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3300RE: [scrumdevelopment] SCRUM tools (was process with other method ologies)

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  • Mike Beedle
    Apr 9, 2004

      You are right. Maybe we agree more than disagree.

      The only point I want to make is that in Scrum
      development we use "time remaining" to
      show the status of the project i.e. it doesn't
      matter how much the team worked on something --
      what matters is how much work is left to do for the

      However, if you also have a "budgeting, reporting
      or costing control" need, knowing how much time
      things really took might also be important to you,
      the ScrmMaster and/or the Product Owner.

      This is where the "updated real time required" to
      accomplish something comes into play. The Scrum team
      typically cares less about this but it all depends
      on the situation. If you are working on a
      fix-bid contract, it matters. If you have a
      budget constraint, it matters. If you are working
      with internal/external resources that have cost
      associated with them, it matters, etc.

      - Mike

      Powder skiing is one of the best things in life...

      --- Eric Chamberlain <Eric.Chamberlain@...>


      Hmmm. Seems like we agree and yet disagree. I am a
      bit confused. You
      agree with me that the "original estimate" doesn't
      mean much but then you
      think it is fine that it needs to be changed if a task
      extends beyond its
      estimate. Why require change to something that
      doesn't mean much? You
      agree with me that the "hours remaining" provides the
      best picture of the
      situation--so is your happiness with Xplanner in
      *spite* of its requirement
      that you update relatively meaningless stats (the task
      estimates)? I think
      I must be missing something here or else I just have a
      lower irritation
      threshold w.r.t. the tools. In that case, we all agree
      on what is important,
      what Xplanner requires, and what busy work we're
      comfortable with in
      exchange for the benefits of the tool (and Xplanner
      *does* have benefits, to
      be sure).

      So if this is just a subjective thing, its probably
      best if this thread just
      dies here, eh?

      == Eric ==

      -----Original Message-----
      From: Mike Beedle [mailto:beedlem@...]
      Sent: Friday, April 09, 2004 5:24 AM
      To: scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [scrumdevelopment] SCRUM tools (was
      process with other method


      I respectfully disagree. If a developer says that it
      will take 4 more
      hours, you need to re-evaluate where you are i.e.
      re-estimate the original

      On the day-2-day work, the "original estimate" doesn't
      need mean much -- it
      just got things started.
      What you need is clear picture, or the best picture
      you can get of "hours
      remaining" and trade-offs due to priority/capability.

      The cummulative effect across the board from the
      "picture taken" among all
      developers could send the overall estimates into a
      "danger zone".

      Btw, we use XPlanner and we like it a lot,

      - mb

      --- Eric Chamberlain <Eric.Chamberlain@...>

      Per-task burndown is actually a running task estimate.
      If I say I have 4
      hours left for a 20 hour task, that "4 hours" is an
      estimate (although
      probably pretty accurate in that range). If the next
      day I say I have 8
      hours left on that same task, that means that
      something didn't go right but
      it should not require that I re-estimate the task to
      24 or 28 hours long. A
      Scrum tool should not require the task re-estimate,
      Xplanner does.

      == Eric ==

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