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In search of "The Scrum Hour"

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  • Deb
    In Toronto, we re looking for ways to sell Scrum to Management. I m thinking we need a tool in our arsenal, something like the extreme hour - a short
    Message 1 of 9 , Jun 11, 2003
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      In Toronto, we're looking for ways to sell Scrum to Management. I'm
      thinking we need a tool in our arsenal, something like "the extreme
      hour" - a short immersion exercise that allows people to experience
      some of the flow and synergy of collaborative, agile work using Scrum.

      Has anyone done something like this? Maybe a 1-3 hour exercise? I'm
      thinking of something like the simulations we did with Ken in the
      ScrumMaster Certification course.

      Would love to hear about past (or planned) experiences.
      :-)

      deb
    • ffej12342003
      I would add that the best way to sell this to management is to show the superior ROI and/or visibility to potential ROI that Scrum provides. Management likes
      Message 2 of 9 , Jun 11, 2003
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        I would add that the best way to sell this to management is to show
        the superior ROI and/or visibility to potential ROI that Scrum
        provides. Management likes predictability, but in the absence of
        that, knowing that there is a process in place to maximize ROI and to
        provide frequent (every 30 days) potentially shippable product is a
        very compelling story. One could even argue that Scrum provides a
        level of predictability in that every 30 days there will be a
        potentially shippable increment of code. Much like our exercise with
        the commissioner, we need to put this in terms that management can
        relate to and feels is important.

        Jeff.
        --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Deb" <deborah@h...> wrote:
        > In Toronto, we're looking for ways to sell Scrum to Management. I'm
        > thinking we need a tool in our arsenal, something like "the extreme
        > hour" - a short immersion exercise that allows people to experience
        > some of the flow and synergy of collaborative, agile work using
        Scrum.
        >
        > Has anyone done something like this? Maybe a 1-3 hour exercise? I'm
        > thinking of something like the simulations we did with Ken in the
        > ScrumMaster Certification course.
        >
        > Would love to hear about past (or planned) experiences.
        > :-)
        >
        > deb
      • Bryan Zarnett
        In some circumstances though ROI is not understood or considered by management. In other circumstances, the term has different meaning to different people
        Message 3 of 9 , Jun 11, 2003
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          In some circumstances though ROI is not understood or considered by management. In other circumstances, the term has different meaning to different people based on their experiences or level in the corporate ladder. Part of the "sell" is to make sure that everyone is on the same playing field concerning what ROI and what are its aspects. Return on Expectations is also something that needs to be explored.

          The 30 day shipment is only good if we can relate it back in terms of their specific viewpoint on investment and expectation. Using our canned response is not always the most effective point of origin. (as you mention at the end of your message)

          On Wednesday, June 11, 2003, at 09:56AM, ffej12342003 <jeff.pink@...> wrote:

          I would add that the best way to sell this to management is to show
          the superior ROI and/or visibility to potential ROI that Scrum
          provides. .
        • Ken Schwaber
          Which management are you trying to sell this to. Business management, or systems management. Different sales approaches. Ken ... From: ffej12342003
          Message 4 of 9 , Jun 11, 2003
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            Which management are you trying to sell this to. Business management, or
            systems management. Different sales approaches.
            Ken

            -----Original Message-----
            From: ffej12342003 [mailto:jeff.pink@...]
            Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2003 9:56 AM
            To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [scrumdevelopment] Re: In search of "The Scrum Hour"


            I would add that the best way to sell this to management is to show
            the superior ROI and/or visibility to potential ROI that Scrum
            provides. Management likes predictability, but in the absence of
            that, knowing that there is a process in place to maximize ROI and to
            provide frequent (every 30 days) potentially shippable product is a
            very compelling story. One could even argue that Scrum provides a
            level of predictability in that every 30 days there will be a
            potentially shippable increment of code. Much like our exercise with
            the commissioner, we need to put this in terms that management can
            relate to and feels is important.

            Jeff.
            --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Deb" <deborah@h...> wrote:
            > In Toronto, we're looking for ways to sell Scrum to Management. I'm
            > thinking we need a tool in our arsenal, something like "the extreme
            > hour" - a short immersion exercise that allows people to experience
            > some of the flow and synergy of collaborative, agile work using
            Scrum.
            >
            > Has anyone done something like this? Maybe a 1-3 hour exercise? I'm
            > thinking of something like the simulations we did with Ken in the
            > ScrumMaster Certification course.
            >
            > Would love to hear about past (or planned) experiences.
            > :-)
            >
            > deb



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          • Deb
            ... management, or ... Yes, absolutely agreed. Actually, we are still addressing the question of who is the Customer when we sell Scrum - hope to have a
            Message 5 of 9 , Jun 11, 2003
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              --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Ken Schwaber"
              <ken.schwaber@v...> wrote:
              > Which management are you trying to sell this to. Business
              management, or
              > systems management. Different sales approaches.
              > Ken

              Yes, absolutely agreed. Actually, we are still addressing the
              question of "who is the Customer" when we "sell Scrum" - hope to have
              a discussion soon on that.

