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Scouter-T is for TRAINING

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  • Ida Lively
    I get blasted for asking for help that is not on a TRAINING issue, merely a Camporee (read: BOY SCOUT TRAINING -- one of the METHODS), but yet, this video talk
    Message 1 of 15 , Feb 3, 2004
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      I get blasted for asking for help that is not on a TRAINING issue, merely a
      Camporee (read: BOY SCOUT TRAINING -- one of the METHODS), but yet, this
      video talk passes with no reprisals. Interesting.
    • Jim
      A Scout(er) is courteous, kind, and friendly as well as helpful . I find nothing is the last post to support this premise , dare I say values. Yours in
      Message 2 of 15 , Feb 3, 2004
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        A Scout(er) is "courteous, kind, and friendly" as well as "helpful". I
        find nothing is the last post to support this "premise", dare I say values.

        Yours in Scouting,
        Jim

        Ida Lively wrote:

        >I get blasted for asking for help that is not on a TRAINING issue, merely a
        >Camporee (read: BOY SCOUT TRAINING -- one of the METHODS), but yet, this
        >video talk passes with no reprisals. Interesting.
        >
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      • Chris Jacobi
        Ida, thank you for reminding people that this is about Training Chris (I didn t send a reminder because I didn t want to be a curmudgeon twice in a row.)
        Message 3 of 15 , Feb 3, 2004
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          Ida,
          thank you for reminding people that this is about Training
          Chris

          (I didn't send a reminder because I didn't want to be
          a curmudgeon twice in a row.)


          At 06:55 AM 2/3/2004 , Ida Lively wrote:
          >I get blasted for asking for help that is not on a TRAINING issue, merely a
          >Camporee (read: BOY SCOUT TRAINING -- one of the METHODS), but yet, this
          >video talk passes with no reprisals. Interesting.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >For subscription and delevery options send a message to:
          > scouter_t-help@yahoogroups.com
          >
          >Scouting The Net - http://www.arkie.net/scouting/
          >
          >
          >Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >To visit your group on the web, go to:
          > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/scouter_t/
          >
          >To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          > scouter_t-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          >
          >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
          > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        • Scouter Chuck
          Chris wrote.. ... [snip] ... At the risk of starting a wildfire, I can t think of a much better training for a prospective Scoutmaster than to take Fast Start,
          Message 4 of 15 , Feb 3, 2004
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            Chris wrote..

            > thank you for reminding people that this is about Training
            [snip]
            > At 06:55 AM 2/3/2004 , Ida Lively wrote:
            > >I get blasted for asking for help that is not on a TRAINING issue,
            > >merely a Camporee (read: BOY SCOUT TRAINING -- one of the
            > >METHODS), but yet, thisvideo talk passes with no reprisals.
            > >Interesting.

            At the risk of starting a wildfire, I can't think of a much better
            training for a prospective Scoutmaster than to take Fast Start, NLE,
            and then sitting and watching this film.

            I posted this here because, as strange as it may seem, there are
            people on this list who aren't on any of the others that many of us
            mutually belong to. This film has been a high interest item for at
            least the last 5 years on various forums, and this was an attempt to
            help.

            Also, I think that certain people tend to get a bit wound up in what
            exactly is or is not on topic. They push their views, which tend to
            infect others, and soon the list is dead because we're all afraid to
            post for fear of being flamed for going off topic.

            Arguments like this on the forum are one reason why, even though I
            still maintain my registration there, I rarely read or post to Scouts-
            L anymore. I am on this list for the same reason that the rest of
            you folks are, and that is to get info about how and what to use to
            accomplish training of the new leaders. I am not especially
            particular about how I get that information, or where it comes from
            as long as it's useful and is compatible with the values of the
            program.

            For further information, please read the quote in my sig.

