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Re: Manditory Training Scouter T 2548

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  • taskiagi261@comcast.net
    Ct Rivers BSA (Hartford CT) is one of the pilot councils.  We are in the second year of the Manditory (REQUIRED) training program. First, ALL BSA LEADERS are
    Message 1 of 10 , Aug 27, 2011
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      Ct Rivers BSA (Hartford CT) is one of the pilot councils.  We are in the second year

      of the Manditory (REQUIRED) training program.



      First, ALL BSA LEADERS are now subject to UPDATED Youth Protection training

      based upon the BSA National policy from July/August 2011.  Basically, if any leader has not

      completed or has updated YPT for their respectivie program (Cub Scouts & Boy Scouts,

      Venture Scouts), this leader is automatically dropped at the next recharter cycle.   Yes,

      leaders had registrations dropped in December 2010 due to lack of or outdated YPT!



      Second, much effort was placed in 2010 to ensure the Top Unit Leaders (Cubmasters,

      Scoutmaster, Crew Advisors) were trained in their respective positions.  Fortunately, NO
      UNITS were lost at recharter; some Units had Top Leader position changes with an new

      adult application, etc..  These leaders fell into categories:



      1.  will not take training;

      2.  required training was the final push to get a new, TRAINED leader in top position.





      Most of our effort was made available by getting timely Scoutnet training reports from our

      Office Registrars.  This was possible because BOTH THE SCOUT EXECUTIVE and EXECUTIVE

      BOARD decised trained leaders were important and made those resources available within

      our Council Office.



      Also, multiple Training Course offerrings were done, even at the three residential Boy Scout summer

      camps or SM Specifics and IOLS as well as the eight districts throughout the calendar years. 



      These reports were distributed electronically (Excel format) to our Council Training Committee members

      in order to keep "running tabs" on our respective districts.  Individuals and their Units could be tracked very

      accurately in this fashion and proved useful to our success & efforts.



      Traininig Course rosters, both current and previous, was also dealt within one to two-weeks upon

      receipt at the Council Office.  



      Lastly, a tracking sheet as well as link on the Council's website was created to encourage the assistance

      of our leaders to provide personal training records, i.e. the name, Course Code, and date for each completed

      training course in the passed.  This data, as will on-going course rosters, needs to be MANUALLY entered

      into ScoutNet by a vetted Office Staff member; again, the backing by the SE to get this task completed. 

      (see www.ctriversbsa.org ) for the link. 





      Currently, we are concentrating mostly on Top Unit Leaders and assistants.  The National Office has realized

      ScoutNet was incapable of accepting the volume of data for ALL REGISTERED BSA LEADERS.  With this in mind, 

      ScoutNet will undergo a major enhancement ( I will believe this when I see it) within the next year or so. 



      Also, there is a Training Record function on myscouting.org for each registered Leader.  However, you need

      to be careful here where multiple positions within the same Council or multiple councils.  myscouting.org does 

      allow each user "to link" such positions provided the user has the proper registration number for each position therein.



      Sorry for the long post, but this is we were stand.    



      Leader specific training is also offerred at the CT UofS (four councils) held in March as well as the Cub Scout Pow Wow each

      November. 




      --
      Michael E. Clark
      taskiagi261@...


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Judy Yeager
      What an interesting thread! Three years ago, Heart of America Council recognized the benefits of having trained leaders in all positions in our program. The
      Message 2 of 10 , Aug 27, 2011
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        What an interesting thread! Three years ago, Heart of America Council
        recognized the benefits of having trained leaders in all positions in
        our program. The Council Training Committee was charged with the task
        of developing a plan to get all our leaders trained. We formulated a
        three year plan that we thought would work for us, intentionally banning
        the use of the word "mandatory" because of the negativity connected to
        the word. Our "All Leaders Trained Initiative" was approved by the
        Executive Committee and Executive Board and we were off and running.

