Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Cub Scout Shooting Sports

Expand Messages
  • Lloyd Solis
    We ve kicked-around the ideas of cub scout packs and BB guns in the last few months on several lists. We know that G2SS designates this as District and
    Message 1 of 10 , Mar 4, 2001
    • 0 Attachment
      We've 'kicked-around' the ideas of cub scout packs and BB guns in the
      last few months on several lists.
      We know that G2SS designates this as District and Council Activities.
      With the exceptions of Cub Day Camp or a multiple overnight camping
      experience, there have been no other means of providing the boys with
      the ability to earn the Belt Loop for shooting.
      I think I've heard that BSA is modifying these restrictions to allow for
      BB gun shooting on pack/den levels.
      As I recall SHAC is now conducting BB gun training for cub scout age
      youth at council camps that will provide for the earning of the belt
      loop.
      Our council's shooting sports director (NRA & BSA National Camp School
      trained) is providing training to adults wishing to host dens & packs at
      council camp in this regard. Our Scout Executive has given the tentative
      approval to proceed in planning. A letter requesting some clarifications
      from BSA-Irving, Tx has not been answered - yet.
      We want to provide for a 'multi-level qualified adult presence' by
      having out campmasters as well as other adults certified. Our shooting
      sports director is willing to certify adults if those adults are willing
      to provide the leadership to multiple units, not just their own unit. My
      thought is that the campmaster should be responsible for opening &
      closing the range, observing the range proceedings until satisfied of
      the proper and safe implementations of the program, and periodically
      checking back at the range.
      Are any of your councils currently providing BB gun experiences on unit
      levels?
      What special written provisions have you published to insure compliance
      with safety?

      YiS
      Lloyd Solis
    • Lorie McGraw
      ... Our Council is not doing Unit-level BB gun shooting, but our district offers 4-5 opportunities during a year for the boys to earn the BB gun belt loop and
      Message 2 of 10 , Mar 5, 2001
      • 0 Attachment
        >
        > From: Lloyd Solis <paperclp@...>
        >Subject: Cub Scout Shooting Sports
        >
        >We've 'kicked-around' the ideas of cub scout packs and BB guns in the
        >last few months on several lists.
        > We know that G2SS designates this as District and Council Activities.
        >With the exceptions of Cub Day Camp or a multiple overnight camping
        >experience, there have been no other means of providing the boys with
        >the ability to earn the Belt Loop for shooting.
        >I think I've heard that BSA is modifying these restrictions to allow for
        >BB gun shooting on pack/den levels.

        Our Council is not doing Unit-level BB gun shooting, but our district
        offers 4-5 opportunities during a year for the boys to earn the BB gun belt
        loop and the Archery belt loop at District/council events.
        District level:
        one-day (9-4) Cuboree
        2 Day Camps (5 day duration)
        Council level
        Cub/Partner overnighter (1 night camping)
        Family Camping overnighter (1 night camping) (2 in a year)
        3 day summer camp (2 nights)

        I am very much against the pack/den-level teaching of this sport,
        regardless of what National may be proposing. The main reason is
        Safety. But also, the reason that many of our leaders take their dens to
        Day Camp and Cuboree is to get the BB/Archery belt loops, and in the
        process meet the whole 'gang' of Scouts and Scouters in the district and
        council, making them better leaders and their boys better cubs.

        I do have BB guns at my house and have taught my own sons to shoot, but as
        a den leader I took my den to Cuboree and Day Camp to learn and earn.

        We have never had an injury in our district in the last 8 years from BBs or
        Archery (the council did have one minor injury a few years back, before the
        use of goggles was mandatory. Luckily it was minor.)

