RE: [scrumdevelopment] RUP and Agile
I have heard a rising number of complaints from people trying to learn how to use Scrum that this egroup seems geared toward discussions between experts, and often not about Scrum. I have invited the people who want to have methodology discussions to form a separate group to do so. The didn’t, but continued to use this group. As moderator, I am responsible for the integrity of this group to its stated purpose – exchange of information about how to use Scrum.
I have to work with methodologists quite a bit, already. This egroup, however, is not the forum for that.
I don’t believe that keeping to an agenda, keeping a focus, and being responsible for integrity is command and control. I believe that it is part and parcel of leadership, which I intend to do.
From: firstname.lastname@example.org [mailto:email@example.com] On Behalf Of David Morash
Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 9:13 PM
Subject: Re: [scrumdevelopment] RUP and Agile
Holy command and control, the Emperor has no clothes! Seriously, if
Scott was banned, I can't see how that fits with scrum principles, the
focus on people as creators, i.e. they are thinking creative beings, not
'resources' that do as they are told.
To be honest, my lowly opinion about this situation is that sometimes
agile thought leaders have to fight the tide of methodologists pitching
what they may truly believe in. Big deal, not a tough cross to bear. I'm
sure some of these agile thought leaders pitched methodologies in the
past, and truly believed in them. I'd rather hear everybody's opinion
and make up my own mind. I don't want people thinking for me, it pisses
Michael Vizdos wrote:
- On Fri Dec 1, 2006 Stephen Gordon wrote:
>Where does this analogy to the daily scrum come from?Those of us practicing Scrum on a daily basis, who look to this list for
>The analogy to a sprint/release/project retrospective is much closer,
>but virtually everyone here is a chicken with respect to whoever is
>posting their question, so either analogy means we could say nothing
practical answers to their daily questions and actually implement ideas
that they read her as part of their ongoing process of continual
improvement, are pigs with regards to the health and continued value of
this list. As Ken has explained, much of this RUP discussion was driven
by people who don't practice Scrum and have some financial interest in
diverting the attention of this group.
>This list is among the most active online agile communities and isI agree with your assessment of the success of this group, but disagree
>discussing some of the most important issues in agile software
>development. This community has thrived both here both because Scrum
>has become the kernel of agile software development and because there
>has been little if any explicit regulation of conversation.
entirely with your assessment of the cause of that success. This group
is successful because Scrum works, delivers what it promises and this
group is THE place to get quality information and advice on using Scrum.
Oh yeah, and Ken hangs out here.
>I am afraid that this late attempt to provide regulation will harmWhat a crock! Since when did keeping the discussion within some
>this community. And I just do not see why is it even necessary? Just
>because the discussion is a little too chaordic for a few newbies?
>People looking for cut-and-dried robotic answers are ultimately not
>going to find Scrum to their liking anyway. Newbies are going to need
>to learn how to filter and adapt to constructive chaos pretty quickly
>to make Scrum work in most environments. Any newby who cannot handle
>that should just be reading static FAQs instead of this list.
reasonable bounds equate to giving only "cut-and-dried robotic answers"?
Personally, I don't think I'd consider myself a newbie. I've been
running Scrum day in and day out for over two years now. I get this
list in digest form, because dealing with 50-100 posts a day is a bit
much. So I skim the digests, and try to hone in on the the stuff that
might be relevant to me at work. Thousands of lines of posts dealing
with a dead issue like RUP just makes it less likely I'll notice
something of real interest to me.
Why don't you put all the stuff comparing RUP to Scrum in a static FAQ
so the rest of us can ignore it, and get on talking about Scrum?
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