        Our three year plan is:
        Year 1 all top unit leaders trained.
        Year 2 all direct contact leaders trained, while maintaining all
        top leaders trained.
        Year 3 Everyone else who is registered, while maintaining the above
        two points.

        We are now in year 3 and have learned some things along the way:

        * You have to have buy in from your trainers and professional staff.
        * Training records MUST BE updated and maintained. (This was not
        nearly as daunting a task as we had thought.)
        * The whole paradigm of training must be redesigned. As trainers,
        it is not our job to schedule training events, but to make sure
        leaders are trained, whatever it takes.
        * You have to stick to your guns and implement the plan, including
        consequences, as written. If you lose some leaders, you lose
        them. If you lose a few units, they were probably on their way
        out anyway.
        * Once you make it through the initial implementation (in our case
        three years), "mandatory" training is the new normal

        Did we encounter problems along the way? Sure, but nothing we could not
        work with.

        So now that we are close to completion of our three year plan, how do we
        maintain? When we completed Year 1, it became Council policy that you
        could not register as a top unit leader unless you were fully trained
        for that position. At the end of Year 2, that stayed in effect and
        became the policy to register as a direct contact leader in any unit.
        At the end of this year, no new leader can register in any position
        until they are fully trained for that position.

        It is my understanding that our progress has been monitored by National
        since we are the largest council to adopt this policy. Only time will
        tell if this policy will yield the benefits, especially with retention,
        that we hoped for.

        Judy Yeager
        HOAC Council Training Chair


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Gail Price
        While I agree training is important, I think the implementation has been a bit harsh.  I was literally told, Thanks for your ten years of service, if you
        Message 3 of 10 , Aug 29, 2011
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          While I agree training is important, I think the implementation has been a bit harsh.
           I was literally told, "Thanks for your ten years of service, if you don't take this class by this time, we don't want you any more."

          And I find this statement from your post cold and heartless:

          " If you lose some leaders, you losethem. If you lose a few units, they were probably on their way
          out anyway."

          Is this really what's best for the scouts?

          Some of us have lives and jobs and families outside of scouting. 
          I have completed all my training, but not all of our leaders have had the time or opportunity
          to take a weekend off to attend IOLS.
          Good leaders who are doing their best should not be thrown out just because they can't meet a deadling.

          Gail





          ________________________________
          From: Judy Yeager <kcjscout@...>
          To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 4:49 PM
          Subject: [Scouter_T] Manditory Training


           
          What an interesting thread! Three years ago, Heart of America Council
          recognized the benefits of having trained leaders in all positions in
          our program. The Council Training Committee was charged with the task
          of developing a plan to get all our leaders trained. We formulated a
          three year plan that we thought would work for us, intentionally banning
          the use of the word "mandatory" because of the negativity connected to
          the word. Our "All Leaders Trained Initiative" was approved by the
          Executive Committee and Executive Board and we were off and running.

          Our three year plan is:
          Year 1 all top unit leaders trained.
          Year 2 all direct contact leaders trained, while maintaining all
          top leaders trained.
          Year 3 Everyone else who is registered, while maintaining the above
          two points.

          We are now in year 3 and have learned some things along the way:

          * You have to have buy in from your trainers and professional staff.
          * Training records MUST BE updated and maintained. (This was not
          nearly as daunting a task as we had thought.)
          * The whole paradigm of training must be redesigned. As trainers,
          it is not our job to schedule training events, but to make sure
          leaders are trained, whatever it takes.
          * You have to stick to your guns and implement the plan, including
          consequences, as written. If you lose some leaders, you lose
          them. If you lose a few units, they were probably on their way
          out anyway.
          * Once you make it through the initial implementation (in our case
          three years), "mandatory" training is the new normal

          Did we encounter problems along the way? Sure, but nothing we could not
          work with.

          So now that we are close to completion of our three year plan, how do we
          maintain? When we completed Year 1, it became Council policy that you
          could not register as a top unit leader unless you were fully trained
          for that position. At the end of Year 2, that stayed in effect and
          became the policy to register as a direct contact leader in any unit.
          At the end of this year, no new leader can register in any position
          until they are fully trained for that position.

