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RE: [scrumdevelopment] a task tracking tool for scrum?

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  • Mike Borozdin
    You know, one thing that I wish a Scrum tool would do is just simple Task/SubTask tracking and just base the percentage on how much of the task is complete.
    Message 1 of 33 , Jul 23 8:34 AM
      Message
      You know, one thing that I wish a Scrum tool would do is just simple Task/SubTask tracking  and just base the percentage on how much of the task is complete.  Having used MS Project a little too much I see absolutely no value in keeping track of the percentages of how much of a task is complete.  That information fluctuates from dev to dev anyway -- Tom might think that being 80% is 100% code complete and now he is going to start testing the system, Jerry might think that 100% is 100% code complete.
       
      With tasks and subtasks you can sort of get the percentage of the code done (good for the PMs), but also it won't stop people from going back on the percentages, which is psychologically hard in MS Project, but not if you are just adding sub tasks with days of work.
       
      I think a perfect scrum tool (for me) would display the following list:
       
      TOTAL SPRINT STATUS ( 22/34 )
      • Implement web UI (4/4)
        • lay out the pages (1/1)
        • create the global security mechanism (3/3)
      • Implement persistent storage (3/15)
        • set up mySQL database (1/1)
        • test mySQL with the new jBoss distro (1/1)
      • ..... etc etc ....
      So a use scenario for a tool like this would be the following:
       
      The project looks like it's almost up to the requirement defined at the beginning of the current sprint the total sprint status reads 30/33.  Thomas needs to just write some glue code to log the activity of his part of the application.  Thomas realizes that there is an architectural problem -- the service that he is running is running under a separate set of credentials and he doesn't have access rights to the log.  The logging "owner" gets together with Thomas and they figure out that they need to do 3 more concrete 1 day tasks to make this work.  They update the Scrum master in the morning, who updates the sprint backlog and now the sprint status correctly reads 30/36.
      -----Original Message-----
      From: Mike Beedle [mailto:beedlem@...]
      Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2002 8:06 AM
      To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [scrumdevelopment] a task tracking tool for scrum?

      Mike:
       
      Yes, there are a few people that are using it in XP projects.
       
      However, be aware that this tool is fairly new,
       
      - Mike
      -----Original Message-----
      From: Mike Cohn [mailto:mike@...]
      Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2002 10:06 AM
      To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [scrumdevelopment] a task tracking tool for scrum?

      Has anyone used this?

       

      -----Original Message-----
      From: Mike Beedle [mailto:beedlem@...]
      Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2002 8:40 AM
      To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [scrumdevelopment] a task tracking tool for scrum?

       


      This is an XP planning tool but remember the planning game in XP
      is essentially Scrum:
      http://xplanner.sourceforge.net/planning.html

      (I haven't used this one in a project but I am going to
      install it and check it out today, btw.)

      - Mike


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    • Sadhanandavel Ramdoss
      Thanks Mr.Mike Regards, Sadhanand ... From: Mike Cohn To: Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004
      Message 33 of 33 , Feb 29, 2004
        Thanks Mr.Mike


        Regards,

        Sadhanand


        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Mike Cohn" <mike@...>
        To: <scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 8:36 PM
        Subject: RE: [scrumdevelopment] Re: a task tracking tool for scrum?


