you have a reading suggestion?
                Message 7 of 16 , Nov 30, 2011
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                  Good point. Do you have a reading suggestion?

                  On Nov 30, 2011, at 5:06 PM, Johanna Rothman wrote:

                   

                  I have seen better results applying kanban to management.


                  Johanna

                  On Nov 30, 2011, at 4:44 PM, Michael Wollin wrote:

                   

                  Both Jeff and Kenny Rubin made strong statements to us that this was beneficial. On the face of it, it seems worth exploring, and I imagine that there is literature out there. 


                  On Nov 30, 2011, at 3:47 PM, ag12340@... wrote:

                   


                  Why do you want to apply Scrum to general management?
                  What benefits do you see or what is not working now that you expect Scrum will fix?

                  --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Michael Wollin <yahoo@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management. To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects.
                  >
                  > To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]."
                  >
                  > I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example.
                  >
                  > Thanks.
                  >
                  > Michael
                  >




                  --

                  Rothman Consulting Group, Inc.     781-641-4046

                  Speaker, Author, Consultant - Managing Product Development

                  ==========================================

                  The Pragmatic Manager newsletter: http://www.jrothman.com/pragmaticmanager

                  http://www.ayeconference.com, Oct 30-Nov 3, 2011

                  New: Manage Your Project Portfolio: Increase Your Capacity and Finish More Projects







                • ag12340@rocketmail.com
                  Can you ask Jeff and Kenny Rubin for the case studies, their experiences, blog or material on it? Please forward it to this group also.
                  Message 8 of 16 , Nov 30, 2011
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                    Can you ask Jeff and Kenny Rubin for the case studies, their experiences, blog or material on it?

                    Please forward it to this group also.


                    --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Michael Wollin <yahoo@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Both Jeff and Kenny Rubin made strong statements to us that this was beneficial. On the face of it, it seems worth exploring, and I imagine that there is literature out there.
                    >
                    > On Nov 30, 2011, at 3:47 PM, ag12340@... wrote:
                    >
                    > >
                    > > Why do you want to apply Scrum to general management?
                    > > What benefits do you see or what is not working now that you expect Scrum will fix?
                    > >
                    > > --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Michael Wollin <yahoo@> wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management. To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects.
                    > > >
                    > > > To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]."
                    > > >
                    > > > I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example.
                    > > >
                    > > > Thanks.
                    > > >
                    > > > Michael
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                  • Johanna Rothman
                    I have written a little in _Manage Your Project Portfolio: Increase Your Capacity and Finish More Projects_. I have more writing planned in my program
                    Message 9 of 16 , Nov 30, 2011
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                      I have written a little in _Manage Your Project Portfolio: Increase Your Capacity and Finish More Projects_. I have more writing planned in my program management book, under construction. The agile management book is queued for after that. I have some articles under construction. 

                      Is there a particular area of management you were looking to apply agile to? The reason I have seen kanban more useful is that management "teams" are often not real teams; they are work groups who have different goals. They come together to coordinate, problem solve common issues, and expose impediments and risks. The issues of senior management are different from program management are different project portfolio management are different from development strategy, etc. 

                      If you give me a hint, I could point you in the right direction, or even write about it.

                      Johanna

                      On Nov 30, 2011, at 5:32 PM, Michael Wollin wrote:

                       

                      Good point. Do you have a reading suggestion?


                      On Nov 30, 2011, at 5:06 PM, Johanna Rothman wrote:

                       

                      I have seen better results applying kanban to management.


                      Johanna

                      On Nov 30, 2011, at 4:44 PM, Michael Wollin wrote:

                       

                      Both Jeff and Kenny Rubin made strong statements to us that this was beneficial. On the face of it, it seems worth exploring, and I imagine that there is literature out there. 


                      On Nov 30, 2011, at 3:47 PM, ag12340@... wrote:

                       


                      Why do you want to apply Scrum to general management?
                      What benefits do you see or what is not working now that you expect Scrum will fix?