          It is my understanding that our progress has been monitored by National
          since we are the largest council to adopt this policy. Only time will
          tell if this policy will yield the benefits, especially with retention,
          that we hoped for.

          Judy Yeager
          HOAC Council Training Chair

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Rick Hanke
          Gail, Two years to complete the required training seems fair to me.  Excuses have no place in the BSA.  The scouts deserve the best trained leaders that
          Message 4 of 10 , Aug 29, 2011
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            Gail,

            Two years to complete the required training seems fair to me.  Excuses have no place in the BSA.  The scouts deserve the best trained leaders that they can have.  We must set the standard for them.  Training should be a priority for each of us.  If not then take position where not so much training is required.  This is all about the youth we serve , not being served by them or the organization.  Embrace the changes instead of finding excuses to fight them.  Just my humble opinion on this subject.

            Rick Hanke
            District Commissioner
            Lakeshore District
            Gerald R. Ford Council

            Just A Good Old Bear Am I


            ________________________________
            From: Gail Price <gprice7224@...>
            To: "scouter_t@yahoogroups.com" <scouter_t@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Monday, August 29, 2011 8:56 AM
            Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Manditory Training


             
            While I agree training is important, I think the implementation has been a bit harsh.
             I was literally told, "Thanks for your ten years of service, if you don't take this class by this time, we don't want you any more."

            And I find this statement from your post cold and heartless:

            " If you lose some leaders, you losethem. If you lose a few units, they were probably on their way
            out anyway."

            Is this really what's best for the scouts?

            Some of us have lives and jobs and families outside of scouting. 
            I have completed all my training, but not all of our leaders have had the time or opportunity
            to take a weekend off to attend IOLS.
            Good leaders who are doing their best should not be thrown out just because they can't meet a deadling.

            Gail

            ________________________________
            From: Judy Yeager <kcjscout@...>
            To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 4:49 PM
            Subject: [Scouter_T] Manditory Training

             
            What an interesting thread! Three years ago, Heart of America Council
            recognized the benefits of having trained leaders in all positions in
            our program. The Council Training Committee was charged with the task
            of developing a plan to get all our leaders trained. We formulated a
            three year plan that we thought would work for us, intentionally banning
            the use of the word "mandatory" because of the negativity connected to
            the word. Our "All Leaders Trained Initiative" was approved by the
            Executive Committee and Executive Board and we were off and running.

            Our three year plan is:
            Year 1 all top unit leaders trained.
            Year 2 all direct contact leaders trained, while maintaining all
            top leaders trained.
            Year 3 Everyone else who is registered, while maintaining the above
            two points.

            We are now in year 3 and have learned some things along the way:

            * You have to have buy in from your trainers and professional staff.
            * Training records MUST BE updated and maintained. (This was not
            nearly as daunting a task as we had thought.)
            * The whole paradigm of training must be redesigned. As trainers,
            it is not our job to schedule training events, but to make sure
            leaders are trained, whatever it takes.
            * You have to stick to your guns and implement the plan, including
            consequences, as written. If you lose some leaders, you lose
            them. If you lose a few units, they were probably on their way
            out anyway.
            * Once you make it through the initial implementation (in our case
            three years), "mandatory" training is the new normal

            Did we encounter problems along the way? Sure, but nothing we could not
            work with.

            So now that we are close to completion of our three year plan, how do we
            maintain? When we completed Year 1, it became Council policy that you
            could not register as a top unit leader unless you were fully trained
            for that position. At the end of Year 2, that stayed in effect and
            became the policy to register as a direct contact leader in any unit.
            At the end of this year, no new leader can register in any position
            until they are fully trained for that position.

            It is my understanding that our progress has been monitored by National
            since we are the largest council to adopt this policy. Only time will
            tell if this policy will yield the benefits, especially with retention,
            that we hoped for.

