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Re: [scrumdevelopment] More newbie questions...

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  • Ron Jeffries
    ... I d break it up, make it smaller. One advantage to this is that lots of the subparts (make sure universe supports life) are much more important, and some
    Message 1 of 33 , Aug 1, 2003
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      On Friday, August 1, 2003, at 1:20:32 PM, nasapatrick wrote:

      > Okay, so I have a backlog item like -- Derive the universe, use back
      > of paper as necessary -- Well, not that bad. But say your backlog
      > item is a very large task like build a graphing tool that can display
      > graphs of all resource types, task types and availabilities from the
      > data source.

      > Which do you do?

      > - Break it into many product backlog items?
      > - Choose a sprint goal to implement only part of a backlog item?

      > As I understand it, we don't want to get into the old practice of
      > writing hundreds of traditional requirement shalls. But if the team
      > doesn't finish a backlog item, then you update the backload to
      > say "graph all types except the one we finished last sprint."

      > I know, I know... I am definitely a newbie on running project.

      I'd break it up, make it smaller. One advantage to this is that lots of the
      subparts (make sure universe supports life) are much more important, and
      some are less so (make lizards have hair).

      That's how we got where we are. Each of six sprints, just one simple task
      per sprint. And on the seventh sprint, He shipped it. If breaking it down
      was good enough for Him, it's good enough for me.

      Cheerfully ...


      Ron Jeffries
      www.XProgramming.com
      Wisdom begins when we discover the difference between
      "That makes no sense" and "I don't understand". --Mary Doria Russell
    • Mike Beedle
      ... Christian: But in Scrum we also show what is done every day. Remember, Daily Build and Daily Scrum are basic Scrum patterns. A while ago Jeff
      Message 33 of 33 , Aug 12, 2003
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        > From: "Christian Knott" <chrisknott@...>
        > With Scrum, we get to show what's been done every 30 days. That means
        > that the "alignment smell" gets to be put on view once a month
        > instead of, well, never in many other cases.

        Christian:

        But in Scrum we also show what is done every day. Remember,
        "Daily Build" and "Daily Scrum" are basic Scrum patterns.

        A while ago Jeff Sutherland pointed to an article written by
        Martin Fowler about continuous integration. All good and dandy.
        It is great to have things like Anthill produce automatic builds
        and run batches of unit tests. But it is also important for
        the Customer to interact with stable versions of the application
        and give feedback from hands-on experience on a daily basis.

        Also, there are things like Fit and Fitnesse that attempt to
        Automate "acceptance testing". Our style is to do this
        through "human interaction" -- there are some things that
        we feel are best leaving non-automated i.e. where we want humans
        involved.

        In our development we have perhaps hundreds if not thousands
        of builds every day, and thousands of check ins and updates,
        but we advertise at least one stable build daily for the customers
        to play with.


        > For the specific problem of fuzzily defined requirements for reports,
        > I'm with Ron, pretty much. My difference: do something. Anything.
        > Guestimate what the report should be, do it quickly, then mark it
        done.

        Well, "mark it done" might be pushing your luck.
        Some customers take it very offensively to "mark things done"
        if they are not done. But certainly, getting a report out
        for someone to see will start the feedback loops. (Don't forget
        to update your daily estimate to completion after some work
        and feedback are produced :-)


        > The donors/owners will soon start griping, and you can convert
        > their gripes into requirements that go on the product backlog.

        True.

        - Mike
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