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Re: [scrumdevelopment] Scrum -- for families....

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  • Taru Jain
    This is a coincident. Last weekend, my boyfriend and I were talking about similar idea. We were thinking to have a Product Backlog . This will consists of all
    Message 1 of 12 , May 3, 2004
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      This is a coincident. Last weekend, my boyfriend and I
      were talking about similar idea.

      We were thinking to have a "Product Backlog". This
      will consists of all the things that we really want to
      do/fix :-) in next couple years.... And whenever we
      come up with anything new, we will add it to our
      Product Backlog.

      We were thinking to have a "Sprint Backlog" to focus
      on near future, like 1-2 month from now.

      We will both be the owner. Now the question is who
      gets to be the Scrum Master? I would say we can take
      turn :-)

      We were actually discussing to mix Scrum and XP, as we
      think the 4 values of XP are good to follow not just
      in a software project, but also in real life.

      So, Michael, I will be interested in working with you
      on this.

      Taru
      --- Michael Vizdos <michael.vizdos@...>
      wrote:
      > Hi all.
      >
      > I have an idea I'd like to share with this group.
      >
      > Don't know if this is just for laughs (I hope not)
      > but....
      >
      > Our family of four (me, my wife, and two kids --
      > they are young) is always
      > struggling with "life" activities. Feels like
      > sometimes we are spinning our
      > wheels. Sounds familiar on some IT projects I have
      > been involved with.
      > This is probably the norm for most families out
      > there.
      >
      > My wife has tried different "systems" in the past to
      > try to get things
      > planned in life -- but usually they are only about
      > one person in the family
      > doing something, not the family as a "team."
      >
      > See where I am going with this???
      >
      > As a CSM, my wife asked me about what I do with
      > Scrum [heh, we DO
      > communicate!] and she said, "Hey, let's try that
      > with life at home." I
      > really think this was her way of getting me more
      > involved in trying to plan
      > our crazy lives (smile). So here it is.
      >
      > Is there anyone out there that has something
      > documented like this
      > specifically for use by families? I know, I know, I
      > know..... Ken and
      > others say this can be applied outside of our IT
      > work lives. Is anyone
      > already doing this?
      >
      > If not, let this thread serve two functions:
      >
      > 1) I am going to try this at home. Um... Should say
      > "we". Outside of work.
      > Using non-IT or technical terms.
      >
      > 2) I will document stuff as it happens. Maybe, just
      > maybe, I can use this
      > as a springboard for my next book (once I finish the
      > book on the EUP
      > (www.enterpriseunifiedprocess.info) that I am
      > co-authoring). This may then
      > help spread Scrum to the mainstream... Or is that
      > too lofty of a goal?
      >
      > Dumb idea? Already "taken" -- if so, where can I
      > build on it?
      >
      > Anyone interested in joining me on this?
      >
      > Thank you,
      >
      > - mike v.
      >
      >
      >
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    • Michael Dowling
      You know you (& your family) need a vacation when... ... -Michael ... -- Michael Dowling mdowling@planetoutinc.com PlanetOut Inc. 415.834.6500 main |
      Message 2 of 12 , May 3, 2004
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        You know you (& your family) need a vacation when...

        :-D

        -Michael

        Taru Jain wrote:

        > This is a coincident. Last weekend, my boyfriend and I
        > were talking about similar idea.
        >
        > We were thinking to have a "Product Backlog". This
        > will consists of all the things that we really want to
        > do/fix :-) in next couple years.... And whenever we
        > come up with anything new, we will add it to our
        > Product Backlog.
        >
        > We were thinking to have a "Sprint Backlog" to focus
        > on near future, like 1-2 month from now.
        >
        > We will both be the owner. Now the question is who
        > gets to be the Scrum Master? I would say we can take
        > turn :-)
        >
        > We were actually discussing to mix Scrum and XP, as we
        > think the 4 values of XP are good to follow not just
        > in a software project, but also in real life.
        >
        > So, Michael, I will be interested in working with you
        > on this.
        >
        > Taru
        > --- Michael Vizdos <michael.vizdos@...>
        > wrote:
        >
        >>Hi all.
        >>
        >>I have an idea I'd like to share with this group.
        >>
        >>Don't know if this is just for laughs (I hope not)
        >>but....
        >>
        >>Our family of four (me, my wife, and two kids --
        >>they are young) is always
        >>struggling with "life" activities. Feels like
        >>sometimes we are spinning our
        >>wheels. Sounds familiar on some IT projects I have
        >>been involved with.
        >>This is probably the norm for most families out
        >>there.
        >>
        >>My wife has tried different "systems" in the past to
        >>try to get things
        >>planned in life -- but usually they are only about
        >>one person in the family
        >>doing something, not the family as a "team."
        >>
        >>See where I am going with this???
        >>
        >>As a CSM, my wife asked me about what I do with
        >>Scrum [heh, we DO
        >>communicate!] and she said, "Hey, let's try that
        >>with life at home." I
        >>really think this was her way of getting me more
        >>involved in trying to plan
        >>our crazy lives (smile). So here it is.
        >>
        >>Is there anyone out there that has something
        >>documented like this
        >>specifically for use by families? I know, I know, I
        >>know..... Ken and
        >>others say this can be applied outside of our IT
        >>work lives. Is anyone
        >>already doing this?
        >>
        >>If not, let this thread serve two functions:
        >>
        >>1) I am going to try this at home. Um... Should say
        >>"we". Outside of work.
        >>Using non-IT or technical terms.
        >>
        >>2) I will document stuff as it happens. Maybe, just
        >>maybe, I can use this
        >>as a springboard for my next book (once I finish the
        >>book on the EUP
        >>(www.enterpriseunifiedprocess.info) that I am
        >>co-authoring). This may then
        >>help spread Scrum to the mainstream... Or is that
        >>too lofty of a goal?
        >>
        >>Dumb idea? Already "taken" -- if so, where can I
        >>build on it?
        >>
        >>Anyone interested in joining me on this?
        >>
        >>Thank you,
        >>
        >>- mike v.
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >>------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
        >>
        >>To Post a message, send it to:
        >>scrumdevelopment@...
        >>To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
        >>scrumdevelopment-unsubscribe@...
        >>Yahoo! Groups Links
        >>
        >>
        >> scrumdevelopment-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > __________________________________
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        mdowling@...
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      • Mike Beedle
        Michael: .... I can envision your wife and you discussing if the kids are practicing enough self-organization specially when it is time to go to bed; or
        Message 3 of 12 , May 3, 2004
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          Message
           
          Michael:
           
          ....  I can envision your wife and you discussing if the kids are practicing
          enough self-organization specially when it is time to go to bed; or practicing 
          enough "BA" i.e. sharing, as they play with their toys or while at the dinner
          table.
           
          Mine *teach* me self-organization -- they self-organize all right, but only to 
          satisfy their own goals, hardly ever "ours".  Also, they both believe and *really are*
          the Product Owners (specially my 3-year old).  As he says, he is:
           
              the boss of the world
           
          My wife and I work for them.  She is the ScrumMaster, and I guess I am the
          only "developer" -- I get to do all the "dirty jobs":
           
              take out the trash
              mown the lawn
              clean the attic
              etc.
           
          mb
           
          -----Original Message-----
          From: Michael Vizdos [mailto:michael.vizdos@...]
          Sent: Monday, May 03, 2004 4:06 PM
          To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [scrumdevelopment] Scrum -- for families....

          Hi all.

          I have an idea I'd like to share with this group. 

          Don't know if this is just for laughs (I hope not) but....

          Our family of four (me, my wife, and two kids -- they are young) is always
          struggling with "life" activities.  Feels like sometimes we are spinning our
          wheels.  Sounds familiar on some IT projects I have been involved with.
          This is probably the norm for most families out there.