            Judy Yeager
            HOAC Council Training Chair

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Mark
            I think most of the councils that are either part of the pilot project or have instituted a required training policy have given the leader a year or even more
            Message 5 of 10 , Aug 29, 2011
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              I think most of the councils that are either part of the pilot project or have instituted a required training policy have given the leader a year or even more to become fully trained.

              So, to put it into perspective, they have at least a year to attend one 4 - 8 hour leader position specific course depending on their registered position(s) and for the Boy Scout, Team, and Venturing direct contact leaders, one weekend to complete Intro to Outdoor Leaders Skills. Attending IOLS in lieu of a unit campout is okay ... really.

              All the rest is online. And for Cub Scout leaders and Troop Committee members, it's all online.

              I think that is reasonable, and someone who professes to understand the vision, mission, and goals of BSA should say, "yeah, I need to do it to be a productive adult leader, mitigate risks to myself and others, and add value to the Scouting program of my unit ." Only exceptions I would make is for those with temporary disabilities or those who are deployed in the service of our nation. The rest -- git 'er done.

              Training has been available for adult leader positions since the 60's. The fact that we need to have a required training policy in the first place is a damning statement about BSA, its volunteers, and our committment to the youth we serve.

              After working with council and district on required training for the past 2 years, I am convinced that there are the last 10 - 15 % of untrained leaders that will never be fully trained because they do not believe in the BSA ways or will not make it a priority to complete their training in the next year. And for them, they will need to go. We cannot move towards 100% trained if we allow these folks to stay.

              Thank them for their service, but the youth deserve leaders who would not put their pride before the youth. The youth can go to other units.

              Mark Ellis
              NCAC

              --- In scouter_t@yahoogroups.com, Gail Price <gprice7224@...> wrote:
              >
              > While I agree training is important, I think the implementation has been a bit harsh.
              >  I was literally told, "Thanks for your ten years of service, if you don't take this class by this time, we don't want you any more."
              >
              > And I find this statement from your post cold and heartless:
              >
              > " If you lose some leaders, you losethem. If you lose a few units, they were probably on their way
              > out anyway."
              >
              > Is this really what's best for the scouts?
              >
              > Some of us have lives and jobs and families outside of scouting. 
              > I have completed all my training, but not all of our leaders have had the time or opportunity
              > to take a weekend off to attend IOLS.
              > Good leaders who are doing their best should not be thrown out just because they can't meet a deadling.
              >
              > Gail
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ________________________________
              > From: Judy Yeager <kcjscout@...>
              > To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 4:49 PM
              > Subject: [Scouter_T] Manditory Training
              >
              >
              >  
              > What an interesting thread! Three years ago, Heart of America Council
              > recognized the benefits of having trained leaders in all positions in
              > our program. The Council Training Committee was charged with the task
              > of developing a plan to get all our leaders trained. We formulated a
              > three year plan that we thought would work for us, intentionally banning
              > the use of the word "mandatory" because of the negativity connected to
              > the word. Our "All Leaders Trained Initiative" was approved by the
              > Executive Committee and Executive Board and we were off and running.
              >
              > Our three year plan is:
              > Year 1 all top unit leaders trained.
              > Year 2 all direct contact leaders trained, while maintaining all
              > top leaders trained.
              > Year 3 Everyone else who is registered, while maintaining the above
              > two points.
              >
              > We are now in year 3 and have learned some things along the way:
              >
              > * You have to have buy in from your trainers and professional staff.
              > * Training records MUST BE updated and maintained. (This was not
              > nearly as daunting a task as we had thought.)
              > * The whole paradigm of training must be redesigned. As trainers,
              > it is not our job to schedule training events, but to make sure
              > leaders are trained, whatever it takes.
              > * You have to stick to your guns and implement the plan, including
              > consequences, as written. If you lose some leaders, you lose
              > them. If you lose a few units, they were probably on their way
              > out anyway.
              > * Once you make it through the initial implementation (in our case
              > three years), "mandatory" training is the new normal
              >
              > Did we encounter problems along the way? Sure, but nothing we could not
              > work with.
              >
              > So now that we are close to completion of our three year plan, how do we
              > maintain? When we completed Year 1, it became Council policy that you
              > could not register as a top unit leader unless you were fully trained
              > for that position. At the end of Year 2, that stayed in effect and
              > became the policy to register as a direct contact leader in any unit.
              > At the end of this year, no new leader can register in any position
              > until they are fully trained for that position.
              >
              > It is my understanding that our progress has been monitored by National
              > since we are the largest council to adopt this policy. Only time will
              > tell if this policy will yield the benefits, especially with retention,
              > that we hoped for.
              >
              > Judy Yeager
              > HOAC Council Training Chair
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • The Rooneys
              ... Because Gail, we live in a culture where 80% of the people will do what s right without a deadline. The other 20% will make excuse after excuse, taking up
              Message 6 of 10 , Aug 29, 2011
              • 0 Attachment
                > While I agree training is important, I think the implementation has been a bit harsh.
                > I was literally told, "Thanks for your ten years of service, if you don't take this class by this time, we don't want you any more."
                >
                > And I find this statement from your post cold and heartless:
                >
                > " If you lose some leaders, you lose them. If you lose a few units, they were probably on their way
                > out anyway."
                >
                > Is this really what's best for the scouts? Why yes..., yes it is the best thing for Scouts.