        BTW, I have run the range for 6+ years and see tremendous Safety violation
        among parent/leaders who >swear< that they have been trained in the BSA
        Shooting Safety.
        Cheers
        Lorie McGraw
        Columbia SC
        Wearing many hats for Scouting
      • Mike
        ... the ... Activities. ... with ... allow for ... School ... packs at ... tentative ... clarifications ... shooting ... willing ... unit. My ... of ... unit
        Message 3 of 10 , Mar 5, 2001
        • 0 Attachment
          --- In scouter_t@y..., Lloyd Solis <paperclp@s...> wrote:
          > We've 'kicked-around' the ideas of cub scout packs and BB guns in
          the
          > last few months on several lists.
          > We know that G2SS designates this as District and Council
          Activities.
          > With the exceptions of Cub Day Camp or a multiple overnight camping
          > experience, there have been no other means of providing the boys
          with
          > the ability to earn the Belt Loop for shooting.
          > I think I've heard that BSA is modifying these restrictions to
          allow for
          > BB gun shooting on pack/den levels.
          > As I recall SHAC is now conducting BB gun training for cub scout age
          > youth at council camps that will provide for the earning of the belt
          > loop.
          > Our council's shooting sports director (NRA & BSA National Camp
          School
          > trained) is providing training to adults wishing to host dens &
          packs at
          > council camp in this regard. Our Scout Executive has given the
          tentative
          > approval to proceed in planning. A letter requesting some
          clarifications
          > from BSA-Irving, Tx has not been answered - yet.
          > We want to provide for a 'multi-level qualified adult presence' by
          > having out campmasters as well as other adults certified. Our
          shooting
          > sports director is willing to certify adults if those adults are
          willing
          > to provide the leadership to multiple units, not just their own
          unit. My
          > thought is that the campmaster should be responsible for opening &
          > closing the range, observing the range proceedings until satisfied
          of
          > the proper and safe implementations of the program, and periodically
          > checking back at the range.
          > Are any of your councils currently providing BB gun experiences on
          unit
          > levels?
          > What special written provisions have you published to insure
          compliance
          > with safety?
          >
          > YiS
          > Lloyd Solis

          Our Council has a relatively new, but very active shooting sports
          program. I am an NRA certified instructor for rifle, muzzleloader
          and shotgun, (our shooting sports director is an NRA Training
          Councilor). We have trained about 40 people throughout the council
          who are NRA cerified instructors.
          With regards to the Cub program, last year we ran three events where
          Cub Scouts were allowed to shoot, including a BB gun derby. Each of
          these events was staffed by trained adults and NRA Certified
          instructors. WEBELO scouts were allowed to fire air rifles. All
          boys had one to one adult shooter ratio with a range master and two
          instructors floating on the line. Safety is of utmost importance.
          All boys were run through a 45 minute safety and handling course. We
          used eye and ear protection (get the kids used to wearing everthing
          right from the start). Significant preparation went into these
          events to insure that they were run safely, the kids learned and had
          fun. Maybe I am a little skeptical, but I am not sure the same level
          of training, certification, planning and preparation would go into a
          pack or den run shooting event. There is always one adult who says I
          hgave been hunting since I was 8 years old and I know what to do as
          he is waving a loded BB gun at a group of boys. We won't let that
          happen, period!!
          Our council has sent the camp ranger to get certified and we are
          attempting to get the campmasters cerified so they are comfortable
          with the range being used by units. Everyone who has taken the NRA
          courses is encouraged to serve at summer camp and as merit badge
          councelors for shooting sports. Last year we ran open shoot for
          shotgun and black powder one day a week at each summer camp session,
          and got a number of boys their shotgun merit badge.
          A suggestion to get cubs their belt loops would be to hook up with a
          rod and gun club or a junior rifle club and get fully trained people
          to run the program in a safe environment.
          Enough preaching form me.

          YIS
          Mike Rocheleau
          Scoutmaster Troop 4 Wallingford CT
          Jambo '01 - Buckskin Games-Black Powder
          And a good ole Buffalo too!
        • Wendell Brown
          ... I want to make a clarification here. The Shooting Sports for Cub Scouts, Webelos Scouts & Parents in Camp guide states that ALL Cub Scouts (even WEBELOS
          Message 4 of 10 , Mar 5, 2001
          • 0 Attachment
            On Mon, 05 Mar 2001 16:08:14 -0000, Mike wrote:

            >With regards to the Cub program, last year we ran three events where
            >Cub Scouts were allowed to shoot, including a BB gun derby. Each of
            >these events was staffed by trained adults and NRA Certified
            >instructors. WEBELO scouts were allowed to fire air rifles.

            I want to make a clarification here. The 'Shooting Sports for Cub
            Scouts, Webelos Scouts & Parents in Camp' guide states that ALL Cub
            Scouts (even WEBELOS scouts) are supposed to use BB guns - specifically
            BB guns that are rated LESS than 350fps. Almost all "air rifles" are
            rated in excess of 350fps, so you have to be especially careful when
            using this type of gun that it CANNOT exceed this speed and that it is
            not intended to use pellets.