          My wife has tried different "systems" in the past to try to get things
          planned in life -- but usually they are only about one person in the family
          doing something, not the family as a "team."

          See where I am going with this???

          As a CSM, my wife asked me about what I do with Scrum [heh, we DO
          communicate!] and she said, "Hey, let's try that with life at home."  I
          really think this was her way of getting me more involved in trying to plan
          our crazy lives (smile).  So here it is.

          Is there anyone out there that has something documented like this
          specifically for use by families?  I know, I know, I know..... Ken and
          others say this can be applied outside of our IT work lives.  Is anyone
          already doing this?

          If not, let this thread serve two functions:

          1) I am going to try this at home.  Um... Should say "we".  Outside of work.
          Using non-IT or technical terms.

          2) I will document stuff as it happens.  Maybe, just maybe, I can use this
          as a springboard for my next book (once I finish the book on the EUP
          (www.enterpriseunifiedprocess.info) that I am co-authoring).  This may then
          help spread Scrum to the mainstream... Or is that too lofty of a goal?

          Dumb idea?  Already "taken" -- if so, where can I build on it?

          Anyone interested in joining me on this?

          Thank you,

          - mike v.



          To Post a message, send it to:   scrumdevelopment@...
          To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: scrumdevelopment-unsubscribe@...



        • Mike Cohn
          I picture my 8-year-old daughter yelling at me, Who died and made you Product Owner?! --Mike Cohn, Certified ScrumMaster Author of User Stories Applied for
          Message 4 of 12 , May 3, 2004
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            Message

            I picture my 8-year-old daughter yelling at me, “Who died and made you Product Owner?!”

             

            --Mike Cohn, Certified ScrumMaster

            Author of User Stories Applied for Agile Software Development

            www.userstories.com

            www.mountaingoatsoftware.com


            From: Mike Beedle [mailto:beedlem@...]
            Sent: Monday, May 03, 2004 4:16 PM
            To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: RE: [scrumdevelopment] Scrum -- for families....

             

             

            Michael:

             

            ....  I can envision your wife and you discussing if the kids are practicing

            enough self-organization specially when it is time to go to bed; or practicing 

            enough "BA" i.e. sharing, as they play with their toys or while at the dinner

            table.

             

            Mine *teach* me self-organization -- they self-organize all right, but only to 

            satisfy their own goals, hardly ever "ours".  Also, they both believe and *really are*

            the Product Owners (specially my 3-year old).  As he says, he is:

             

                the boss of the world

             

            My wife and I work for them.  She is the ScrumMaster, and I guess I am the
            only "developer" -- I get to do all the "dirty jobs":

             

                take out the trash

                mown the lawn

                clean the attic

                etc.

             

            mb

             

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Michael Vizdos [mailto: michael.vizdos@... ]
            Sent: Monday, May 03, 2004 4:06 PM
            To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [scrumdevelopment] Scrum -- for families....

            Hi all.

            I have an idea I'd like to share with this group. 

            Don't know if this is just for laughs (I hope not) but....

            Our family of four (me, my wife, and two kids -- they are young) is always
            struggling with "life" activities.  Feels like sometimes we are spinning our
            wheels.  Sounds familiar on some IT projects I have been involved with.
            This is probably the norm for most families out there.

            My wife has tried different "systems" in the past to try to get things
            planned in life -- but usually they are only about one person in the family
            doing something, not the family as a "team."

            See where I am going with this???

            As a CSM, my wife asked me about what I do with Scrum [heh, we DO
            communicate!] and she said, "Hey, let's try that with life at home."  I
            really think this was her way of getting me more involved in trying to plan
            our crazy lives (smile).  So here it is.

            Is there anyone out there that has something documented like this
            specifically for use by families?  I know, I know, I know..... Ken and
            others say this can be applied outside of our IT work lives.  Is anyone
            already doing this?

