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Re: Minimum training session

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  • deedee.cobb@excite.com
    ... Great question Neal! In our council we really try to encourage not cancelling any training sessions. Many scouters are attending to fulfill the knot
    Message 1 of 8 , Mar 2, 2001
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      --- In scouter_t@y..., Neal Smith <nsmith@t...> wrote:
      >
      > How large of a group do you need to hold a training?
      >
      Great question Neal!

      In our council we really try to encourage not cancelling any training
      sessions. Many scouters are attending to fulfill the knot requirement
      tied to the training. It isn't fair to anyone if they do not have
      opportunities to do that. With BLT's we offer 4 for Boy Scouts each
      year; 2 per district in the Fall for Cubs, and then at least 6 more
      during the year (on a district basis, yet advertised to anyone within
      the council). Since we are not charging for our training events, it
      makes it easier for people to just walk on. Which is an issue. But,
      we generally know of a few that will be coming. In my district we
      hear 2 days before the training that only 5-10 are signed up, then 25
      show up. We prepare for a large group and then modify if only a few
      show.

      In the CS BLT's we encourage anyone who has changed position to come
      an attend the breakout session to be considered Trained in their new
      position. And, we offer Youth Protection training at the beginning or
      end of the training. By combining all of this within one day, it does
      help to increase attendance.

      And, it really takes advertising the event in the right way to get
      more to attend. You should explain in your flyer the reasons why you
      need to know ahead of time if someone is attending. But, don't
      discourage walk-ons, simply because you may have someone who joined
      as a leader a day or two prior to the training.


      > On a related note, I would like to ask the same question about
      > Webelos Leader Outdoor training (WLOT/OWL).

      Our council only offers this training event once a year, in the Fall.
      We usually have between 100 - 125 participants to attend. Since it is
      required for the Webelos Leader knot, we've never had a problem with
      too few participants. Our biggest obstacle is only offering once a
      year. Our course starts on Friday evening and ends on Sunday about
      noon. It takes about 30 people to staff the event.

      Dee Dee Cobb
      Middle Tennessee Council
      Nashville, TN
    • Neal Smith
      Thanks for all the great responses about the minimum needed for a training. I haven t been able to respond to this list this week, but I ve saved (and
      Message 2 of 8 , Mar 9, 2001
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        Thanks for all the great responses about the minimum needed for
        a training. I haven't been able to respond to this list this
        week, but I've saved (and savored) the messages on the list.

        I've been of the philosophy that, if you schedule the training and
        don't state in advance that you require reservations, you have an
        obligation to hold the training. I'm glad to see that so many trainers
        here feel the same; it gives me more moral support when discussing this
        with people on the District Committee who disagree. I also really
        liked the idea of turning small trainings into staff development
        sessions. Our training team is currently pretty small, and needs
        to be built up, so we can certainly use this idea.

        After doing a quick (but not thorough) survey of our district, we're
        going ahead with our scheduled Basic training in April. I've also
        scheduled BALOO and OWL trainings on the first Saturday in May -
        after seeing support for this from packs that don't have activities
        scheduled opposite it.

        Judy brought up budget constraints. I certainly agree that OWL
        (and now BALOO), where food is purchased, needs to be preregistered
        to meet a budget. Is that really a constraint for Cub Basic,
        though? The displays, posters, and other "one per training"
        materials aren't purchased for each training. Handouts, trained
        strips, certificates, etc., are one per person trained, but can
        be saved for future trainings. What fixed costs do people see
        in their Cub Basic trainings that would make large groups economical
        but small ones not?

        YIS, Neal Smith (nsmith@...)
        Tatanka District Cub Scout Training Chair
        http://www.bsa.net/samhouston/tatanka/
        Sam Houston Area Council, Houston, Tx
      • Judy Yeager
        Neal Smith wrote: Judy brought up budget constraints. Is that really a constraint for Cub Basic, though? No, that has never been a
        Message 3 of 8 , Mar 9, 2001
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          Neal Smith wrote: Judy brought up budget constraints. <snip> Is that
          really a constraint for Cub Basic, though? <end snip>

          No, that has never been a constraint for us. We are a very large
          district and run three sessions in the fall and three in the spring. A
          slow day for us is fewer than 30 participants. With a charge of $4.00
          per participant on this course, I have been able to combine it with Den
          Chief Conference when budgeting, run all DC expenses through CSLBT and
          offer the DC training to the kids free of charge. Their cost of
          admission is one or more non-perishable food items which we donate to
          the food pantry of the church which hosts us.

