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Re: [scrumdevelopment] User stories feeling like CRUD tasks

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  • Nicholas Cancelliere
    These stories seem like they ve been created by the development team, or a very technical Product Owner (who was maybe a former developer)? For users stories I
    Message 1 of 6 , May 2, 2007
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      These stories seem like they've been created by the development team, or a very technical Product Owner (who was maybe a former developer)?
      For users stories I like the forumla Mike Cohn suggests in his book:
           {User} needs/can/wants to {some fn} so that/in order to {some business value}.
      Then to test you should be able to look at a story and say "Who's the user here," "What is it that want to do," "Why do they want to do that?"
      So lets look at the last one:
      Who is the user?   The administrator.
      What is it the want to do?  Delete projects.
      Why do they want do to that?  Because it's no longer needed in the system.
      So the story is okay, to be a little more clean I'd just maybe rewrite it to be:
           Administrators can delete projects no longer needed in the system.
      Writing the story this way then opens it up for discussion.  Well how do you know it's no longer needed?  Do we let them delete projects that have tasks still open/active?  Requirements should be captured as acceptance tests.

      I hope this helps.  I would try to go to the users and have them generate the stories.  The development team shouldn't be doing this.  If you're the BA - then it might be your job (working under the Product Owner) to be helping with this, I don't know.  I just know the developers are not the right folks to write stories.

      On 5/1/07, Bil Simser <bsimser@...> wrote:

      I'm struggling a bit with a team that has come to me with a set of
      what they belive are user stories for their project. Here's a sampling:

      "As an administrator I can create a project so that it can be used as
      a starting point for other project components"
      "As an administrator I can modify a project so that project level
      information is changed to reflect requirements of a project in
      a 'design' state"
      "As an administrator I can delete a project so that I can
      remove 'design' or 'test' projects no longer needed in the system"

      I'm pulling my hair out reading these things as all of the user
      stories are very data centric (save, load, delete, bulk load, change
      this, change that...). The intended use of the application they're
      building is data centric as well (it's a maintainenance tool for a
      data-driven program that manages widgets).

      Am I being too critical here or are there some examples or techniques
      that you guys have used in the past to try to curb this type of user
      story construction?


      Nicholas Cancelliere, Austin TX
      "The wide world is all about you: you can fence yourselves in, but you cannot for ever fence it out." -Gildor, Fellowship of the Ring (Lord of the Rings)
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