            If not, let this thread serve two functions:

            1) I am going to try this at home.  Um... Should say "we".  Outside of work.
            Using non-IT or technical terms.

            2) I will document stuff as it happens.  Maybe, just maybe, I can use this
            as a springboard for my next book (once I finish the book on the EUP
            (www.enterpriseunifiedprocess.info) that I am co-authoring).  This may then
            help spread Scrum to the mainstream... Or is that too lofty of a goal?

            Dumb idea?  Already "taken" -- if so, where can I build on it?

            Anyone interested in joining me on this?

            Thank you,

            - mike v.



            To Post a message, send it to:   scrumdevelopment@...
            To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: scrumdevelopment-unsubscribe@...





            To Post a message, send it to:   scrumdevelopment@...
            To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: scrumdevelopment-unsubscribe@...




          • Deb
            Better yet... what will be the product? The task of determining the family s goals, to the satisfaction of all participants, might be a useful exercise in
            Message 5 of 12 , May 3, 2004
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              Better yet... what will be the product?
              The task of determining the family's goals, to the satisfaction of
              all participants, might be a useful exercise in itself (requiring
              each to understand the values and goals of the others.)

              Hmmm... this does pose a conundrum (also noted by some of the other
              commenters) - does the whole family "own" the backlog/deliverables?

              Does this ever happen in business - that the product owner and the
              development team are the same? I know in new product development it
              must be tempting sometimes, but it strikes me as a temptation to be
              avoided, at least in business. The differentiation in roles and
              responsibilities between Owner and Developers creates checks and
              balances in the work.

              --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Cohn" <mike@m...>
              wrote:
              > Michael--
              > Who will be the ScrumMaster? You or your wife? ;)
              >
            • w6rabbit
              ... is always ... We consist of me, my wife, and our nine kids, ages 11 to 1. So I can relate to strugling with life and activities. ... We involve our 7
              Message 6 of 12 , May 6, 2004
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                --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Vizdos"
                <michael.vizdos@r...> wrote:
                > Hi all.
                >
                > Our family of four (me, my wife, and two kids -- they are young)
                is always
                > struggling with "life" activities.
                >
                "We" consist of me, my wife, and our nine kids, ages 11 to 1.
                So I can relate to strugling with life and activities.

                > As a CSM, my wife asked me about what I do with Scrum
                > and she said, "Hey, let's try that with life at home."
                >
                > Is there anyone out there that has something documented like this
                > specifically for use by families? Is anyone
                > already doing this?
                >
                We involve our 7 oldest, ages 11 to 3. The youngest doesn't
                actually contribute much that's meaningful. She mostly says
                things that she would have done anyway, like "eat lunch."
                But the other 6 do set meaningful goals for their days.

                > If not, let this thread serve two functions:
                >
                > 1) I am going to try this at home.
                >
                > 2) I will document stuff as it happens. This may then
                > help spread Scrum to the mainstream...
                > Or is that too lofty of a goal?
                >
                I strongly believe that software development is
                a team sport. And Scrum really helps us achieve that.
                I think family should be even more of a team, and
                I think that scrum, and improved communication
                can help there too.

                > Anyone interested in joining me on this?
                >
                Some problems we've had are:
                a) Some of the kids don't remember this morning, what
                goals they set yesterday morning or remember very clearly
                how they did. So we have the goal setting in the morning
                and the review in the evening.

                b) I talked about them doing this for months, but in
                practice, it doesn't happen yet unless I'm there and
                call everybody in.
                This means that the scrum is early in the morning
                before I leave for work and before they are really
                awake.

                c) We don't have sprints, yet. I expect we will,
                but I'm introducing one thing at a time.

                Feedback:
                As a result, I'm seeing them take ownership of things
                that I'have wanted them to all along.

                I heard that the other night, when I had an evening
                meeting, my 10-year old son spoke up at supper,
                "Well, it looks like we're not going to have a scrum
                with daddy, but today I ..."
                on his own initiative.

