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Re: [Scouter_T] Commissioner Training

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  • Scouter Chuck
    Roy Fisher wrote... ... I am currently a Member at Large for the District Committee. I also attend RT, and used to be on the RT staff -- until someone
    Message 1 of 15 , Jan 22, 2006
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      Roy Fisher wrote...

      > I don't think I read if you are currently "wearing other hats". That
      > would make difference to me.

      I am currently a "Member at Large" for the District Committee.

      I also attend RT, and used to be on the RT staff -- until someone
      decided they wanted "new blood".

      I do not serve directly with a unit, nor do I have any other
      position in the District. I do help with occasional training
      as requested (and qualified).

      Hope this helps...

      YiS,

      Chuck Bramlet -- Phoenix, Az. ----- mailto:antelope95@...
      I "used to be" an Antelope! -- WEM-10-95
      Thunderbird District -- Grand Canyon Council
      District Committee Member at Large
      -------------------------------------------------------------------
      "The main thing is to keep the main thing the main thing"
      -- Stephen R. Covey
      -------------------------------------------------------------------
    • Dave Loomis
      Your question is a bit like, How long is a piece of string? There are no other information on which to make the choice. If you are in a district with the
      Message 2 of 15 , Jan 22, 2006
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        Your question is a bit like, "How long is a piece of string?" There
        are no other information on which to make the choice.

        If you are in a district with the ideal three units for each
        Commissioner, AND you happen to serve a pack, troop, and crew "owned" by
        the same organization, your time outlay will be less, than if you
        commission three units in different towns and programs or even the same
        program. Ideally you should visit a unit's meeting and committee
        meeting every month, and work on any problems that you observe. This
        commits you to three committee meetings, three unit meetings, a
        Commissioner meeting, and ideally a Round Table meeting each month. So
        eight meetings month.

        Since you Commission the units that will logically "graduate" Scouts
        to their troop or crew, you will have less time spent working with the
        troops and crews towards which, separate packs and troops will feed. If
        you Commission three packs, troops, or crews you learning curve will be
        shorter, since I expect Commissioners to take the Leader Specific
        Training for each program they Commission, and are not fully trained.
        You simply can't walk the walk if you can't talk the talk. However long
        term Scouters becoming Commissioners from Crews, usually already know
        enough about troop and pack operations that this training isn't as
        important to your success.

        If your district isn't well represented by Commissioners so that you
        either pile on more units, or see them less, your evening load is going
        to be heavier, until you get some more Commissioners. This is ONE
        reason why National rates councils, and council's rate districts on
        their unit/commissioner ratio, as this overly heavy Commissioner load
        can burn Commissioners out very quickly.

        And hard as it may be to believe, Commissioning a unit from which you
        came is just asking for problems. No matter how well regarded you were
        in your unit, when you try to work it as one of your units, you'll still
        be regarded as good old Bruce, or Bruce from the troop, not Bruce who's
        come to us to help us run a better program for the Scouts. This is the
        major reason why most folks frown on Commissioning a unit were you used
        to serve.

        So, how long is your piece of string. You have committed yourself to
        eight monthly meetings, plus any additional training you need to get up
        to speed on the programs with which you are the least familiar. In Cub
        Scouting, that takes at least one whole day to get NLE, Fast Start, and
        Cubmaster training. If there is time and the breakout sessions permit
        it you could also squeeze in one of the Den Leader Training sessions.
        Boy Scout Leader Essentials take at least a night, a day, and a weekend
        to become Scoutmaster trained, and another night if you also take Troop
        Committee Challenges. Venturing is the easy one, only one day, although
        Powder Horn Training is a lot of fun.

        This gives you some idea of what it takes to become well enough versed
        in your programs to be effective. This is all in addition to either two
        evenings or an entire weekend day at Commissioner Training. I list the
        one day option although it doesn't give you actual practice in visiting
        a unit meeting with another Commissioner to practice working with and
        determining what, if any, problems the unit may be experiencing.

