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Re: Cub Basic Leader Training - online?

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  • JWoughter
    The real pros when it comes to education are universities, and on that level, online education is booming. Are there distractors who hate it? You bet. Is the
    Message 1 of 25 , Nov 26, 2006
      The real pros when it comes to education are universities, and on
      that level, online education is booming.

      Are there distractors who hate it? You bet.

      Is the education one gets online second rate? Depends. Point being
      that there are many very good online programs.

      I've taken a masters of arts program from an excellent university
      (the name doesn't really matter) and the education was first rate.

      For us to comlpletely dismiss online education, I think, would be a
      mistake. It's come to the point that anybody with internet access
      can access online education (eliminating the need for district
      computers) and if done right can significantly increase the level of
      training among our leaders.

      Perhaps in many districts the program is running well and there is a
      sufficient density to make the desired training happen. But I wonder
      if this is the exception ...

      John Woughter
      Charmelagne District, Transatlantic Council
    • Margo Mead
      Not to mention that I find the current training materials somewhat useless. I took Cubmaster training and came away from it having learned not much. I
      Message 2 of 25 , Nov 26, 2006
        Not to mention that I find the current training materials somewhat useless.
        I took "Cubmaster" training and came away from it having learned "not much."
        I expected to spend much more time on what my duties were, how I functioned
        with the Pack Committee and the den leaders, and what a pack meeting should
        be like. I am now a trainer and I try to enrich my courses with the kind of
        info that I was seeking, but there is only so much time for that when you
        are following the syllabus. I would not have a problem with the courses
        being online just as Youth Protection and Fast Start are. As others have
        mentioned, encouraging them to go to Roundtable is probably one of the best
        ways for them to get interaction with other leaders and examples of what
        pack meetings and den meetings should be like.



        (I should probably mention that I had been an advancement chair for 6 years
        prior to becoming Cubmaster-yes I have three sons-and that I READ THE CUB
        SCOUT LEADER BOOK before I went to training. Crazy I know.)



        Regards--

        Margo Mead

        Portland, Oregon

        meadclan@...

        www.beadiecritters.com

        www.geocities.com/meadfamily

        www.geocities.com/worldkrahenbuhl

        _____

        From: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scouter_t@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
        Of Dan Kurtenbach
        Sent: Saturday, November 25, 2006 10:57 PM
        To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Cub Basic Leader Training - online?



        I sometimes wonder if we get so caught up in how we deliver training that we

        forget the main point: leaders who have the skill and knowledge to put on
        a great Scouting program. How they get that skill and knowledge -- "live"
        classes, online, DVD, self-study, observation, roundtables, talking with
        other leaders -- should be irrelevant.



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Robert O'Donnell
        Sounds great...that would allow rural leaders to get trained (Scoutreach goal) or to help time famished people who are trying to manage their schedules
        Message 3 of 25 , Nov 26, 2006
          Sounds great...that would allow rural leaders to get trained (Scoutreach goal) or to help time famished people who are trying to manage their schedules balancing family and the many hours devoted to Scouting. Since councils are also occasionall frustrated trying to get leaders trained it could be a boon to them as well.

          I think it could be a grand idea for all kinds of Scout training. At the very least the idea of DVD's and E-training could be used for pre-course and therefor make live training with other leaders more effective and meaningful. If the DvD or e-training can cover teh basics then the courses can be excercises and fellowship based activities. Sitting through 9 hours of lectures has never been something I look forward to. BSA traing is actually quite good and the message is really important..whatever ramps up the quality and efficiency of the hours spent in leader courses would be valuable to the leaders, the training chairs, and most importantly the kids.

          My wife is more than a little annoyed that I lost another weekend to training instead of spending it with her. I want the training, each time I go for training or roundtables I see the benefit in the increased quality of the program I deliver to the kids. It would be nice to also not have to apolgize for the time it takes.

          If troops could get DVD's for their leaders some leaders may want to use them for refreshers as well. Good idea!


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Teresa Hall
          John, that brings us a very interesting angle. Being in higher ed myself, it occurs to me that most online education in THAT world is not just viewing and
          Message 4 of 25 , Nov 26, 2006
            John, that brings us a very interesting angle. Being in higher ed myself, it
            occurs to me that most online education in THAT world is not just viewing
            and passing a test on an online video (ie, like SSD and Safety Afloat). It
            typically includes a way for online discussion with others in the class and
            the instructor, and is spread out over a period of time.

            Would integrating some of these features make online CSLST better? Well, I
            think it might.

            *How about an online discussion group attached to the LST online
            presentation where the leaders could ask questions and get responses from a
            team of experienced trainers?

            *How about having the students do a bit of "homework" like building a plan
            for a meeting (as is part of the regular syllabus) and have them submit it
            and get feedback from someone on the training team before they can take the
            test and get their course completion?

            I'm sure there are even better ways to make online CSLST a good learning
            experience, and you can help think of them. I would volunteer my time to
            monitor and support such an effort, and I'll bet most of you would, as well.