                Because Gail, we live in a culture where 80% of the people will do what's right without a deadline. The other 20% will make excuse after excuse, taking up more and more time of the the very volunteers who care the most. My council has been stating for 18 months that mandatory top leader training starts with the 2012 recharter. And the howls of protest are already beginning to start.

                In response we have NINE scheduled specific program leader training session scheduled and FOUR ITOLS classes (including a 4-6 hour ITOLS test out session for outdoor "experienced" Scouters). We are making Roundtable announcements, phone calls and email notifications to every unit leader in every district.

                if they can't make time for training, then they are not making time for the scouts in their charge.

                Shame on them.

                --- Jim


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • eagle9252
                {soap box on} I don t do politics well. I like it the old way, your word is your honor. they said have it or leave nough said sorry to be blunt but there is no
                Message 7 of 10 , Aug 29, 2011
                • 0 Attachment
                  {soap box on}

                  I don't do politics well.

                  I like it the old way, your word is your honor.

                  they said have it or leave

                  nough said

                  sorry to be blunt but there is no reason to continue on this road.

                  we have told everyone that in 2 years, if you are not trained in your
                  primary position you will not be able to recharter.
                  That is so simple even a cave man can understand it. When I was in cub
                  scouts the charter org said you will go through our YPT and you will have a
                  background check done and you will have your finger prints taken. If you
                  have a problem with this your services will no longer be needed.

                  if people would spend the energy that they waste on complaining and fix what
                  is request you would have extra time left over. I promise!!

                  {soap box off}
                  On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 7:52 PM, The Rooneys <rooney-family@...>wrote:

                  > **
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > > While I agree training is important, I think the implementation has been
                  > a bit harsh.
                  > > I was literally told, "Thanks for your ten years of service, if you don't
                  > take this class by this time, we don't want you any more."
                  > >
                  > > And I find this statement from your post cold and heartless:
                  > >
                  > > " If you lose some leaders, you lose them. If you lose a few units, they
                  > were probably on their way
                  > > out anyway."
                  > >
                  > > Is this really what's best for the scouts? Why yes..., yes it is the best
                  > thing for Scouts.
                  >
                  > Because Gail, we live in a culture where 80% of the people will do what's
                  > right without a deadline. The other 20% will make excuse after excuse,
                  > taking up more and more time of the the very volunteers who care the most.
                  > My council has been stating for 18 months that mandatory top leader training
                  > starts with the 2012 recharter. And the howls of protest are already
                  > beginning to start.
                  >
                  > In response we have NINE scheduled specific program leader training session
                  > scheduled and FOUR ITOLS classes (including a 4-6 hour ITOLS test out
                  > session for outdoor "experienced" Scouters). We are making Roundtable
                  > announcements, phone calls and email notifications to every unit leader in
                  > every district.
                  >
                  > if they can't make time for training, then they are not making time for the
                  > scouts in their charge.
                  >
                  > Shame on them.
                  >
                  > --- Jim
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Rick Hanke
                  Well Said & AMEN! ________________________________ From: eagle9252 To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, August 29, 2011 8:42 PM
                  Message 8 of 10 , Aug 30, 2011
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Well Said & AMEN!