                Good luck Mike,
                Brad.
              • John Recktenwald
                It seems to me that Scrum is an application of constructive human activity to software engineering. It may be in a position now to give back to human activity.
                Message 7 of 12 , May 6, 2004
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                  It seems to me that Scrum is an application of constructive human
                  activity to software engineering. It may be in a position now to give
                  back to human activity.

                  I have a life mission statement which is like the project plan or
                  architectural and business vision and doesn't change very often. I
                  adopted this from 'The 7 habits of highly effective people' around 1996/1997

                  I go on a retreat twice a year to work on my life goals which I break
                  down into short term and long term which establishes a sprint backlog
                  and a product backlog. I've been doing this for at least 15 years and
                  don't remember where I picked up the idea.

                  A number of self help people have written about the advisability of
                  establishing a do list for the day and setting one thing that you
                  definitely will do that day so you will have a feeling of some progress
                  or accomplishment. The daily sprint. I'm a little weak in this area.

                  So, yes, I would say this is well documented but you have to pick the
                  bits and pieces from a lot of sources. Steven Covey, annoying at times,
                  is probably a good place to start. He has a book for families but I
                  haven't read it.

                  John Recktenwald



                  w6rabbit wrote:

                  > --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Vizdos"
                  > <michael.vizdos@r...> wrote:
                  > > Hi all.
                  > >
                  > > Our family of four (me, my wife, and two kids -- they are young)
                  > is always
                  > > struggling with "life" activities.
                  > >
                  > "We" consist of me, my wife, and our nine kids, ages 11 to 1.
                  > So I can relate to strugling with life and activities.
                  >
                  > > As a CSM, my wife asked me about what I do with Scrum
                  > > and she said, "Hey, let's try that with life at home."
                  > >
                  > > Is there anyone out there that has something documented like this
                  > > specifically for use by families? Is anyone
                  > > already doing this?
                  > >
                  > We involve our 7 oldest, ages 11 to 3. The youngest doesn't
                  > actually contribute much that's meaningful. She mostly says
                  > things that she would have done anyway, like "eat lunch."
                  > But the other 6 do set meaningful goals for their days.
                  >
                  > > If not, let this thread serve two functions:
                  > >
                  > > 1) I am going to try this at home.
                  > >
                  > > 2) I will document stuff as it happens. This may then
                  > > help spread Scrum to the mainstream...
                  > > Or is that too lofty of a goal?
                  > >
                  > I strongly believe that software development is
                  > a team sport. And Scrum really helps us achieve that.
                  > I think family should be even more of a team, and
                  > I think that scrum, and improved communication
                  > can help there too.
                  >
                  > > Anyone interested in joining me on this?
                  > >
                  > Some problems we've had are:
                  > a) Some of the kids don't remember this morning, what
                  > goals they set yesterday morning or remember very clearly
                  > how they did. So we have the goal setting in the morning
                  > and the review in the evening.
                  >
                  > b) I talked about them doing this for months, but in
                  > practice, it doesn't happen yet unless I'm there and
                  > call everybody in.
                  > This means that the scrum is early in the morning
                  > before I leave for work and before they are really
                  > awake.
                  >
                  > c) We don't have sprints, yet. I expect we will,
                  > but I'm introducing one thing at a time.
                  >
                  > Feedback:
                  > As a result, I'm seeing them take ownership of things
                  > that I'have wanted them to all along.
                  >
                  > I heard that the other night, when I had an evening
                  > meeting, my 10-year old son spoke up at supper,
                  > "Well, it looks like we're not going to have a scrum
                  > with daddy, but today I ..."
                  > on his own initiative.
                  >
                  > Good luck Mike,
                  > Brad.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > To Post a message, send it to: scrumdevelopment@...
                  > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
                  > scrumdevelopment-unsubscribe@...
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