                      --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Michael Wollin <yahoo@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management. To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects.
                      >
                      > To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]."
                      >
                      > I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example.
                      >
                      > Thanks.
                      >
                      > Michael
                      >




                      --

                      Rothman Consulting Group, Inc.     781-641-4046

                      Speaker, Author, Consultant - Managing Product Development

                      ==========================================

                      The Pragmatic Manager newsletter: http://www.jrothman.com/pragmaticmanager

                      http://www.ayeconference.com, Oct 30-Nov 3, 2011

                      New: Manage Your Project Portfolio: Increase Your Capacity and Finish More Projects









                      --

                      Rothman Consulting Group, Inc.     781-641-4046

                      Speaker, Author, Consultant - Managing Product Development

                      ==========================================

                      The Pragmatic Manager newsletter: http://www.jrothman.com/pragmaticmanager

                      http://www.ayeconference.com, Oct 30-Nov 3, 2011

                      New: Manage Your Project Portfolio: Increase Your Capacity and Finish More Projects





                    • Voris, John
                      Check out http://community.holacracy.org/topics-archived and http://holacracy.org/ I know Brian Robertson and his work. It is excellent, and makes a lot of
                      Message 10 of 16 , Dec 1, 2011
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                        Check out http://community.holacracy.org/topics-archived
                        and http://holacracy.org/

                        I know Brian Robertson and his work. It is excellent, and makes a lot of sense to me.

                        John V.

                        -==========================================-
                        > Scrum Applied to General Management
                        > Posted by: "Michael Wollin" Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:09 am (PST)

                        > I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management.
                        > To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects.
                        > To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]."
                        > I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example.

                        > Thanks.
                        > Michael
                      • Jochen Krebs
                        Hi, I don¹t have a book, paper or other ³evidence² I can reference, but I have helped a customer to implement agile practices across the entire
                        Message 11 of 16 , Dec 1, 2011
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                          Re: [scrumdevelopment] Scrum Applied to General Management Hi,
                          I don’t have a book, paper or other “evidence” I can reference,  but I have helped a customer to implement agile practices across the entire organization after Scrum was a great success for the IT teams. In many instances we applied Scrum in others we used Kanban when it made more sense.  In terms of departments,  we covered marketing, sales, research, finance and business development (with legal).  Hope that helps. -Joe
                          ---
                          Jochen (Joe) Krebs
                          Agile Coach, Trainer, Practitioner, Author and Speaker
                          http://www.incrementor.com
                          http://www.jochenkrebs.com
                          http://www.twitter.com/jochenkrebs
                          jkrebs@...
                          914 689 6368

                          Organizer of:
                          http://www.agilenyc.org
                          Agile Day (Annual 1-Day Conference in NYC)
                          Agile NYC OPEN (Open Space UnConference)

                          Host of the Agile NYC Podcast:
                          http://feeds.feedburner.com/AgileNYC



                          On 12/1/11 12:11 PM, "Voris, John" <john.voris@...> wrote:


                           
                           
                             

                          Check out http://community.holacracy.org/topics-archived
                          and http://holacracy.org/

                          I know Brian Robertson and his work.  It is excellent, and makes a lot of sense to me.

                          John V.

                          -==========================================-
                          > Scrum Applied to General Management
                          > Posted by: "Michael Wollin" Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:09 am (PST)

                          > I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management.
                          > To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects.
                          > To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]."
                          > I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example.

                          > Thanks.
                          > Michael

                           
                             


                        • Pierre Neis
                          Hi John, One the best publication is http://jeffsutherland.org/scrum/SutherlandTakeNoPrisonersAgile2009.pdf it s about how Scrum is used by OpenView Capital.
                          Message 12 of 16 , Dec 1, 2011
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                            Hi John,

                            One the best publication is http://jeffsutherland.org/scrum/SutherlandTakeNoPrisonersAgile2009.pdf it's about how Scrum is used by OpenView Capital.


                            Pierre E.  NEIScsp

                            Head of Lean Competence Centre @ coPROcess S.A. 
                            │ Scrum & Lean Coach   

                            M: +352 / 661 727 867  - Skype: pierre.neis  
                            Meet with me: http://meetwith.me/pierreneis



                             



                            On 1 December 2011 18:46, Jochen Krebs <mail@...> wrote:
                             

                            Hi,
                            I don’t have a book, paper or other “evidence” I can reference,  but I have helped a customer to implement agile practices across the entire organization after Scrum was a great success for the IT teams. In many instances we applied Scrum in others we used Kanban when it made more sense.  In terms of departments,  we covered marketing, sales, research, finance and business development (with legal).  Hope that helps. -Joe
                            ---
                            Jochen (Joe) Krebs
                            Agile Coach, Trainer, Practitioner, Author and Speaker
                            http://www.incrementor.com
                            http://www.jochenkrebs.com
                            http://www.twitter.com/jochenkrebs
                            jkrebs@...
                            914 689 6368