          We also offer a whole cadre of free trainings - YP, H&S, Climb on
          Safely, Safe Swim, Safety Afloat, and Caving. There are no expenses
          because we use a free facility, handouts and pocket certificates come
          from Council and no trained strips involved. Also at these trainings,
          there are no refreshments, no drinks, no extras whatsoever.

          But, if there is food involved, be it "real" food or just snacks,
          finances come into play.

          Judy Yeager
        • AnacBuff@aol.com
          My district has geographical challenges that make holding trainings for less than about 10 people difficult. Island District in Mt. Baker (WA) council is a
          Message 4 of 8 , Mar 9, 2001
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            My district has geographical challenges that make holding trainings
            for less than about 10 people difficult. Island District in Mt.
            Baker (WA) council is a district made up of islands in the San Juans
            at the north end of Puget Sound. Our district covers the same area
            as the entire rest of the council.

            When we do trainings in one end of our district or another, training
            team members might have to travel by ferry, drive 1-1/2 to 2 hours or
            both depending on the day/place training is happening. Training can
            mean leaving home at 5 AM (or sometimes the night before, depending
            on ferry schedules) and not getting home until late at night. If a
            ferry ride is required to get to training then we try to carpool and
            consolidate materials as a car and driver can cost up to $30 and each
            walk on passenger fare is about $5 - 7. Once when we scheduled a
            training on San Juan Island one of the training team members arranged
            to charter a plane in order to get there to do his part.
            Transportation alone for trainings in the outer islands can cost $50
            or more depending on which training we are presenting (then add in
            the cost of gas, food and, sometimes, lodging for the training team
            alone - oh, my!)

            That being said, we usually go forward with trainings that are on the
            calendar. And if a unit or group of units are willing to commit to 8
            or more leaders at a training, the team will go to them and present
            training.

            Carla B.
            ADC - Fidalgo Island
            Island District Training
            Mt. Baker Council
          • Jim Hawkins
            You are an example of my point (read the last message sent to scouter_t just a few moments ago). Cub Scouting/ Boy Scouting leader training requirements have
            Message 5 of 8 , Mar 9, 2001
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              You are an example of my point (read the last message sent to
              scouter_t just a few moments ago).

              Cub Scouting/ Boy Scouting leader training requirements have made it
              very expensive, very difficult, and very un-"Keep It Simple" for you
              and your training team. If I had to do what you are having to do, I
              could not. I am glad you have found a way to do it.

              Jim Hawkins
              CS Training Committee Chair
              Four Rivers District

              --- In scouter_t@y..., AnacBuff@a... wrote:
              > My district has geographical challenges that make holding trainings
              > for less than about 10 people difficult. Island District in Mt.
              > Baker (WA) council is a district made up of islands in the San
              Juans
              > at the north end of Puget Sound. Our district covers the same area
              > as the entire rest of the council.
              >
              > When we do trainings in one end of our district or another,
              training
              > team members might have to travel by ferry, drive 1-1/2 to 2 hours
              or
              > both depending on the day/place training is happening. Training
              can
              > mean leaving home at 5 AM (or sometimes the night before, depending
              > on ferry schedules) and not getting home until late at night. If a
              > ferry ride is required to get to training then we try to carpool
              and
              > consolidate materials as a car and driver can cost up to $30 and
              each
              > walk on passenger fare is about $5 - 7. Once when we scheduled a
              > training on San Juan Island one of the training team members
              arranged
              > to charter a plane in order to get there to do his part.
              > Transportation alone for trainings in the outer islands can cost
              $50
              > or more depending on which training we are presenting (then add in
              > the cost of gas, food and, sometimes, lodging for the training team
              > alone - oh, my!)
              >
              > That being said, we usually go forward with trainings that are on
              the
              > calendar. And if a unit or group of units are willing to commit to
              8
              > or more leaders at a training, the team will go to them and present
              > training.
              >
              > Carla B.
              > ADC - Fidalgo Island
              > Island District Training
              > Mt. Baker Council
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