                    ________________________________
                    From: eagle9252 <eagle9252@...>
                    To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Monday, August 29, 2011 8:42 PM
                    Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Manditory Training

                    {soap box on}

                    I don't do politics well.

                    I like it the old way, your word is your honor.

                    they said have it or leave

                    nough said

                    sorry to be blunt but there is no reason to continue on this road.

                    we have told everyone that in 2 years, if you are not trained in your
                    primary position you will not be able to recharter.
                    That is so simple even a cave man can understand it. When I was in cub
                    scouts the charter org said you will go through our YPT and you will have a
                    background check done and you will have your finger prints taken. If you
                    have a problem with this your services will no longer be needed.

                    if people would spend the energy that they waste on complaining and fix what
                    is request you would have extra time left over. I promise!!

                    {soap box off}
                    On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 7:52 PM, The Rooneys <rooney-family@...>wrote:

                    > **
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > > While I agree training is important, I think the implementation has been
                    > a bit harsh.
                    > > I was literally told, "Thanks for your ten years of service, if you don't
                    > take this class by this time, we don't want you any more."
                    > >
                    > > And I find this statement from your post cold and heartless:
                    > >
                    > > " If you lose some leaders, you lose them. If you lose a few units, they
                    > were probably on their way
                    > > out anyway."
                    > >
                    > > Is this really what's best for the scouts? Why yes..., yes it is the best
                    > thing for Scouts.
                    >
                    > Because Gail, we live in a culture where 80% of the people will do what's
                    > right without a deadline. The other 20% will make excuse after excuse,
                    > taking up more and more time of the the very volunteers who care the most.
                    > My council has been stating for 18 months that mandatory top leader training
                    > starts with the 2012 recharter. And the howls of protest are already
                    > beginning to start.
                    >
                    > In response we have NINE scheduled specific program leader training session
                    > scheduled and FOUR ITOLS classes (including a 4-6 hour ITOLS test out
                    > session for outdoor "experienced" Scouters). We are making Roundtable
                    > announcements, phone calls and email notifications to every unit leader in
                    > every district.
                    >
                    > if they can't make time for training, then they are not making time for the
                    > scouts in their charge.
                    >
                    > Shame on them.
                    >
                    > --- Jim
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >

                    >


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • patrick dulzo
                    Well I think I will jumo on the soap box as well.  Every scout deserves a trained leader.  Why would a leader not want to get trained??????  What reason
                    Message 9 of 10 , Aug 30, 2011
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Well I think I will jumo on the soap box as well.  Every scout deserves a trained leader.  Why would a leader not want to get trained??????  What reason would be valid?????  I am the district traiing chair for one of two districts that are piloting mandatory requirements.  Our council allowed the district committee to make our own requirements and put them into place.  By next charter in 2012, all direct contact leaders MUST be trained, and 50% of all non-direct contact leaders per unit must be trained. 
                       
                      The trainers need to get creative for training opportunities though.  I am grabbing people out of roundtables that need it and having my computer set up and logged into my scouting, for IOLS,, I have the test off for the "experienced" scouters and am using it.  I do not anticipate losing any leaders that are active in the direct of non-direct areas.  I do expect the charters to get "cleaned up" a bit.  I know we have leaders still on charters that are not active or come once in a while.  One of the solutions I cam up with these people is talk to them and drop them or move them to committee members, which only require online courses. 
                       
