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What happened to "Effective Teaching"?

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  • Ken.Walker@mscsoftware.com
    Sorry for the cross-post, but this seems to fit in two categories. I don t want to raise the new vs old WB discussion. However, what happened to the old
    Message 1 of 8 , Feb 10, 2004
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      Sorry for the cross-post, but this seems to fit in two categories.
      I don't want to raise the new vs old WB discussion. However, what happened
      to the old "Effective Teaching" skill from the BSLWB and the CSTWB? It's
      not in the WB21C syllabus (or carefully disguised as something else). I am
      told the subject is not covered in the new Trainer Development Conference
      (I haven't seen the new course, just the old TtT.)

      The Effective Teaching points were:
      - Learning objectives
      - Discovery
      - Teaching-Learning
      - Application
      - Evaluation/Review objectives

      "For teaching to be effective, learning must take place."

      Since I am not a teacher or trainer by trade, I found this to be an
      invaluable tool when I first started Scout training ("working my ticket" -
      LOL). Now, it seems to be gone from the landscape. Anyone know how or where
      this fits in the training landscape? Or, is this "old school" and replaced
      with a better concept? (I sure don't know - as I said, I'm not a teacher or
      trainer!)

      Thoughts?
      Thanks in advance for your feedback.

      -Ken Walker
      T-259, Plano, TX
    • Sean Scott
      Ken asked: However, what happened to the old Effective Teaching skill from the BSLWB and the CSTWB? Ken, You ll find the Effective Teaching
      Message 2 of 8 , Feb 10, 2004
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        Ken asked: <snip> However, what happened to the old "Effective Teaching"
        skill from the BSLWB and the CSTWB? <snip>


        Ken,

        You'll find the Effective Teaching contained as part of the Communication
        presentation given by the Troop Guides in the patrol setting, I believe on
        day 2.

        YiS,
        Sean
      • Dan Kurtenbach
        ... Since I am not a teacher or trainer by trade, I found this to be an invaluable tool when I first started Scout training ( working my ticket - LOL). Now,
        Message 3 of 8 , Feb 10, 2004
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          Ken Walker wrote:
          >>"For teaching to be effective, learning must take place." <break>
          Since I am not a teacher or trainer by trade, I found this to be an
          invaluable tool when I first started Scout training ("working my ticket"
          - LOL). Now, it seems to be gone from the landscape. Anyone know how or
          where
          this fits in the training landscape? Or, is this "old school" and
          replaced with a better concept? (I sure don't know - as I said, I'm not
          a teacher or trainer!)<<

          At least in our basic training/position specific courses, there is no
          way to measure whether learning has taken place.

          Dan Kurtenbach
          Fairfax, VA
        • Dave Loomis
          They cover part of it in BSA 5000, when they discuss Lecture, Demonstrate, Discuss, Perform as means of teaching. What they don t cover, however, is the need
          Message 4 of 8 , Feb 10, 2004
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            They cover part of it in BSA 5000, when they discuss Lecture,
            Demonstrate, Discuss, Perform as means of teaching.

            What they don't cover, however, is the need to retrain as you go
            along. The learning curve is somewhat like a breaking wave. You
            start off rapidly but soon come to the end of any effective teaching.
            Forgetting has a curve like the inside face of the same wave,
            almost straight down for a bit, and then level off at a little bit of
            retention. Reteaching starts at that point of minimal retention and
            builds back up to the peak of the wave again. Each time it takes a
            bit less to get to the top, and more is remembered for a longer period
            of time.

            Dave

            Dave

            Ken.Walker@... wrote:

            >
            >
            >
            > I am told the subject is not covered in the new Trainer Development Conference
            > (I haven't seen the new course, just the old TtT.)
            >
            > The Effective Teaching points were:
            > - Learning objectives
            > - Discovery
            > - Teaching-Learning
            > - Application
            > - Evaluation/Review objectives
            >
            > "For teaching to be effective, learning must take place."
            >
            > Since I am not a teacher or trainer by trade, I found this to be an
            > invaluable tool when I first started Scout training ("working my ticket" -
            > LOL). Now, it seems to be gone from the landscape. Anyone know how or where
            > this fits in the training landscape? Or, is this "old school" and replaced
            > with a better concept? (I sure don't know - as I said, I'm not a teacher or
            > trainer!)
            >
            > Thoughts?
            > Thanks in advance for your feedback.
            >
            > -Ken Walker
            > T-259, Plano, TX
            >
            >
            >
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            >
            > .
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            --

            To reply, click on the mailto: address below.

