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Ill informed and stupid discussion on Agile over at Slasdot.

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  • David H.
    http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/06/28/1459245 Some of the comments are plain idiotic -d -- Sent from gmail so do not trust this communication.
    Message 1 of 7 , Jun 28, 2006
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      http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/06/28/1459245

      Some of the comments are plain idiotic

      -d

      --
      Sent from gmail so do not trust this communication.
      Do not send me sensitive information here, ask for my none-gmail accounts.
    • sceptre1067
      In other words... it s a discussion on Slashdot about coding and development. 25% of the responders, maybe have coded in the real world Some subset of that
      Message 2 of 7 , Jun 28, 2006
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        In other words... it's a discussion on Slashdot about coding and development.
        25% of the responders, maybe have coded in the "real world"
        Some subset of that number are not bitter about their jobs, so can actually think clearly and add to the discussion (less then half of the above percentage imo).
         
        The rest are "kids" either physically or mentally who think development is using the coolest tools on the coolest projects and everyting else is crap.
         
        Classic Slashdot...

         
        On 6/28/06, David H. <dmalloc@...> wrote:

        http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/06/28/1459245

        Some of the comments are plain idiotic

        -d

        --
        Sent from gmail so do not trust this communication.
        Do not send me sensitive information here, ask for my none-gmail accounts.


      • Keith Sader
        Yes, but some are telling. A few comments in a poster describes his interaction with management who wouldn t budge on time/scope issues. The question
        Message 3 of 7 , Jun 28, 2006
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          Yes, but some are telling.  A few comments in a poster describes his interaction with management who wouldn't budge on time/scope issues.  The question becomes, in my mind, what do you do, beside updating your resume, when you have a manager who won't/can't deal with reality?

          http://developers.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=189786&cid=15622120
          ...

          "So you'll have to lose some of the remaining itteration milestones. You'll have to drop features."

          "But we like all the features we've come up with."

          "But adding features adds time. You've known that since the beginning."

          "We've known this has to ship for the holiday season and you promised us we could have extra features. You're just going to have to work more overtime. Fortunately you're overtime exempt so that won't cost us anything to get this project back on schedule."

          "It is on schedule. You just changed the schedule by adding features that were identified along the way."

          "You told us your wonderful "XP" model would let us do that. We gave you the chance to try this new method under the understanding we got these benefits."

          "And you do."

          "Good. Then make your schedule."

          "We are mak-"

          "No arguments. This discussion is over. You promised you could deliver the extra features. You're now behind schedule for the holiday season. You're just going to have to crunch. End of discussion."


          On 6/28/06, David H. <dmalloc@...> wrote:


          thanks,
          --
          Keith Sader
          ksader@...
          http://www.saderfamily.org/roller/page/ksader
        • Ron Jeffries
          ... Sorry, boss. The data tell the truth. If you re wise, you ll trust the data, not promises you make for us, or even promises you think we have made to you.
          Message 4 of 7 , Jun 28, 2006
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            On Wednesday, June 28, 2006, at 1:51:18 PM, Keith Sader wrote:

            > "No arguments. This discussion is over. You promised you could deliver the
            > extra features. You're now behind schedule for the holiday season. You're
            > just going to have to crunch. End of discussion."

            Sorry, boss. The data tell the truth. If you're wise, you'll trust
            the data, not promises you make for us, or even promises you think
            we have made to you. We're producing X many stories per week. There
            are Y weeks until the holiday season. I'd suggest you might want to
            do the math.

            Ron Jeffries
            www.XProgramming.com
            The greatest mistake we make is living in constant fear that we will make one.
            -- John Maxwell
          • sceptre1067
            The only thing I would add to that is... how did the boss get the idea that the promise, for the addtional features, was made... In my meager experience it is
            Message 5 of 7 , Jun 29, 2006
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              The only thing I would add to that is... how did the boss get the idea that the promise, for the addtional features, was made...
               
              In my meager experience it is either, as suggested, a stupid boss. (Just contracted for one of those...) Or did the lead not manage the expectations of their boss.
               
              Either way, classic story that has been gone over thousands of times before. In the case of the stupid boss, I just start to send email out to a wider circle (e.g. one level up and/or direct to the customer) with updates on the project status in neutral, but direct terms.
               
              I'm amazed, at least here in parts of the midwest, how scared people are to do that, cause it might produce more problems...

               
              On 6/28/06, Ron Jeffries <ronjeffries@...> wrote:
              ._,___

              On Wednesday, June 28, 2006, at 1:51:18 PM, Keith Sader wrote:

              > "No arguments. This discussion is over. You promised you could deliver the
              > extra features. You're now behind schedule for the holiday season. You're
              > just going to have to crunch. End of discussion."

              Sorry, boss. The data tell the truth. If you're wise, you'll trust
              the data, not promises you make for us, or even promises you think
              we have made to you. We're producing X many stories per week. There
              are Y weeks until the holiday season. I'd suggest you might want to
              do the math.

              Ron Jeffries
              www.XProgramming.com
              The greatest mistake we make is living in constant fear that we will make one.
              -- John Maxwell


            • Jim Hyslop
              ... Hash: SHA1 ... I never could see the point of slashdot. Your subject line sums up just about every discussion I ve ever seen there, no matter what subject
              Message 6 of 7 , Jun 30, 2006
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                David H. wrote:
                > Some of the comments are plain idiotic

                I never could see the point of slashdot. Your subject line sums up just
                about every discussion I've ever seen there, no matter what subject it was.

                - --
                Jim Hyslop
                Dreampossible: Better software. Simply. http://www.dreampossible.ca
                Consulting * Mentoring * Training in
                C/C++ * OOD * SW Development & Practices * Version Management
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              • Malcolm Anderson
                Slashdot is a useful service if you know how to read it. The tricky thing is that Slashdot is the arena in which trolling is played, the real trick being how
                Message 7 of 7 , Jul 5, 2006
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                  Slashdot is a useful service if you know how to read it.

                  The tricky thing is that Slashdot is the arena in which trolling is
                  played, the real trick being how to tell a trolling post from an
                  informative post (quick hint, if you are at all irritated, it was a
                  troll, if you are about to pound out a hostile response, it was a
                  GREAT troll).

                  This was the first link I could find to the great and wonderful
                  "slashdot howto troll guide"
                  http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=25284&cid=2748872

                  Long story short, a troll is scored by the raw number of responses it
                  generates, "plain idiotic" posts tend to score higher than "well
                  thought out informative posts".


                  On 6/28/06, David H. <dmalloc@...> wrote:
                  > http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/06/28/1459245
                  >
                  > Some of the comments are plain idiotic
                  >
                  > -d
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