            YiS,

            mailto:antelope95@...
            I "used to be" an Antelope! -- WEM-10-95
            Thunderbird District -- Grand Canyon Council
            Committee Member at Large, Roundtable Staff -- Member DNRC
            -------------------------------------------------------------------
            "The main thing is to keep the main thing the main thing"
            -- Stephen R. Covey
            -------------------------------------------------------------------
          • R Fisher
            ... The really neat thing about Scout Training is that it covers such a wide variety of topics. I do find it interesting that the film in question is
            Message 5 of 15 , Feb 4, 2004
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              > From: Scouter Chuck [mailto:antelope95@...]
              >
              > Also, I think that certain people tend to get a bit wound up in what
              > exactly is or is not on topic. They push their views, which tend to
              > infect others, and soon the list is dead because we're all afraid to
              > post for fear of being flamed for going off topic.
              >
              > Arguments like this on the forum are one reason why, even though I
              > still maintain my registration there, I rarely read or post
              > to Scouts- L anymore. I am on this list for the same reason
              > that the rest of
              > you folks are, and that is to get info about how and what to use to
              > accomplish training of the new leaders. I am not especially
              > particular about how I get that information, or where it comes from
              > as long as it's useful and is compatible with the values of the
              > program.
              >
              > For further information, please read the quote in my sig.
              >
              > -------------------------------------------------------------------
              > "The main thing is to keep the main thing the main thing"
              > -- Stephen R. Covey

              The really neat thing about "Scout Training" is that it covers such a
              wide variety of topics. I do find it interesting that the film in
              question is regularly shown at the Philmont *Training* Center on family
              night, so there is some connection to "training" even if it is a
              stretch. ;>)

              Other than that, relax and don't be afraid to use the <Delete> key as
              often as *You* consider necessary.

              YiS

              Roy Fisher
            • Duane Betteen
              I would like to reply on the subject of the movie in question. This movie makes a very good training aid since it covers alot of what scouting is about. We
              Message 6 of 15 , Feb 4, 2004
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                I would like to reply on the subject of the movie in
                question. This movie makes a very good training aid
                since it covers alot of what scouting is about. We
                have used clips from the movie to reinforce the point
                of a topic of training. But I can also understand the
                frustration of the person who asked about Camporees.
                If they are planed right they are not only fun for the
                scouts but are also good for training not just for
                leaders but the scouts themselves.
                Sites like these can be a good sources of information
                for those who have not many resources to go to. When
                someone starts to argue or get pushy about topics then
                I think that they have lost the big picture. A person
                has to remember is that the majority of the leaders in
                scouting are just volunteers, they don't have to do it
                but they do it with the idea that they can make a
                difference. The other part of the big picture is the
                scouts themselves from Tigers to Eagles. They are
                what scouting is all about. As adults we can get
                wrapped up in our own egos and loose part of the
                picture. Training in scouting should always be an
                ongoing process, always growing and evolving and
                should be present every day. These scouts today are
                very possibly future leaders of tomorrow and they
                should be given the best chance to make that goal in
                life.

                Duane Betteen (I am a Bear)
                ADC, Lake Agassiz District
                Northern Lights Council


                --- R Fisher <ghotier@...> wrote:
                > > From: Scouter Chuck [mailto:antelope95@...]
                > >
                > > Also, I think that certain people tend to get a
                > bit wound up in what
                > > exactly is or is not on topic. They push their
                > views, which tend to
                > > infect others, and soon the list is dead because
                > we're all afraid to
                > > post for fear of being flamed for going off topic.
                > >
                > > Arguments like this on the forum are one reason
                > why, even though I
                > > still maintain my registration there, I rarely
                > read or post
                > > to Scouts- L anymore. I am on this list for the
                > same reason
                > > that the rest of
                > > you folks are, and that is to get info about how
                > and what to use to
                > > accomplish training of the new leaders. I am not
                > especially
                > > particular about how I get that information, or
                > where it comes from
                > > as long as it's useful and is compatible with the
                > values of the
                > > program.
                > >
                > > For further information, please read the quote in
                > my sig.
                > >
                > >
                >
                -------------------------------------------------------------------
                > > "The main thing is to keep the main thing the main
                > thing"
                > > --
                > Stephen R. Covey
                >
                > The really neat thing about "Scout Training" is that
                > it covers such a
                > wide variety of topics. I do find it interesting
                > that the film in
                > question is regularly shown at the Philmont
                > *Training* Center on family
                > night, so there is some connection to "training"
                > even if it is a
                > stretch. ;>)
                >
                > Other than that, relax and don't be afraid to use
                > the <Delete> key as
                > often as *You* consider necessary.
                >
                > YiS
                >
                > Roy Fisher
                >
                >


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              • tsbeb@att.net
                Just wondering who on camp staff are you training as a LNT trainer? I understand that some camps are having their nature directors take the trainer course. I
                Message 7 of 15 , Mar 1, 2004
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                  Just wondering who on camp staff are you training as a LNT trainer? I understand that some camps are having their nature directors take the trainer course.