                            Organizer of:
                            http://www.agilenyc.org
                            Agile Day (Annual 1-Day Conference in NYC)
                            Agile NYC OPEN (Open Space UnConference)

                            Host of the Agile NYC Podcast:
                            http://feeds.feedburner.com/AgileNYC





                            On 12/1/11 12:11 PM, "Voris, John" <john.voris@...> wrote:


                             
                             
                               

                            Check out http://community.holacracy.org/topics-archived
                            and http://holacracy.org/

                            I know Brian Robertson and his work.  It is excellent, and makes a lot of sense to me.

                            John V.

                            -==========================================-
                            > Scrum Applied to General Management
                            > Posted by: "Michael Wollin" Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:09 am (PST)

                            > I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management.
                            > To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects.
                            > To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]."
                            > I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example.

                            > Thanks.
                            > Michael

                             
                               



                          • Peter Stevens
                            Hi Michael, You might take a look at Steve Dennings Radical Management - 80% is Scrum without the specific vocabulary. It focuses on the principles, not the
                            Message 13 of 16 , Dec 2, 2011
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                              Hi Michael,

                              You might take a look at Steve Dennings 'Radical Management' - 80% is Scrum without the specific vocabulary. It focuses on the principles, not the practices or roles. He adds 'delighting the customer' as the explicit goal of the company and 'leadership storytelling' as an approach to change leadership. He has many examples outside of software, from building houses to building submarines...

                              Cheers,

                              Peter

                              On 30.11.11 20:09, Michael Wollin wrote:  

                              I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management.  To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects. 

                              To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]." 

                              I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example. 

                              Thanks.

                              Michael


                              -- 
                              Peter Stevens
                              Scrum Trainer & Coach
                              
                              Switzerland: direct: +41 44 586 6450     cell: +41 79 422 6722
                              USA:         direct: +1 202 657 6450 
                              World:       skype:  peterstev
                              
                              blog:        http://scrum-breakfast.com
                              
                            • Michael Wollin
                              Appears to be exactly what I was looking for. Thank you!
                              Message 14 of 16 , Dec 2, 2011
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                                Appears to be exactly what I was looking for. Thank you!

                                On Dec 2, 2011, at 12:10 PM, Peter Stevens wrote:

                                 

                                Hi Michael,

                                You might take a look at Steve Dennings 'Radical Management' - 80% is Scrum without the specific vocabulary. It focuses on the principles, not the practices or roles. He adds 'delighting the customer' as the explicit goal of the company and 'leadership storytelling' as an approach to change leadership. He has many examples outside of software, from building houses to building submarines...

                                Cheers,

                                Peter

                                On 30.11.11 20:09, Michael Wollin wrote:

                                 

                                I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management.  To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects. 

                                To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]." 

                                I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example. 

                                Thanks.

                                Michael


                                -- 
                                Peter Stevens
                                Scrum Trainer & Coach
                                
                                Switzerland: direct: +41 44 586 6450     cell: +41 79 422 6722
                                USA:         direct: +1 202 657 6450 
                                World:       skype:  peterstev
                                
                                blog:        http://scrum-breakfast.com
                                

                                |**|-~-->

                              • Andrew Pham
                                Hi Wouter, Sounds interesting but to be honest with you I do not believe too much in this using Scrum to transform the world, work, top management and all. We
                                Message 15 of 16 , Dec 3, 2011
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                                  Hi Wouter,

                                  Sounds interesting but to be honest with you I do not believe too much in this using Scrum to transform the world, work, top management and all.

                                  We would do a better job at using Scrum effecrtively first to improve software delivery in corporate environments (where software and IT are considered to be more a problem and a cost center), rather than trying to teach top management and the rest of the world how to use Scrum to transofrm their work!

                                  When you know that most of our CIOs either are not invited at the CEO's table or sit very tight and keep a very low profile when general management speaks, it is almost utopia and a lack of humility to try to teach top management to use Scrum to transform their work.

                                  Humility is key in life! (Even though I know some will dream and try to do marketing and to make money this way but good luck!)