            Because I think we ALL feel that face to face instruction is better, but
            most of us also realize that we will never be able to reach all of our
            audience that way. And if the Cub Scout division was actually able to
            periodically monitor the discussion groups, like they do some of the big
            discussion groups, well then we might have a way to ensure that some urban
            legends are stopped.

            Thoughts? Ideas?

            Teresa Hall
            Vulcan District Cub Training Coordinator
            Greater Alabama Council


            On 11/26/06, JWoughter <john.woughter@...> wrote:
            >
            > The real pros when it comes to education are universities, and on
            > that level, online education is booming.
            >
            >


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Gerry Moon
            I m 100% in agreement with you - Position Specifics for RETURNING leaders - moving from Tiger Leader to Den Leader, Den Leader to Weeb Leader, etc. is sheer
            Message 5 of 25 , Nov 27, 2006
              I'm 100% in agreement with you - Position Specifics for RETURNING
              leaders - moving from Tiger Leader to Den Leader, Den Leader to Weeb
              Leader, etc. is sheer torture - spending an afternoon (or evening)
              seeing the same old (and I DO mean OLD!) videos over again and the
              only difference is a couple of powerpoint slides and handouts.

              Ideally, an "upgrade" course would serve a purpose- review the major
              points, offer info on program updates, and train on the specifics of
              the new position - as in compare and contrast - while keeping
              the "original" course (with updated syllabus and AV materials) for
              newcomers. It tortures me to torture the leaders who stay on board
              and watch them squirm when they are back for the third or fourth
              time to sit thru again what's essentially the same stuff. If we had
              it together, training would be a thing to be ENJOYED, not ENDURED -
              and we wouldn't have to spend so much time begging leaders to come
              back and keep current. No wonder we have resistance.

              Apologies for the rant - I know I'm preaching to the choir.

              Gerry Moon
              Orlando, FL

              --- In scouter_t@yahoogroups.com, Brant Lippincott <brant@...> wrote:
              >
              > no, no, 1000 times no!!!!
              >
              > I could possibly see NLE done that way, but only if there is a
              test, so we could measure some sort of actual viewing of the
              material....
              >
              > I have my quarell with LST (especially the cub portion), where
              we show the same videos to all sections, so they see it as a tiger,
              again as a wolf, then again as a webelos....
              >
              > BUT, there is nothimg like actual human interaction for these
              courses. It helps understand the material.
              >
              > I've heard that NLE will be done, but I sure hope that LST is
              not on the drawing board.
              >
              > For the Boys,
              > Brant
              >
              > PS: I think there is a "virtual campfire" picture on the web
              (Kevin??). THIS board is the virtual campfire conversation....
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • kveach@comcast.net
              I think that this statement is a MAJOR part of why new leaders dont get it . MY Pack s cc send out a WHOLE packet of stuff for new leaders to peruse and we
              Message 6 of 25 , Nov 27, 2006
                I think that this statement is a MAJOR part of why new leaders dont get it . MY Pack's cc send out a WHOLE packet of "stuff" for new leaders to peruse and we tell them to do the online fast start get the leader book and read it. Sound complete right ( we do tell em to attend nle and specific also)

                I still have leaders come back with goofy ?'s and when I ask them if they have looked at any of this info they say ......... well I haven't had the chance I at this point throw my hands in hte air and go ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHH What do I have to do .i.e. I had a parent ready to take over Cm for me. the first parent registering he spoke to the info he relayed was that a joining wolf had to earn his tiger b4 he could work on wolf .I was stunned what can nyou say I know these new leaders are trying and I have to commend them for stepping up but What as CM can I do to hammer in the whole training thing and the recources that are available for them to get with the program . AHHHHH ok thanks sorry for the rant just extremely frustrated
                Just my 100 cents
                YIS
                Kris
                >
                >
                >
                > (I should probably mention that I had been an advancement chair for 6 years
                > prior to becoming Cubmaster-yes I have three sons-and that I READ THE CUB
                > SCOUT LEADER BOOK before I went to training. Crazy I know.)
                >
                >
                >
                > Regards--
                >
                > Margo Mead
                >
                > Portland, Oregon
                >
                > meadclan@...
                >
                > www.beadiecritters.com
                >
                > www.geocities.com/meadfamily
                >
                > www.geocities.com/worldkrahenbuhl
                >
                > _____
                >
                > From: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scouter_t@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                > Of Dan Kurtenbach
                > Sent: Saturday, November 25, 2006 10:57 PM
                > To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Cub Basic Leader Training - online?
                >
                >
                >
                > I sometimes wonder if we get so caught up in how we deliver training that we
                >
                > forget the main point: leaders who have the skill and knowledge to put on
                > a great Scouting program. How they get that skill and knowledge -- "live"
                > classes, online, DVD, self-study, observation, roundtables, talking with
                > other leaders -- should be irrelevant.
                >
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >




                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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