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621RE: [scrumdevelopment] RUP XP Plug-In

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  • Mike Cohn
    Oct 7, 2002
      My comment that this will be "bad for XP" was because I think it will
      cause lots of companies to experiment with XP and find that it doesn't
      work for them. For example, a company may decide it likes Simple Design
      and Refactoring but not TDD or Pair Programming. They'll try that and
      probably finds it degenerates into hacking. They'll then spread the word
      that XP didn't work "when we tried it." One of my big concerns is that
      we're entering a period where we're going to hear lots of failure
      stories about people who "tried" agile methods but didn't really try
      them:

      --"We did XP except that silly testing stuff, the pair programming and
      the on-site customer and in the end our product wasn't what the market
      wanted and it was buggy!"
      --"We tried Scrum except for those dumb daily meetings and after two
      six-month long sprints our product wasn't very good."
      --"We left the prototyping out of DSDM and it didn't work for us."

      There's a discontinuity in one's thinking between agile and plan-driven
      processes and I think new adoptees either need to "get it" or they need
      to try agile "by the book" and do everything prescribed exactly as
      prescribed until they do get it. Because RUP is such a "pick what you
      need" tool/methodology it seems clear that users of the plugin will
      bring that mindset to it and some will undoubtedly pick some horrible
      combinations of XP + their current process.

      You're right though--if someone eventually gets XP (any agile process)
      after having done it by faith (but completely) they will become very
      firm believers. And I'm sure the plugin will lead to that type of
      experience for many new XP converts. My comment was about those who use
      the plugin but order from it as though it were a restaurant menu.

      --Mike



      -----Original Message-----
      From: Lowell Lindstrom [mailto:lindstrom@...]
      Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 8:02 AM
      To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [scrumdevelopment] RUP XP Plug-In

      >
      > Bringing all this back to your conclusion: The Plugin is
      > great for RUP, bad for XP. I totally agree with you on this. XP will
      be
      tried by some
      > organizations who wouldn't have tried it otherwise. It will help
      somewhat
      but not all
      > the way (XP will be viewed as a failure by them) but their engineering
      practices
      > will be improved by some of the XP practices.
      >

      I have always believed that doing the practices, but not "getting it,"
      is
      better than not doing the practices. If someone is not going to "get
      it"
      through the literature and does not have an audience with someone who
      can
      explain it, then the best shot is to try it and see it work.

      What you are describing as bad for XP is the status quo for XP (and any
      other method). The Plug-In won't have much of an effect on that, no
      matter
      how well or poorly written.

      Many teams do XP "not all way." My understanding is that SCRUM is often
      used in cases where a team won't do XP all the way. Many have used
      parts
      of XP to improve their engineering practices. How is this bad for XP?
      I
      think its great! Not everyone is going to have this instant revelation
      on
      how wonderful emergence and self-organization are. Some will need to
      see
      the practices work before they are open to such a revelation. I've
      observed
      some cases, where the revelation is much stronger having come from a
      real
      experience versus an intellectual activity.

      My belief is that anything that gets people exposed to the values and
      principles and gets them trying the practices is good for XP and Agile.


      All that said, how to express the values in a non-interactive media is
      very
      difficult and something we'll continue to work hard on.

      Thanks again for the feedback!

      Lowell
      ====================
      Lowell Lindstrom
      Object Mentor, Inc | www.objectmentor.com | 1-800-338-6716
      lindstrom@...


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