                  I have been contacted by some camps where the camp director is wanting to take a course.

                  In L,F,S
                  Ted Beblowski
                  Leave No Trace State Advocate - New York
                  Leave No Trace Master Educator
                  Twin Rivers Council
                  Training Staff
                  Camping Committee


                  ----------



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • MALesniak@aol.com
                  Our Nature Director at Cub Resident Camp always covers the Leave No Trace philosophy. I was not aware of a special trainer course that is available. Is it
                  Message 8 of 15 , Mar 1, 2004
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                    Our Nature Director at Cub Resident Camp always covers the Leave No Trace
                    philosophy. I was not aware of a special "trainer course" that is available. Is
                    it new to go with all the more recent publications?

                    Michelle


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • tsbeb@att.net
                    Michelle The LNT trainer course can only be given by a Master Trainer. I believe that it will be required by 2005 to have a LNT Trainer on staff at all summer
                    Message 9 of 15 , Mar 1, 2004
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                      Michelle

                      The LNT trainer course can only be given by a Master Trainer. I believe that it will be required by 2005 to have a LNT Trainer on staff at all summer camps to run workshops once a week for Scout and Cub leaders. The Master course is given only by groups approved by NOLS or The AMC on the East Coast.

                      I have been asked to run three trainer courses for scouters in the spring of 2005.

                      Ted



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                    • MALesniak@aol.com
                      Ted, Thanks for the info. The term Master Trainer is new to me and I m not familiar with the 2 groups you mentioned NOLS or AMC either. As Council Training
                      Message 10 of 15 , Mar 1, 2004
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                        Ted,

                        Thanks for the info. The term "Master Trainer" is new to me and I'm not
                        familiar with the 2 groups you mentioned NOLS or AMC either.

                        As Council Training Chair and Camp Director, I hope there is literature about
                        this change forwarded to me through my Council but I haven't been given
                        anything to date.

                        If you can reference any materials directly, I'll have Council order me
                        copies.

                        Thanks again,
                        Michelle Lesniak
                        Moraine Trails Council Butler, PA
                        Camp Agawam Camp Director
                        Council Training Chair
                        "I used to be an Eagle....NE-IV-153...working on my ticket!"


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Wendell Brown
                        ... NOLS is the National Outdoor Leadership School (http://www.nols.edu/), they offer classes for MANY outdoor skills - from LNT Master to Wilderness EMT.
                        Message 11 of 15 , Mar 2, 2004
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                          MALesniak@... wrote:

                          > Thanks for the info. The term "Master Trainer" is new to me and I'm not
                          > familiar with the 2 groups you mentioned NOLS or AMC either.

                          NOLS is the National Outdoor Leadership School (http://www.nols.edu/),
                          they offer classes for MANY outdoor skills - from LNT Master to
                          Wilderness EMT. It's considered by many as THE high adventure training
                          school. BTW, A "LNT Master" is the title of the person who is trained
                          to teach LNT instructors.

                          The BSA sites for LNT are:

                          Principals of LNT - http://www.scouting.org/boyscouts/resources/21-105/
                          Cub Scout LNT - http://www.scouting.org/cubscouts/resources/13-032/
                          Teaching LNT - http://www.scouting.org/boyscouts/resources/21-117/

                          The official Leave No Trace web site is http://www.lnt.org/ .


                          Hope this helps.
                        • tsbeb@att.net
                          Michelle, NOLS is National Outdoor Leadership School, (http://www.nols.edu/), and AMC is the Appalachian Mountain Club. Your LNT State Advocate for
                          Message 12 of 15 , Mar 2, 2004
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                            Michelle,

                            NOLS is National Outdoor Leadership School, (http://www.nols.edu/),
                            and AMC is the Appalachian Mountain Club.

                            Your LNT State Advocate for Pennsylvania is David Chambers he can be reached at pakyak@... for training information. I believe that all LNT State Advocates have been notified by the Northeaast Region BSA.

                            The Leave No Trace Trainer course is a 16 hour course with an over night backpack.
                            The Leave No Trace Master Educator course is a five day backpack. You have to have CPR and WFA or WFR training.

