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17775Re: Valid uses of this list (was: RUP and Agile)

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  • Ken Schwaber
    Dec 1, 2006
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      Jeff … understanding the difference in the underpinnings between RUP
      and Agile would help you understand why they are incompatible. It is
      like the difference between lean and traditional manufacturing. When
      you try to accommodate one to the other's vocabulary, etc. what
      happens is the entire change of philosophy and resultant change in
      action is undercut. Mapping Scrum to RUP helps nobody using Scrum and
      helps RUP stay alive far longer than its track record would otherwise
      support. RUP has done enough damage on its own without us providing it
      additional legs.

      Ken


      --- In scrumdevelopment@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Langr <jeff@...> wrote:
      >
      > Quoting Clinton Keith <ckeith@...>:
      > > I support it. The explosion of religious discussions that arise from
      > > things like RUP, AUP, WTF, etc create noise with respect to the
      scope of
      > > this list:
      > > "For updates and interchange between the users of Scrum and those just
      > > beginning to use Scrum. Restricted to those who want to build products
      > > and software using Scrum. For discussion on how to do so. Not for
      > > methodologists, but for practitioners."
      > >
      > > I joined for this narrow focus. There are plenty of lists where
      one can
      > > hear the debates in full.
      >
      > I too joined it to figure out how to "build products and software
      > using Scrum," and "discussion on how to do so." Unfortunately, since
      > Scrum answers only part of the challenge, such discussion would
      > necessarily need to involve other process. Not religious debate, mind
      > you, but open discussion about techniques.
      >
      > As an example, I appreciated Ambler's posting of an article where
      > someone discussed how they were able to mesh Scrum and RUP ideas--a
      > potential practical solution. That was a response to Mr Schwaber's
      > statement that that RUP and Scrum are contrary, not mappable. Which I
      > think is an emphatic and religious methodologist's stance, not one of
      > someone trying to figure out how to make things work.
      >
      > Jeff Langr
      > http://langrsoft.com
      > Agile Java, Crafting Code With Test-Driven Development
      >
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