            >Maybe I am a little skeptical, but I am not sure the same level
            >of training, certification, planning and preparation would go into a
            >pack or den run shooting event.

            You and me both.

            >A suggestion to get cubs their belt loops would be to hook up with a
            >rod and gun club or a junior rifle club and get fully trained people
            >to run the program in a safe environment.

            All of the literature I have seen says that Cub Scouts are to shoot
            ONLY at Council or District events. I can see that a Council or
            District COULD, under the existing rules, create an event (other than
            the "normal" events like day camp, weekend camp, resident camp, etc.)
            where BB guns could be shot (as long as the range layout minimally
            meets the BB gun range specifications and adequate trained instructors
            are present). However, as the rules currently read I don't see an
            approved way for a den or a pack to shoot - even at a gun club.



            Wendell Brown
            Scouting The Net -- http://www.arkie.net/scouting/
            A Mini-Yahoo for the scouting community.
          • Mike
            ... where ... of ... specifically ... are ... is ... Wendell, you are correct and these air rifles were properly rated, the Cubs shot Daisy s. ... a ... a ...
            Message 5 of 10 , Mar 5, 2001
            • 0 Attachment
              --- In scouter_t@y..., "Wendell Brown" <wbrown@a...> wrote:
              > On Mon, 05 Mar 2001 16:08:14 -0000, Mike wrote:
              >
              > >With regards to the Cub program, last year we ran three events
              where
              > >Cub Scouts were allowed to shoot, including a BB gun derby. Each
              of
              > >these events was staffed by trained adults and NRA Certified
              > >instructors. WEBELO scouts were allowed to fire air rifles.
              >
              > I want to make a clarification here. The 'Shooting Sports for Cub
              > Scouts, Webelos Scouts & Parents in Camp' guide states that ALL Cub
              > Scouts (even WEBELOS scouts) are supposed to use BB guns -
              specifically
              > BB guns that are rated LESS than 350fps. Almost all "air rifles"
              are
              > rated in excess of 350fps, so you have to be especially careful when
              > using this type of gun that it CANNOT exceed this speed and that it
              is
              > not intended to use pellets.

              Wendell, you are correct and these air rifles were properly rated,
              the Cubs shot Daisy's.

              >
              > >Maybe I am a little skeptical, but I am not sure the same level
              > >of training, certification, planning and preparation would go into
              a
              > >pack or den run shooting event.
              >
              > You and me both.
              >
              > >A suggestion to get cubs their belt loops would be to hook up with
              a
              > >rod and gun club or a junior rifle club and get fully trained
              people
              > >to run the program in a safe environment.
              >
              > All of the literature I have seen says that Cub Scouts are to shoot
              > ONLY at Council or District events. I can see that a Council or
              > District COULD, under the existing rules, create an event (other
              than
              > the "normal" events like day camp, weekend camp, resident camp,
              etc.)
              > where BB guns could be shot (as long as the range layout minimally
              > meets the BB gun range specifications and adequate trained
              instructors
              > are present). However, as the rules currently read I don't see an
              > approved way for a den or a pack to shoot - even at a gun club.
              >
              >

              We utilized the facilites of a gun club for a district event
              called "Shoot for the Olympics which we run biennially. We even
              received a write-up in Scouting Magazine for this event. I did not
              mean to imply a den or pack event. Thanks for the clarification.

              The real point I was trying to drive home is that I don't beleve
              there is any way to insure a safe, compliant shooting program at the
              pack or den level.
              >
              >
              YIS

              Mike Rocheleau
            • danielgrummert
              Looking fo ra copy of Shooting Sports for Cub Scouting #13-550. Anyone seen one? dan
              Message 6 of 10 , Mar 26, 2009
              • 0 Attachment
                Looking fo ra copy of Shooting Sports for Cub Scouting #13-550.
                Anyone seen one?
                dan
              • gundamknt@yahoo.com
                Yep I ve got one. Ill get it scanned and upload it. Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel ... From: danielgrummert
                Message 7 of 10 , Mar 26, 2009
                • 0 Attachment
                  Yep I've got one. Ill get it scanned and upload it.