              For now, let's say IT Management - the senior person who'll have to
              champion the methodologies in use and who'd need to be comfortable
              with how Scrum handles resource planning, reporting and deliveries.
            • Mike Beedle
              ... Schwaber ... Business management, or ... Yes, absolutely agreed. Actually, we are still addressing the question of who is the Customer when we sell
              Message 6 of 9 , Jun 11, 2003
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                --- Deb <deborah@...> wrote:
                ---------------------------------
                --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Ken
                Schwaber"
                <ken.schwaber@v...> wrote:
                > Which management are you trying to sell this to.
                Business
                management, or
                > systems management. Different sales approaches.
                > Ken

                Yes, absolutely agreed. Actually, we are still
                addressing the
                question of "who is the Customer" when we "sell Scrum"
                - hope to have
                a discussion soon on that.


                Deb:

                My only advice is:

                whenever possible, sell Scrum, or anything
                else for that matter, to _business management_.

                Business managers, are always the people that write
                and sign the checks and they still understand "A > B"

                and "these are referenceable facts and/or accounts".

                IT management, in general has problems believing
                that things work as advertised, specially when
                dealing with "methodologies" -- even when presented
                with lots of empirical evidence, including references.
                Also, IT management tends to think in terms of
                "funny money", and then almost always have to sell
                their ideas to a business sponsor anyhow.

                Just my 2 cents,

                - Mike
              • Deb
                ... Good point. I ll include that in our discussion of who is the customer . Thanks! deb
                Message 7 of 9 , Jun 12, 2003
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                  --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Mike Beedle <beedlem@e...>
                  wrote:
                  > Deb:
                  >
                  > My only advice is:
                  >
                  > whenever possible, sell Scrum, or anything
                  > else for that matter, to _business management_.
                  >
                  > Business managers, are always the people that write
                  > and sign the checks and they still understand "A > B"
                  >
                  > and "these are referenceable facts and/or accounts".
                  >
                  > IT management, in general has problems believing
                  > that things work as advertised, specially when
                  > dealing with "methodologies" -- even when presented
                  > with lots of empirical evidence, including references.
                  > Also, IT management tends to think in terms of
                  > "funny money", and then almost always have to sell
                  > their ideas to a business sponsor anyhow.
                  >
                  > Just my 2 cents,
                  >
                  > - Mike

                  Good point. I'll include that in our discussion of "who is the
                  customer". Thanks!
                  deb
                • David J. Anderson
                  Deb, [With apologies to Ken and Mike for using their group for self-promotion...] I agree with Jeff. Senior management in large companies are persuaded only by
                  Message 8 of 9 , Jun 12, 2003
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                    Deb,

                    [With apologies to Ken and Mike for using their group
                    for self-promotion...]

                    I agree with Jeff. Senior management in large
                    companies are persuaded only by ROI.

                    My forthcoming book "Agile Management for Software
                    Engineering" on Prentice Hall PTR shows you how to
                    demonstrate the ROI to senior management in big
                    corporations for Scrum (as well as XP and FDD). The
                    book will be published in September. I also have a
                    Yahoo! Group "agile management". I'd be happy to talk
                    more about it over there.

                    Cheers,

                    David



                    --- ffej12342003 <jeff.pink@...> wrote:

                    I would add that the best way to sell this to
                    management is to show
                    the superior ROI and/or visibility to potential ROI
                    that Scrum
                    provides. Management likes predictability, but in the
                    absence of
                    that, knowing that there is a process in place to
                    maximize ROI and to
                    provide frequent (every 30 days) potentially shippable
                    product is a
                    very compelling story. One could even argue that Scrum
                    provides a
                    level of predictability in that every 30 days there
                    will be a
                    potentially shippable increment of code. Much like our
                    exercise with
                    the commissioner, we need to put this in terms that
                    management can
                    relate to and feels is important.

                    Jeff.
                    --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, "Deb"
                    <deborah@h...> wrote:
                    > In Toronto, we're looking for ways to sell Scrum to
                    Management. I'm
                    > thinking we need a tool in our arsenal, something
                    like "the extreme
                    > hour" - a short immersion exercise that allows
                    people to experience
                    > some of the flow and synergy of collaborative, agile
                    work using
                    Scrum.
                    >
                    > Has anyone done something like this? Maybe a 1-3
                    hour exercise? I'm
                    > thinking of something like the simulations we did
                    with Ken in the
                    > ScrumMaster Certification course.
                    >
                    > Would love to hear about past (or planned)
                    experiences.
                    > :-)
                    >
                    > deb




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                  • Harry Forsdick
                    I am investigating disciplines for level of effort estimation in software development. I am interested in hearing about approaches / systems that people find
                    Message 9 of 9 , Jun 14, 2003
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                      I am investigating disciplines for level of effort estimation in software development.  I am interested in hearing about approaches / systems that people find effective.  I will summarize the responses I get to the list.
                       
                      Thanks,
                       
                           Harry
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