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Re: [Scouter_T] Who can present...

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  • Judy Yeager
    ... From: Robbie DeYoung To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 2:46 PM Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Who can present... The climb on
    Message 1 of 81 , Dec 8, 2005
    • 0 Attachment
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Robbie DeYoung
      To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 2:46 PM
      Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Who can present...


      The climb on Safely course is very similar to the safety afloat and safe swim defenses courses. My understanding for the Climb on Safety course is that you must have a knowledge of the training syllabia. Because this is a non technical course it does not require some one with extensive background in this are to teach it. The climb on safety course just covers BSA policies it does not in any way teach people how to climb that is what the qualified instructors are for. Again this is just my understanding of the rules and what has been explained to me. To help get more people trained I have ran through the training going into a little more detail about a couple of things with a couple of other people that have been recommended by the district executive. I also let them know that if there are any questions to give me a call and I will answer them or find the answers.
      Robbie DeYoung
      Catalina Council Climbing Director.

      Michael Brown <emb021@...> wrote:
      All-

      Who is allowed to present the Trek Safely and Climb-on Safely courses?
      I have copies of the syllabi for both courses, and they just indicate
      that experienced trainers can do it, without any specialized
      knowledge. That is, as these are not skills courses you don't need
      climbing/trekking experts to do them.

      So, who qualifies those to teach these courses?

      Michael Brown






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    • Mark Landry
      I only took the first 21st Century course in our area, having had 2 others cancelled out from under me in my home council. But I am hooked, thanks, in large
      Message 81 of 81 , Dec 14, 2005
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        I only took the first 21st Century course in our area, having had 2 others
        cancelled out from under me in my home council. But I am hooked, thanks, in
        large part, to my troop guide. Thanks, Hugh (even though you are a bear)!!!



        To second Hugh's comments, there are ways to deal with issues of
        insufficient course directors or staff. The area director is a great
        resource. I will also second the concept of pulling in scouters from other
        councils, to serve on staff. It gives them experience, and gives the local
        staff members a view from the outside. At the recent course director's
        conference in Atlanta, issues about the new rules were raised and discussed.
        I am not one to exclude anyone who is willing to commit to the time
        requirements that being a WB staffer requires. That may be a misstep, but
        since the restrictions are there, let's see if we can make them work.



        Mark C. Landry

        An Ornery Owl from SR-498

        Council Training Chair

        Southeast Louisiana Council



        _____

        From: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scouter_t@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
        Of hhhyman3
        Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 12:23 AM
        To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [Scouter_T] Staffing - Is It a WB Issue or a Council Issue?



        I don't know about you, but I have received 27 messages today in my
        email box regarding staffing for the 21st Century Wood Badge. A
        number of them dealt with some extreme circumstances (i.e. only one
        21st Century course in the council since the new design, attending the
        traditional course in 1988 and wondering about possibility to serve on
        staff, etc.) As Mike Lupton (and I believe someone else) pointed out,
        there are avenues to review such extremities through an exemption
        process with the Area Coordinator. One would suspect that persons who
        have achieved that level of distinction in the current training are
        well prepared to handle the effects of the politicization involved in
        staffing a course and are also committed to the new training continuum
        (like it or not, it is the direction the BSA is taking).

        I am a graduate of the traditional BS course which I attended in 1996.
        My first WB staff was in 2002 during the first implementation of the
        21st Century syllabus in my council when I served as a Troop Guide. I
        have to tell you, it would have been easier having been a participant
        of the new syllabus. A large part of our staff development was spent
        "creating" a new staff coreography that was, I'm guessing, assumed
        somewhat in the staff development process of the previous syllabus.
        In addition, another large part of the staff development process was
        spent introducing and studying the team development concept to all of
        us who had only been exposed to the 11 points of leadership version.
        If we had been exposed to the principles of the new course previously,
        our time could have been better spent on enhancing the experience of
        the participants and training in ticket development which might have
        enhanced taking the skills learned by participants back to the
        Scouting units of the participants (don't get me wrong, I think it was
        a tremendously successful course!)

        Being a doctoral student in Management, I can tell you that a large
        part of the training I receive to prepare me to be teach management on
        the collegiate level involves socializing me to the current methods of
        teaching and to current management thoughts and principles. As I
        progress through my academic career, I will have to be exposed to and
        become knowledgeable of new advances in the field. In some way, the
        same socialization needs to be involved in the training of BSA
        trainers, regardless of the training they are conducting, and these
        trainers will have to continue to be current on the training paradigms
        of the time.

        Yes, there are those who may have attended the previous version of WB
        who might easily adapt to the new syllabus, but I would suspect that
        exposure to the new syllabus (either through participation or previous
        staffing) prepares one to better handle the tasks required of a staff
        member in the new course and educate the participants of the course.

        One other point regarding the "Good Ole Boy" network that was rampant
        in the traditional BS WB course. Its been 4 years since the
        introduction of the new syllabus. Also, as someone pointed out, one
        of the reasons for the syllabus change was due to the
        "uncontrollability" of the old BS course staff. My "somewhat limited"
        tenure (been an adult leader for 15 years) has shown me the effect of
        leadership generations in the council. I am more than willing to
        admit that my council might be an exception (part of the my council's
        WB "Good Ole Boy network" has gone on to be a CD for one of the
        experimental 21st Century courses, 2 to staff an experimental course,
        and 1 to be an Area Coordinator - all can be assumed to be committed
        to the learning objectives of the new syllabus.) Maybe its a
        perspectival issue, but I see persons being asked on staff for the new
        course that wouldn't have even been considered during the last version
        (and these persons have done exceptional jobs).

        But again my basic suspect, you have to ask yourself whether the
        prevalence of the GOB network is due to council leadership. How many
        times has your Scout Executive, VP-Program, and Chairman-Training
        changed since the 2001 introduction? Change normally advances from
        the top. Failure to include new members into a team, as has been
        identified from research based off of Tuckman's model of
        Forming-Storming-Norming-Performing and as recognized in the 21st
        Century WB introduction of diversity as a leadership skill, creates
        Groupthink which had long-term detrimental harm on an organization.
        If persons occupying these positions are not changing, new generations
        are not being incorporated into the council level which will have far
        more reaching effects than the staffing of WB. If this is the case, I
        would recommend you spending your efforts more on revitalizing the
        council as a whole rather than worry who is serving on staff for WB.

        Just the $0.02 from a 3-time staffer of the new course.
        Hugh Hyman






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