                                  Cheers,

                                  Andrew

                                  Author of
                                  Scrum in Action, Agile Project Management and Development in the Real-World
                                  http://www.amazon.com/Scrum-Action-Andrew-Pham/dp/143545913X/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpi_1-1

                                  and of "Business-Driven IT-Wide Agile (Scrum) and/or Kanban (Lean) Implementation" (reviewed and upcoming)


                                  On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 2:21 PM, Wouter Lagerweij <wouter@...> wrote:
                                   

                                  I can't really help with anything very practical, but I did do a little experiment with a (partially distributed) management team, which I wrote up in http://www.lagerweij.com/2011/05/20/scrum-for-management/


                                  In short: yes, improving communication and splitting work up in smaller parts works also for management teams. No, we didn't get a full cross-functional team (weren't really expecting that to happen), but people did get a better understanding of each-other's work. And yes, Scrums effects of making existing issues painfully obvious also worked well...

                                  Wouter


                                  On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 8:09 PM, Michael Wollin <yahoo@...> wrote:
                                   

                                  I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management.  To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects. 

                                  To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]." 

                                  I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example. 

                                  Thanks.

                                  Michael




                                  --
                                  Wouter Lagerweij         | wouter@...

                                • Wouter Lagerweij
                                  Hi Andrew, No, as I was saying, the context didn t lend itself to doing real scrum. On the other hand, I do think that for many management teams it will be
                                  Message 16 of 16 , Dec 5, 2011
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                                    Hi Andrew,

                                    No, as I was saying, the context didn't lend itself to doing 'real' scrum. 

                                    On the other hand, I do think that for many management teams it will be beneficial to be explicit about priorities, make progress transparent, and ensure that communication happens frequently. 

                                    In the situation I describe in my blog-post, both communication and learning were quickly improved, and helped the company. Is that Scrum? Not by a long shot. But still helpful:-)

                                    Wouter

                                    On Sat, Dec 3, 2011 at 11:23 PM, Andrew Pham <andrewpham74@...> wrote:
                                     

                                    Hi Wouter,

                                    Sounds interesting but to be honest with you I do not believe too much in this using Scrum to transform the world, work, top management and all.

                                    We would do a better job at using Scrum effecrtively first to improve software delivery in corporate environments (where software and IT are considered to be more a problem and a cost center), rather than trying to teach top management and the rest of the world how to use Scrum to transofrm their work!

                                    When you know that most of our CIOs either are not invited at the CEO's table or sit very tight and keep a very low profile when general management speaks, it is almost utopia and a lack of humility to try to teach top management to use Scrum to transform their work.

                                    Humility is key in life! (Even though I know some will dream and try to do marketing and to make money this way but good luck!)

                                    Cheers,

                                    Andrew

                                    Author of
                                    Scrum in Action, Agile Project Management and Development in the Real-World
                                    http://www.amazon.com/Scrum-Action-Andrew-Pham/dp/143545913X/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpi_1-1

                                    and of "Business-Driven IT-Wide Agile (Scrum) and/or Kanban (Lean) Implementation" (reviewed and upcoming)


                                    On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 2:21 PM, Wouter Lagerweij <wouter@...> wrote:
                                     

                                    I can't really help with anything very practical, but I did do a little experiment with a (partially distributed) management team, which I wrote up in http://www.lagerweij.com/2011/05/20/scrum-for-management/


                                    In short: yes, improving communication and splitting work up in smaller parts works also for management teams. No, we didn't get a full cross-functional team (weren't really expecting that to happen), but people did get a better understanding of each-other's work. And yes, Scrums effects of making existing issues painfully obvious also worked well...

                                    Wouter


                                    On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 8:09 PM, Michael Wollin <yahoo@...> wrote:
                                     

                                    I'm looking for good reference articles and books about HOW to apply Scrum to general management.  To be clear, it would be great to have references for just managing, independent of and unrelated to software projects. 

                                    To quote our department VP, "If we could apply it effectively for [our department's Mgmt], I would think it could be looked at for broader use in [our division]." 

                                    I am familiar with Jeff Sutherland's church example. Better would be a management book and business articles with practical how to that uses regular business domain as the example. 

                                    Thanks.

                                    Michael




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                                    Wouter Lagerweij         | wouter@...




                                    --
                                    Wouter Lagerweij         | wouter@...
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