            Dave Loomis mailto: dloomis.nh.ultranet@...
            245 Union St. (603) 431 5342
            Portsmouth, NH 03801-4349
          • Scott&Rita Eliason
            Ken, It is still in council Junior Leader Training Conference, I believe at National Junior Leader Instructor Conference, and in the staff development sessions
            Message 5 of 8 , Feb 10, 2004
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              Ken,

              It is still in council Junior Leader Training Conference, I believe at
              National Junior Leader Instructor Conference, and in the staff development
              sessions for Trainer Development Conference. Apparently, nationally the BSA
              feels only youth will need this information?

              In spite of the national trend toward believing that all volunteers are
              slackers and don't wish or are not able to be trained, our council has put
              it back into the Trainer Development Conference, along with several other
              changes, such as teaching our instructors how to prepare a lesson plan, and
              allowing for an actual chance to practice a short presentation. We just ran
              the first one on 7 Feb 04. It still needs some fine tuning, but we gained
              tons of time by eliminating the BSA 500 and using the time for additional
              training sessions and to provide spirited transitions from one session to
              the next. If all goes well, we may have a version that could be uploaded to
              this list's files sections within the month.

              Scott Eliason
              Advisor, Crew 391
              Venturing Leader Training Coordinator, Aquila District
              Course Director, WE1 609-2-04, Chief Seattle Council

              -----Original Message-----
              From: Ken.Walker@... [mailto:Ken.Walker@...]
              Sent: Tuesday, 10 February 2004 14:18
              To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [Scouter_T] What happened to "Effective Teaching"?





              Sorry for the cross-post, but this seems to fit in two categories.
              I don't want to raise the new vs old WB discussion. However, what happened
              to the old "Effective Teaching" skill from the BSLWB and the CSTWB? It's
              not in the WB21C syllabus (or carefully disguised as something else). I am
              told the subject is not covered in the new Trainer Development Conference
              (I haven't seen the new course, just the old TtT.)

              The Effective Teaching points were:
              - Learning objectives
              - Discovery
              - Teaching-Learning
              - Application
              - Evaluation/Review objectives

              "For teaching to be effective, learning must take place."

              Since I am not a teacher or trainer by trade, I found this to be an
              invaluable tool when I first started Scout training ("working my ticket" -
              LOL). Now, it seems to be gone from the landscape. Anyone know how or where
              this fits in the training landscape? Or, is this "old school" and replaced
              with a better concept? (I sure don't know - as I said, I'm not a teacher or
              trainer!)

              Thoughts?
              Thanks in advance for your feedback.

              -Ken Walker
              T-259, Plano, TX



              For subscription and delevery options send a message to:
              scouter_t-help@yahoogroups.com

              Scouting The Net - http://www.arkie.net/scouting/
              Yahoo! Groups Links
            • MALesniak@aol.com
              I taught the How Adults Learn section of the TDC course in January. I think that the Effective Teaching is built into this section through the Adult
              Message 6 of 8 , Feb 10, 2004
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                I taught the "How Adults Learn" section of the TDC course in January. I
                think that the "Effective Teaching" is built into this section through the Adult
                Learning Cycle and Adult Learning Model.

                Instead of focusing on "teaching"...it's termed as understanding the
                "learning". I think the basic information is the same from a different perspective.

