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55719Re: [scrumdevelopment] Re: Weakness in Product Management?

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  • Charles Bradley - Scrum Coach CSP CSM PSM
    Sep 8, 2012

      That's an interesting story.  I could imagine a situation where the PO reviewing the test cases could be seen as inappropriately micro-managing the Dev Team, but there would have to be several other factors at play(more context) that you did not mention, so I'll assume those factors didn't exist.  Also, I have seen cases in the past of a PO who has a technical background trying to poke into the "How?", which as we all know, is owned by the Dev Team.

      > evidence that I had explained the user stories correctly,

      My first curiosity question about your situation would be: When you collaborated with the Dev Team, did you and the Dev Team come to a shared understanding as to the Story Tests before development began? 

      My second curiosity question would be: Were you, as the PO, "accepting" stories during the sprint, as soon as the Dev Team thought the story was "Done?"

      Charles Bradley

      From: jamesjhawkins <jhawkins@...>
      To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Friday, September 7, 2012 2:04 AM
      Subject: [scrumdevelopment] Re: Weakness in Product Management?

      The following reminded me of a "discussion" I had with a Scrum Coach

      --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Alan Dayley <alandd@...> wrote:
      > In my experience, product management sets
      > up the product definition, hands that off to the development
      > team/group/department and then walks away.  The problems come from this
      > lack of consistent connection between product management and product
      > development.

      I said that the Product Owner should review the test cases, during the Sprint. I also said that I had done so when I was doing product owning.

      The coach yelled at me that I wasn't allowed to comment on the quality of the Scrum's work or tell them how to do their jobs.

      The main reason that I wanted to review the test cases was to get evidence that I had explained the user stories correctly, and that the stories had been understood by the Scrum. If I found that they were testing the wrong things, then I knew that I hadn't explained the user story well enough.

      Reviewing the test cases seems like an efficient way of doing this, since it doesn't entail the Scrum producing any additional documentation. Instead, I'm looking at a document that they will have to produce anyway.

      To me, one of the fundamentals of Agile is engagement, what the previous poster called consistent connection. Everybody has to engage, including the Product Owner.

      Stepping back, my impression of the problem in product management is that nobody wants to get their hands dirty and do actual analysis. They're all too busy thinking strategically when they should focus on execution with quality.

      Cheers, Jim


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