                  Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: "danielgrummert" <dangrummert@...>

                  Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 18:17:13
                  To: <scouter_t@yahoogroups.com>
                  Subject: [Scouter_T] Cub Scout Shooting Sports


                  Looking fo ra copy of Shooting Sports for Cub Scouting #13-550.
                  Anyone seen one?
                  dan




                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • chadc@charter.net
                  Dan, The SSfCC is considered a restricted document by BSA (unless there has been a recent policy change that hasn t made its way down to my Council committee).
                  Message 8 of 10 , Mar 26, 2009
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Dan,

                    The SSfCC is considered a restricted document by BSA (unless there has been a recent policy change that hasn't made its way down to my Council committee). It is only available to council representatives. I believe that BSA would frown on creating electronic copies.

                    I do have a hard copy and would be glad to answer questions or provide specifics.

                    - Chad
                    Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: "danielgrummert" <dangrummert@...>

                    Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 18:17:13
                    To: <scouter_t@yahoogroups.com>
                    Subject: [Scouter_T] Cub Scout Shooting Sports


                    Looking fo ra copy of Shooting Sports for Cub Scouting #13-550.
                    Anyone seen one?
                    dan




                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • gundamknt@yahoo.com
                    I got mine at rangemaster training Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel ... From: chadc@charter.net Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 20:15:05 To:
                    Message 9 of 10 , Mar 26, 2009
                    • 0 Attachment
                      I got mine at rangemaster training
                      Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: chadc@...

                      Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 20:15:05
                      To: <scouter_t@yahoogroups.com>
                      Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Cub Scout Shooting Sports


                      Dan,

                      The SSfCC is considered a restricted document by BSA (unless there has been a recent policy change that hasn't made its way down to my Council committee). It is only available to council representatives. I believe that BSA would frown on creating electronic copies.

                      I do have a hard copy and would be glad to answer questions or provide specifics.

                      - Chad
                      Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: "danielgrummert" <dangrummert@...>

                      Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 18:17:13
                      To: <scouter_t@yahoogroups.com>
                      Subject: [Scouter_T] Cub Scout Shooting Sports


                      Looking fo ra copy of Shooting Sports for Cub Scouting #13-550.
                      Anyone seen one?
                      dan




                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Chad C. Cooper
                      As the BSA shooting sport trainer for my Council (Norther Star in Minnesota), I distribute a copy of this booklet to my course attendees. But, it comes with
                      Message 10 of 10 , Mar 27, 2009
                      • 0 Attachment
                        As the BSA shooting sport trainer for my Council (Norther Star in
                        Minnesota), I distribute a copy of this booklet to my course attendees.
                        But, it comes with the following admonitions:
                        1) They are receiving it under the authority of our Council because they
                        are attending the training.
                        2) They are not authorized to distribute it on their own.

                        I would encourage you to seek your DE or council advisor's input before
                        distributing BSA's material that they do not make available through any
                        public channels. You are most certainly violating copyright.

                        - Chad Cooper
                        Chief Black Dog District
                        Northern Star Council
                        Apple Valley, MN

                        gundamknt@... wrote:
                        >
                        > I got mine at rangemaster training
                        > Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel
                        >
                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: chadc@... <mailto:chadc%40charter.net>
                        >
                        > Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 20:15:05
                        > To: <scouter_t@yahoogroups.com <mailto:scouter_t%40yahoogroups.com>>
                        > Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Cub Scout Shooting Sports
                        >
                        > Dan,
                        >
                        > The SSfCC is considered a restricted document by BSA (unless there has
                        > been a recent policy change that hasn't made its way down to my
                        > Council committee). It is only available to council representatives. I
                        > believe that BSA would frown on creating electronic copies.
                        >
                        > I do have a hard copy and would be glad to answer questions or provide
                        > specifics.
                        >
                        > - Chad
                        > Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
                        >
                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: "danielgrummert" <dangrummert@...
                        > <mailto:dangrummert%40suddenlink.net>>
                        >
                        > Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 18:17:13
                        > To: <scouter_t@yahoogroups.com <mailto:scouter_t%40yahoogroups.com>>
                        > Subject: [Scouter_T] Cub Scout Shooting Sports
                        >
                        > Looking fo ra copy of Shooting Sports for Cub Scouting #13-550.
                        > Anyone seen one?
                        > dan
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.