Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

RE: [scrumdevelopment] RUP and Agile

Expand Messages
  • Ken Schwaber
    Another short thought. For those of you who are ScrumMasters, is your job to remove impediments and to stop predators from detracting the team from its
    Message 1 of 49 , Dec 1, 2006
    • 0 Attachment

      Another short thought. For those of you who are ScrumMasters, is your job to remove impediments and to stop predators from detracting the team from its mission?

      Ken

       


      From: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com [mailto: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Ken Schwaber
      Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 7:43 AM
      To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [scrumdevelopment] RUP and Agile

       

      I have heard a rising number of complaints from people trying to learn how to use Scrum that this egroup seems geared toward discussions between experts, and often not about Scrum. I have invited the people who want to have methodology discussions to form a separate group to do so. The didn’t, but continued to use this group. As moderator, I am responsible for the integrity of this group to its stated purpose – exchange of information about how to use Scrum.

       

      I have to work with methodologists quite a bit, already. This egroup, however, is not the forum for that.

       

      I don’t believe that keeping to an agenda, keeping a focus, and being responsible for integrity is command and control. I believe that it is part and parcel of leadership, which I intend to do.

       

      Ken

       


      From: scrumdevelopment@ yahoogroups. com [mailto: scrumdevelo pment@yahoogroup s.com ] On Behalf Of David Morash
      Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 9:13 PM
      To: scrumdevelopment@ yahoogroups. com
      Subject: Re: [scrumdevelopment] RUP and Agile

       

      Holy command and control, the Emperor has no clothes! Seriously, if
      Scott was banned, I can't see how that fits with scrum principles, the
      focus on people as creators, i.e. they are thinking creative beings, not
      'resources' that do as they are told.

      To be honest, my lowly opinion about this situation is that sometimes
      agile thought leaders have to fight the tide of methodologists pitching
      what they may truly believe in. Big deal, not a tough cross to bear. I'm
      sure some of these agile thought leaders pitched methodologies in the
      past, and truly believed in them. I'd rather hear everybody's opinion
      and make up my own mind. I don't want people thinking for me, it pisses
      me off.

      Michael Vizdos wrote:

      > Scott is banned. And there is one moderator of this list. His list.
      >
      > Sigh.
      >
      > - mike
      > www.implementingscr um.com <
      href="http://www.implementingscrum.com">http://www.implemen tingscrum. com>

    • David A Barrett
      ... Those of us practicing Scrum on a daily basis, who look to this list for practical answers to their daily questions and actually implement ideas that they
      Message 49 of 49 , Dec 4, 2006
      • 0 Attachment
        On Fri Dec 1, 2006 Stephen Gordon wrote:

        >Where does this analogy to the daily scrum come from?
        >
        >The analogy to a sprint/release/project retrospective is much closer,
        >but virtually everyone here is a chicken with respect to whoever is
        >posting their question, so either analogy means we could say nothing
        >anyway.

        Those of us practicing Scrum on a daily basis, who look to this list for
        practical answers to their daily questions and actually implement ideas
        that they read her as part of their ongoing process of continual
        improvement, are pigs with regards to the health and continued value of
        this list. As Ken has explained, much of this RUP discussion was driven
        by people who don't practice Scrum and have some financial interest in
        diverting the attention of this group.

        >This list is among the most active online agile communities and is
        >discussing some of the most important issues in agile software
        >development. This community has thrived both here both because Scrum
        >has become the kernel of agile software development and because there
        >has been little if any explicit regulation of conversation.

        I agree with your assessment of the success of this group, but disagree
        entirely with your assessment of the cause of that success. This group
        is successful because Scrum works, delivers what it promises and this
        group is THE place to get quality information and advice on using Scrum.
        Oh yeah, and Ken hangs out here.

        >I am afraid that this late attempt to provide regulation will harm
        >this community. And I just do not see why is it even necessary? Just
        >because the discussion is a little too chaordic for a few newbies?
        >People looking for cut-and-dried robotic answers are ultimately not
        >going to find Scrum to their liking anyway. Newbies are going to need
        >to learn how to filter and adapt to constructive chaos pretty quickly
        >to make Scrum work in most environments. Any newby who cannot handle
        >that should just be reading static FAQs instead of this list.

        What a crock! Since when did keeping the discussion within some
        reasonable bounds equate to giving only "cut-and-dried robotic answers"?

        Personally, I don't think I'd consider myself a newbie. I've been
        running Scrum day in and day out for over two years now. I get this
        list in digest form, because dealing with 50-100 posts a day is a bit
        much. So I skim the digests, and try to hone in on the the stuff that
        might be relevant to me at work. Thousands of lines of posts dealing
        with a dead issue like RUP just makes it less likely I'll notice
        something of real interest to me.

        Why don't you put all the stuff comparing RUP to Scrum in a static FAQ
        so the rest of us can ignore it, and get on talking about Scrum?



        Dave Barrett,
        Lawyers' Professional Indemnity Company
      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.