                Michelle Lesniak
                Council Training Chair
                Moraine Trails Council, Butler, PA


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Ken.Walker@mscsoftware.com
                To all that responded- Thanks for the feedback. It s always fun to post a question, and get such a variety of insights and opinions. That s why I love these
                Message 7 of 8 , Feb 12, 2004
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                  To all that responded-

                  Thanks for the feedback. It's always fun to post a question, and get such a
                  variety of insights and opinions. That's why I love these groups. Everyone
                  has different background and experiences, and sees things a bit
                  differently. It reminds me of the old line about economists--
                  Q: Know what you get when you line all the economists in the country
                  end-to-end?
                  A: They all point in a different direction. <grin>

                  Now, after all the "incoming", I guess I'm due for one response.

                  First an apology - it seems "Effective Teaching" may have been in the old
                  Train the Trainer materials (pre-TDC). I was looking at my retired BSLWB
                  syllabus, and noticed a reference to materials from TtT:
                  - "The Effective Teaching Process"
                  - "Training Period 9 - Effective Teaching"

                  It's especially ironic- as I don't remember them at TtT (and there's no
                  mention in my course notes). Either I slept through it, or maybe it was a
                  "staff thing"??

                  Someone mentioned "BSA 5000" (or 500?) -- I'll show my ignorance -- what
                  the heck is that? Is it a local council term for something? I also liked
                  the point about "learning capacity" and "relearning requirements". That's
                  one reason a Scout can tie every TFC knot it November, but struggle with it
                  in March. "Relearning" also frequently happens the first time you try teach
                  something you think you know. LOL

                  Someone mentioned "How Adults Learn" at TDC. Can any old-timers comment -
                  is this similar stuff? I'm curious, because apparently some councils are
                  adding the old "Effective Teaching" segment to their TDC. So, these two
                  facts seem inconsistent. (Sorry, trying to understand, not start a fight).

                  It's nice to hear some councils are addressing the "gap". It's OK to take
                  an important topic out of one course. But, if it's important, it needs to
                  go somewhere else. IMHO - TDC is the most logical place for this topic -
                  there's more exposure to more Scouters.

                  One member mentioned the TG's "Communication" patrol presentation in the
                  new WB21C. I don't have the syllabus, so can't quote chapter and verse (one
                  of those new WB rules). However, I've done the presentation, and my
                  materials have minimal references to "teaching". About the closest I have
                  is the topic "Good Teaching", which includes: a) Goal, b) Have Need, c)
                  Multi-sensory, d) Hands-on, e) Practice f) Encourage & Praise. There's also
                  "How a Scout Learns", which covers: a) Teaching/learning, b)Tested, c)
                  Reviewed (BoR), d) Recognized (CoH). Both are good points, but are not
                  covered in the same depth as a single topic.

                  Another member observed that we don't evaluate "learning" in a district
                  training course. True, there's no skills test, but shouldn't an instructor
                  present learning objectives at the beginning, and then review at the end?
                  This gives the students a chance to say: "can you go back and explain this
                  again".

                  It's ironic someone mentioned this subject is still in Jr Leader Training
                  and then another member mentions the "teaching module" in the new Nat'l JLT
                  course. It sounds like a step in the right direction, especially if we let
                  the adults have it too.

                  That's enough trouble for one night....thanks again for all the feedback.
                  It sounds like lots of folks are thinking about this subject.

                  -Ken
                • Mullaney, Peter [AMSTA-AR-WES]
                  Ken, The BSA 500 is a game built into Trainer Development Conference (TDC). Attendees are divided up into teams, each team gets a car for the oval track
                  Message 8 of 8 , Feb 13, 2004
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                    Ken,
                    The "BSA 500" is a 'game' built into Trainer Development Conference
                    (TDC).
                    Attendees are divided up into teams, each team gets a car for the oval track

                    (game board). After different segments there are 'quizes' and depending on
                    correctness of answers you get to move your car ahead a certain number of
                    spaces.

                    Pete M.
                    Trainer and Member of Council Training Committee
                    Patriots' Path Council, N.J.

                    From: Ken.Walker@... [mailto:Ken.Walker@...]
                    Subject: [Scouter_T] Re: What happened to "Effective Teaching"?


                    Someone mentioned "BSA 5000" (or 500?) -- I'll show my ignorance -- what
                    the heck is that? Is it a local council term for something?



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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