        Generally District Commissioners feel you out a bit, and won't lumber
        you with too many units until you get up to speed with the job, but
        often your boss won't have any choice in the matter. If s/he has 45
        units, and ten Commissioners, to carry the load, someone is going to
        have to monitor additional units until things get better, or give the
        more capable units less help for a bit.


        Dave
        ADC & BS Training Chair
        Historic District
        Daniel Webster Council, BSA

        Scouter Chuck wrote:
        > Don Wilson wrote (an extended description of the UC position).
        >
        > The next question is, what is the time commitment? 2-3 nights a
        > week? 5 nights a week? 7 days a week?
        >
        >
        > YiS,
        >
        > Chuck Bramlet


        To reply, click on the address below.

        Dave Loomis mailto:dloomis.nh.ultranet@...
        245 Union St. (603) 431 5342
        Portsmouth, NH 03801-4349
      • NeilLup@aol.com
        ... With respect, Dave, I believe this expectation is way over the top for a Unit Commissioner. In fact, if I were a committee member and the Unit
        Message 3 of 15 , Jan 23, 2006
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          In a message dated 1/23/06 12:31:27 AM, dloomis.nh.ultranet@... writes:


          > Ideally you should visit a unit's meeting and committee
          > meeting every month, and work on any problems that you observe.  This
          > commits you to three committee meetings, three unit meetings, a
          > Commissioner meeting, and ideally a Round Table meeting each month.  So
          > eight meetings month.
          >

          With respect, Dave, I believe this expectation is way over the top for a
          Unit Commissioner. In fact, if I were a committee member and the Unit
          Commissioner showed up every committee meeting, I'd wonder why the
          district/council didn't trust me.

          If we have expectations like that for every Unit Commissioner, we won't
          have many Unit Commissioners.

          Oh, that's right, we don't have many Unit Commissioners :)

          I stand by my earlier estimate as a minimum acceptable for doing the job.
          One meaningful contact with the unit each month (meeting, campout, phone
          call, etc.) and one meeting. One can do more and may decide to do more.
          But I'd much rather have a full Commissioner's staff doing that rather than
          only have the small number of people doing what you specified.

          Best wishes,

          Neil Lupton


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Dave Loomis
          You re right. I should have said a unit OR committee meeting each month. Thanks, Dave ... To reply, click on the address below. Dave Loomis
          Message 4 of 15 , Jan 23, 2006
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            You're right. I should have said a unit OR committee meeting each month.

            Thanks,

            Dave

            NeilLup@... wrote:
            > In a message dated 1/23/06 12:31:27 AM, dloomis.nh.ultranet@... writes:
            >
            >>
            >>Ideally you should visit a unit's meeting and committee
            >>meeting every month, and work on any problems that you observe. This
            >>commits you to three committee meetings, three unit meetings, a
            >>Commissioner meeting, and ideally a Round Table meeting each month. So
            >>eight meetings month.
            >>
            >
            >
            > With respect, Dave, I believe this expectation is way over the top for a
            > Unit Commissioner. In fact, if I were a committee member and the Unit
            > Commissioner showed up every committee meeting, I'd wonder why the
            > district/council didn't trust me.
            >
            >
            > Best wishes,
            >
            > Neil Lupton
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >


            To reply, click on the address below.

            Dave Loomis mailto:dloomis.nh.ultranet@...
            245 Union St. (603) 431 5342
            Portsmouth, NH 03801-4349
          • John Halter
            Actually, if you have three units, you could realistically visit a committee meeting and unit meeting each month and still only be visiting each unit once a
            Message 5 of 15 , Jan 24, 2006
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              Actually, if you have three units, you could realistically visit a
              committee meeting and unit meeting each month and still only be visiting
              each unit once a quarter.

              Thank you,

              John Halter
              Pack Trainer
              Pack 230 Apopka Florida
              www.pack230.com
              Assistant Scoutmaster
              Troop 936 Longwood Florida
              Wekiwa District Cub Scout Roundtable Commissioner
              www.wekiwa.org
              "PackDude" at www.Scoutboard.com
              ...and a good 'ol Bobwhite too! SR442



              Dave Loomis wrote:
              > You're right. I should have said a unit OR committee meeting
              > each month.
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