                            A Trainer can do workshops and informational sessons
                            A Master Educator can train trainers and whatever trainers do.

                            Sort of like WFA and WFR, Wildereness First Aid and Wilderness First Responder.

                            The resident trainer at camp requirement is being rolled out in 2005. It is my understanding that they hoped that enough Venturers would take the LNT part of the Outdoor Bronze and Ranger Awards and become LNT Trainers, and then work at summer camp. I guess that it did not happen.

                            In L,F,S
                            Ted Beblowski
                            Used to be a Beaver NE III 141 Venturing
                            Powder Horn 2000


                            ----------



                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Robert M. Gross
                            I ve been asked to be SPL for the outdoor part of our Scoutmaster Outdoor Leadership Skills. Have any of you had any experience with that and do you have any
                            Message 13 of 15 , Mar 14, 2004
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                              I've been asked to be SPL for the outdoor part of our Scoutmaster Outdoor
                              Leadership Skills. Have any of you had any experience with that and do you have
                              any recommendations, hints, ideas, etc.

                              Robert M. Gross
                              Committee Chair
                              BSA Troop 87, Trappe, PA
                              I used to be a Fox...
                              grossrm@...


                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • Ida Lively
                              Congratulations! First I ask if you re only doing for the Outdoor section. Here we like to have continuity between the classroom and the practical. We
                              Message 14 of 15 , Mar 15, 2004
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                                Congratulations!

                                First I ask if you're only doing for the Outdoor section. Here we like to
                                have continuity between the 'classroom' and the 'practical.' We like to
                                introduce the SPL at the classroom, so that 1) he's familiar w/ the patrols
                                and 2) the patrols are familiar with him.

                                You'll basically be the "big brother". That being said, you must set the
                                example of the "ultimate" Boy Scout. What those leaders see YOU doing, they
                                will do with their troops.

                                As SPL you are the "leader". You can expect to instruct your patrols /
                                patrol leaders on what they are to be doing. You'll be their "go to" for
                                questions.

                                You'll be working with the Course Director. See if they have a schedule
                                worked out. It's good to know in advance what the schedule will look like,
                                and what you're up against. I'd recommend picking up your own copy of the
                                syllabus (or asking your course director for a copy).

                                The SPL in our training runs the campfire. (By run, I mean "MC"). But,
                                above everything -- you must HAVE FUN. If you enjoy yourself, the patrols
                                will enjoy themselves, too. If you're miserable, you can bet that your
                                patrols will be miserable.

                                Ida Lively
                                - Juniata Valley Council, Nittany Mountain District Training Chair


                                >
                                > Message: 2
                                > Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 20:32:32 -0500
                                > From: "Robert M. Gross" <grossrm@...>
                                > Subject: Outdoor Skills Training Help
                                >
                                > I've been asked to be SPL for the outdoor part of our Scoutmaster Outdoor
                                > Leadership Skills. Have any of you had any experience with that and do you
                                > have
                                > any recommendations, hints, ideas, etc.
                                >
                                > Robert M. Gross
                                > Committee Chair
                                > BSA Troop 87, Trappe, PA
                                > I used to be a Fox...
                                > grossrm@...




                                >
                                >
                                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > ________________________________________________________________________
                                > ________________________________________________________________________
                                >
                                > Message: 3
                                > Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:46:53 -0000
                                > From: "V. Chua" <rashni@...>
                                > Subject: Eagle CoH
                                >
                                > Greetings one and all -
                                >
                                > Our troop is going to have an Eagle CoH for 3 scouts and they have asked me
                                > to be the Master of Ceremonies....which leads me to the question. Is there a
                                > format to follow to be an MC? Are there things that should be addressed and
                                > things that should be avoided?
                                >
                                > Any help would be greatly appreciated especially since I have never been an
                                > MC before.
                                >
                                > Thanks and YiS,
                                >
                                > Victor Vergara
                                > T91, Trenton, NJ
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > ________________________________________________________________________
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                                Ida Lively

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                              • Robert M. Gross
                                Nope - whole thing. Bob Gross ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                Message 15 of 15 , Mar 15, 2004
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                                  Nope - whole thing.

                                  Bob Gross

                                  >> First I ask if you're only doing for the Outdoor section.



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