                      I am about finished with a scoutmaster specific that I am trying on a blackboard online learning platform that will help out greatly with this class.  If any of you would like to take a look at it please shoot me a separate email and I would welcome any input.
                       


                      Patrick Dulzo
                      815-970-2751 cell

                      --- On Tue, 8/30/11, Rick Hanke <rick_hanke@...> wrote:


                      From: Rick Hanke <rick_hanke@...>
                      Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Manditory Training
                      To: "scouter_t@yahoogroups.com" <scouter_t@yahoogroups.com>
                      Date: Tuesday, August 30, 2011, 6:39 AM


                       



                      Well Said & AMEN!

                      ________________________________
                      From: eagle9252 <eagle9252@...>
                      To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Monday, August 29, 2011 8:42 PM
                      Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Manditory Training

                      {soap box on}

                      I don't do politics well.

                      I like it the old way, your word is your honor.

                      they said have it or leave

                      nough said

                      sorry to be blunt but there is no reason to continue on this road.

                      we have told everyone that in 2 years, if you are not trained in your
                      primary position you will not be able to recharter.
                      That is so simple even a cave man can understand it. When I was in cub
                      scouts the charter org said you will go through our YPT and you will have a
                      background check done and you will have your finger prints taken. If you
                      have a problem with this your services will no longer be needed.

                      if people would spend the energy that they waste on complaining and fix what
                      is request you would have extra time left over. I promise!!

                      {soap box off}
                      On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 7:52 PM, The Rooneys <rooney-family@...>wrote:

                      > **
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > > While I agree training is important, I think the implementation has been
                      > a bit harsh.
                      > > I was literally told, "Thanks for your ten years of service, if you don't
                      > take this class by this time, we don't want you any more."
                      > >
                      > > And I find this statement from your post cold and heartless:
                      > >
                      > > " If you lose some leaders, you lose them. If you lose a few units, they
                      > were probably on their way
                      > > out anyway."
                      > >
                      > > Is this really what's best for the scouts? Why yes..., yes it is the best
                      > thing for Scouts.
                      >
                      > Because Gail, we live in a culture where 80% of the people will do what's
                      > right without a deadline. The other 20% will make excuse after excuse,
                      > taking up more and more time of the the very volunteers who care the most.
                      > My council has been stating for 18 months that mandatory top leader training
                      > starts with the 2012 recharter. And the howls of protest are already
                      > beginning to start.
                      >
                      > In response we have NINE scheduled specific program leader training session
                      > scheduled and FOUR ITOLS classes (including a 4-6 hour ITOLS test out
                      > session for outdoor "experienced" Scouters). We are making Roundtable
                      > announcements, phone calls and email notifications to every unit leader in
                      > every district.
                      >
                      > if they can't make time for training, then they are not making time for the
                      > scouts in their charge.
                      >
                      > Shame on them.
                      >
                      > --- Jim
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >

                      >

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Samuel Harley
                      I would like to see your scoutmaster specific that I am trying on a blackboard online learning platform YISAIB Dr. Samuel F. Harley, PhD Harley Science and
                      Message 10 of 10 , Aug 30, 2011
                      • 0 Attachment
                        I would like to see your "scoutmaster specific that I am trying on a blackboard
                        online learning platform"

                        YISAIB
                        Dr. Samuel F. Harley, PhD
                        Harley Science and Technology, Inc




                        ________________________________
                        From: patrick dulzo <pdulzo@...>
                        To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Tue, August 30, 2011 9:22:08 AM
                        Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Manditory Training


                        Well I think I will jumo on the soap box as well. Every scout deserves a
                        trained leader. Why would a leader not want to get trained?????? What reason
                        would be valid????? I am the district traiing chair for one of two districts
                        that are piloting mandatory requirements. Our council allowed the district
                        committee to make our own requirements and put them into place. By next charter
                        in 2012, all direct contact leaders MUST be trained, and 50% of all non-direct
                        contact leaders per unit must be trained.