        > On my website I have two basic introductory presentations (PowerPoints
        > available as PDFs). They are at:
        > http://www.mountaingoatsoftware.com/presentations.php
        >
        > I also have a series of pages describing the process:
        > http://www.mountaingoatsoftware.com//scrum
        >
        > Linda Rising wrote a wonderful introduction to Scrum in IEEE Software.
        It's
        > on her site at http://members.cox.net/risingl1/articles/IEEEScrum.pdf
        >
        > Ken Schwaber's website is at http://www.controlchaos.com/ and has a
        plethora
        > of short articles on Scrum.
        >
        > Jeff Sutherland maintains a Scrum blog at
        > http://www.jeffsutherland.com/scrum/.
        >
        > Mike Beedle's publications page lists many great papers:
        > http://www.mikebeedle.com/papers.html
        >
        > Of course, the best introduction is from either of the two books:
        > Agile Software Development with Scrum by Schwaber and Beedle
        > Agile Project Management with Scrum by Schwaber.
        >
        > I suggest starting with my intro pages
        > (http://www.mountaingoatsoftware.com//scrum) or Linda's article
        > (http://members.cox.net/risingl1/articles/IEEEScrum.pdf) to see if Scrum
        > appeals to you at all. Then following it up with the books.
        >
        > --Mike
        >
        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: Sadhanandavel Ramdoss [mailto:sadhawin@...]
        > Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 1:13 AM
        > To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: Re: [scrumdevelopment] Re: a task tracking tool for scrum?
        >
        > Hi,
        >
        > I have joined this recently. Can anyone tell me where can I get a detailed
        > tutorial about Scrum?
        >
        > Regards,
        >
        > Sadhanandavel Ramdoss
        >
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: "Ken Schwaber" <ken.schwaber@...>
        > To: <scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com>
        > Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 5:55 AM
        > Subject: [scrumdevelopment] Re: a task tracking tool for scrum?
        >
        >
        > > Scrum does use estimates and actuals to improve reliability of
        > > estimates. At the start of a Sprint, the team estimates what it can
        > > do. At the end of the Sprint, the team sees what it was able to do.
        > > Team's regularly improve their estimates so that they can
        > > demonstrate what they committed to. However, this in no way changes
        > > their productivity, just that everyone feels that they are
        > > more "reliable." Mary Poppendieck quoted lean manufacturing
        > > regarding suboptimal measurements. Estimated time to do something
        > > and actual time it took is useful for planning purposes, but
        > > meaningless for tasks or specifications (like stories), because they
        > > are so granular that their complexity outweights attempts to
        > > estimate them regardless of the amount of time analyzing them to
        > > create an estimate. In my experience, if you reward people for
        > > something, they will do it. If you tell them you want esimates to
        > > more closely approximate actuals, they will do it. Will more product
        > > be built, or a better product be built? No, but we'll feel like
        > > things are more under control, which of course they aren't. Watch
        > > out for silver bullets.
        > > KEn
        > >
        > > --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Cohn" <mike@m...>
        > > wrote:
        > > > There is no point whatsoever to tracking actuals.
        > > >
        > > > The number of interest is how much time is left. If you ask for
        > > actuals then
        > > > people start feeling a subtle pressure that the actual + the time
        > > remaining
        > > > should add to something palatable. Even if you have no intent to
        > > ever do
        > > > this, many people do it themselves or think you're doing it. So,
        > > they tend
        > > > to give artificially low estimates of time remaining.
        > > >
        > > > Plus, why track one more set of numbers?
        > > >
        > > > I calculate velocity on all my Scrum projects (see the chapters on
        > > > "Measuring and Monitoring Velocity" or "Using Stories with Scrum"
        > > in "User
        > > > Stories Applied"). I calculate velocity quite easily without ever
        > > > considering actuals.
        > > >
        > > > --Mike
        > > >
        > > > -----Original Message-----
        > > > From: Matt Read [mailto:mread@s...]
        > > > Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 3:23 PM
        > > > To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
        > > > Subject: RE: [scrumdevelopment] Re: a task tracking tool for scrum?
        > > >
        > > > Thanks. It's reassuring to find out that my own attempt wasn't so
        > > much
        > > > different from yours (although yours is a lot prettier). Since
        > > posting I've
        > > > started using XPlanner, which has reduced the time taken for me to
        > > do my
        > > > daily updates quite substantially while still providing the right
        > > > information.
        > > >
        > > > However given that XPlanner is oriented towards XP I seem to be
        > > coming
        > > > across the question of whether to track actuals or not. From my
        > > limited
        > > > understanding of both methodologies it seems that Scrum says no,
        > > XP says
        > > > yes. Scrum seems to put more value on having accurate estimates
        > > for "how
        > > > much is left to do" whereas XP values the ability to measure
        > > velocity. As
        > > > far as I can tell these are conflicting practices. I'm intending to
        > > > experiment with both over the next few iterations to find out
        > > which works
        > > > best for my team but does anyone have any further insight into
        > > this that
        > > > might help?
        > > >
        > > > Thanks,
        > > > Matt.
        > > >
        > > > -----Original Message-----
        > > > From: Mike Cohn [mailto:mike@m...]
        > > > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 17:09
        > > > To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
        > > > Subject: RE: [scrumdevelopment] Re: a task tracking tool for scrum?
        > > >
        > > > Matt--
        > > > This isn't the same spreadsheet Ken referred to but I have a
        > > sample xls for
        > > > tracking backlog on my site at
        > > > http://www.mountaingoatsoftware.com/resources.php
        > > >
        > > > --Mike
        > > >
        > > > -----Original Message-----
        > > > From: MattRead [mailto:mread@s...]
        > > > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 9:19 AM
        > > > To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
        > > > Subject: [scrumdevelopment] Re: a task tracking tool for scrum?
        > > >
        > > > Would it be possible to repost these spreadsheets if you still
        > > have them?
        > > > Yahoo doesn't archive the attachments.
        > > >
        > > > Thanks,
        > > > Matt.
        > > >
        > > > --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Ken Schwaber"
        > > > <ken.schwaber@v...> wrote:
        > > > > I've attached two spreadsheets that I've accumulated. One from a
        > > > member of
        > > > > the ScrumDevelopment egroup, the other from a customer. One is a
        > > > complete
        > > > > package (product, sprint backlogs and chart), the other is for
        > > > sprint
        > > > > backlogs.
        > > > > Ken
        > > > >
        > > > > -----Original Message-----
        > > > > From: mikeborozdin [mailto:EZXS@F...]
        > > > > Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 3:19 AM
        > > > > To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
        > > > > Subject: [scrumdevelopment] a task tracking tool for scrum?
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > Is there a task tracking tool for scrum? Can you link me to the
        > > page?
        > > > > Thanks! (PS: CC your e-mails to ezxs@f...)
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
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        > > > > scrumdevelopment-unsubscribe@e...
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        > > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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        > > >
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        > > >
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