                        The trainers need to get creative for training opportunities though. I am
                        grabbing people out of roundtables that need it and having my computer set up
                        and logged into my scouting, for IOLS,, I have the test off for the
                        "experienced" scouters and am using it. I do not anticipate losing any leaders
                        that are active in the direct of non-direct areas. I do expect the charters to
                        get "cleaned up" a bit. I know we have leaders still on charters that are not
                        active or come once in a while. One of the solutions I cam up with these people
                        is talk to them and drop them or move them to committee members, which only
                        require online courses.


                        I am about finished with a scoutmaster specific that I am trying on a blackboard
                        online learning platform that will help out greatly with this class. If any of
                        you would like to take a look at it please shoot me a separate email and I would
                        welcome any input.


                        Patrick Dulzo
                        815-970-2751 cell

                        --- On Tue, 8/30/11, Rick Hanke <rick_hanke@...> wrote:

                        From: Rick Hanke <rick_hanke@...>
                        Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Manditory Training
                        To: "scouter_t@yahoogroups.com" <scouter_t@yahoogroups.com>
                        Date: Tuesday, August 30, 2011, 6:39 AM



                        Well Said & AMEN!

                        ________________________________
                        From: eagle9252 <eagle9252@...>
                        To: scouter_t@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Monday, August 29, 2011 8:42 PM
                        Subject: Re: [Scouter_T] Manditory Training

                        {soap box on}

                        I don't do politics well.

                        I like it the old way, your word is your honor.

                        they said have it or leave

                        nough said

                        sorry to be blunt but there is no reason to continue on this road.

                        we have told everyone that in 2 years, if you are not trained in your
                        primary position you will not be able to recharter.
                        That is so simple even a cave man can understand it. When I was in cub
                        scouts the charter org said you will go through our YPT and you will have a
                        background check done and you will have your finger prints taken. If you
                        have a problem with this your services will no longer be needed.

                        if people would spend the energy that they waste on complaining and fix what
                        is request you would have extra time left over. I promise!!

                        {soap box off}
                        On Mon, Aug 29, 2011 at 7:52 PM, The Rooneys <rooney-family@...>wrote:

                        > **
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > > While I agree training is important, I think the implementation has been
                        > a bit harsh.
                        > > I was literally told, "Thanks for your ten years of service, if you don't
                        > take this class by this time, we don't want you any more."
                        > >
                        > > And I find this statement from your post cold and heartless:
                        > >
                        > > " If you lose some leaders, you lose them. If you lose a few units, they
                        > were probably on their way
                        > > out anyway."
                        > >
                        > > Is this really what's best for the scouts? Why yes..., yes it is the best
                        > thing for Scouts.
                        >
                        > Because Gail, we live in a culture where 80% of the people will do what's
                        > right without a deadline. The other 20% will make excuse after excuse,
                        > taking up more and more time of the the very volunteers who care the most.
                        > My council has been stating for 18 months that mandatory top leader training
                        > starts with the 2012 recharter. And the howls of protest are already
                        > beginning to start.
                        >
                        > In response we have NINE scheduled specific program leader training session
                        > scheduled and FOUR ITOLS classes (including a 4-6 hour ITOLS test out
                        > session for outdoor "experienced" Scouters). We are making Roundtable
                        > announcements, phone calls and email notifications to every unit leader in
                        > every district.
                        >
                        > if they can't make time for training, then they are not making time for the
                        > scouts in their charge.
                        >
                        > Shame on them.
                        >
                        > --- Jim
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                        >

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                        ------------------------------------

                        For subscription and delevery options send a message to:
                        scouter_t-help@yahoogroups.com

                        Scouting The Net - http://www.ScoutingTheNet.com/Yahoo! Groups Links

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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