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RE: [scots-origins] Colvin, Herron, McQueen

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  • Lynda Lewis
    Hi, I hope someone can help point me in the right direction. I live in Barbados and have traced my ancestry back to mid 1700 s but cannot locate connection to
    Message 1 of 28 , Mar 30 8:18 AM
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      Hi,

      I hope someone can help point me in the right direction. I live in Barbados
      and have traced my ancestry back to mid 1700's but cannot locate connection
      to UK. I have always heard that we are either Scottish / Irish, possibly
      deported, indentured slaves or emigrants. Can anyone help with the surnames
      Lewis and Corbin?

      Lynda



      _____

      From: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scots-origins@yahoogroups.com]
      On Behalf Of Janet
      Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 11:07 AM
      To: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [scots-origins] Colvin, Herron, McQueen



      I think you might find the information at this site interesting, if not
      totally accurate of your ancestry, as you do not say from which part of the
      island of Ireland you thought you originated. http://www.ulsteran
      <http://www.ulsterancestry.com/ulster-scots.html>
      cestry.com/ulster-scots.html

      Janet

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "branson_mom" <gayleannherron@
      <mailto:gayleannherron%40centurytel.net> centurytel.net>

      > All my life I heard I was Irish, my husband the same; only recently we
      > have learned in all likelihood our lineages are actually Scotish in
      > origin.
      >
      > Does anyone have any feedback on either theory? We cannot get our
      > family tree far enough to link to a crossing to the USA, so no hints
      > there.
      >
      > Thanks, have a great Spring day.
      > gayle





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Gayle
      Hi Janet, Nice to meet you and thank you for that link. I have been over to it and am still trying to figure it out. It is my understanding that both our
      Message 2 of 28 , Mar 30 2:27 PM
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        Hi Janet,

        Nice to meet you and thank you for that link. I have been over to it
        and am still trying to figure it out. It is my understanding that both
        our families are actually from that area so you hit right on the mark.
        That was very nice of you to respond and to send me that information.

        Have you been doing this family history/genealogy stuff long? I am a
        novice who has been a novice for a very long time, experience hasn't
        taught me much, but I still enjoy it.

        Are you in the USA or elsewhere? I am in Branson Missouri USA

        Gayle



        Janet wrote:
        >
        > I think you might find the information at this site interesting, if
        > not totally accurate of your ancestry, as you do not say from which
        > part of the island of Ireland you thought you originated.
        > http://www.ulsterancestry.com/ulster-scots.html
        > <http://www.ulsterancestry.com/ulster-scots.html>
        >
        > Janet
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: "branson_mom" <gayleannherron@...
        > <mailto:gayleannherron%40centurytel.net>>
        >
        > > All my life I heard I was Irish, my husband the same; only recently we
        > > have learned in all likelihood our lineages are actually Scotish in
        > > origin.
        > >
        > > Does anyone have any feedback on either theory? We cannot get our
        > > family tree far enough to link to a crossing to the USA, so no hints
        > > there.
        > >
        > > Thanks, have a great Spring day.
        > > gayle
        >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Julian
        ... Hello Gayle, The only way to prove for sure, is to check death certificates which should show parents names and born in: Scotland or Ireland. Some early
        Message 3 of 28 , Mar 30 2:48 PM
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          --- In scots-origins@yahoogroups.com, "branson_mom"
          <gayleannherron@...> wrote:
          >
          > All my life I heard I was Irish, my husband the same; only recently we
          > have learned in all likelihood our lineages are actually Scotish in
          > origin.
          >
          > Does anyone have any feedback on either theory? We cannot get our
          > family tree far enough to link to a crossing to the USA, so no hints
          > there.
          >

          Hello Gayle,
          The only way to prove for sure, is to check death certificates which
          should show parents names and born in: Scotland or Ireland. Some early
          censuses might also help. Ships passenger lists might also help, but
          you will need their names first.

          Theres no other way I'm afraid.
          All the best of luck.
          Julian
        • Alistair Cameron
          ... Not much difference. Same Gaelic language, same social system, the national borders only 12 mi apart at the closest point. And regular commuting between
          Message 4 of 28 , Mar 30 7:49 PM
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            Gale wrote:

            > All my life I heard I was Irish, my husband the same; only recently we
            > have learned in all likelihood our lineages are actually Scotish in
            > origin.

            Not much difference. Same Gaelic language, same social
            system, the national borders only 12 mi apart at the closest
            point. And regular commuting between the countries,
            unrecorded, on ferry or fishing boat.
            >
            > Does anyone have any feedback on either theory? We cannot get our
            > family tree far enough to link to a crossing to the USA, so no hints
            > there.

            Until you find tree data to connect into Brit Isles you
            remain mystified.

            Put the actual names and dates into your messages.
            Unsuspected relatives are lurking here waiting to pounce on you!

            COLVIN seems associated with COLLVILE so think Stirlingshire.

            HERRON seems unscottish so look away from it.

            MCQUEEN is Highland and Islands.

            But a surname alone doesn't point unerringly to ancestral
            lands. You hafta work at proving pedigree and that may prove
            to be a lifetime job. Enjoy!!

            Cheers,

            ALISTAIR M. CAMERON A.A.G.R.A.

            Professional Genealogist
            http://quozl.netrek.org/cameron-research/

            PO Box 215 BUNDANOON NSW 2578 AUSTRALIA

            Visit Bundanoon Village Website...
            http://www.bundanoon.com.au/
          • Wayne.D.Jackson@comcast.net
            Gayle- Finding myself in a similar situation, upon the advice of experienced searchers, I traced my family (McGen, McGan, Machan, and a legion of permutations)
            Message 5 of 28 , Mar 31 1:05 AM
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              Gayle-

              Finding myself in a similar situation, upon the advice of experienced searchers, I traced my family (McGen, McGan, Machan, and a legion of permutations) BACKWARDS FROM THE PRESENT TIME until I found my earliest direct descendants listed in US Census Records (1850-1930 all include country of birth). Since my relatives consistently listed Scotland as their Country of Birth in these census records from 1850-1880, I accept it that they were born in Scotland.

              Of course, my family may have moved from Ireland to Scotland at anytime before 1818, which is the date of oldest Scottish birth I have been able to document with US Census Records; e.g., some McGen's are recorded in the 1841 Scottish Census as having been born in Ireland prior to 1820. The meagerness of computerized Scottish Records prior to the enactment of the Scottish registration laws of 1855 has further hindered my search

              As for my family's date of arrival in North America (sometime between 1825-1844), the exact arrival date and location (US or Canada) are uncertain due to my inability to find them in published passenger lists. My first hard evidence of US residence is a birth recorded in Vermont in 1845.

              Hopefully, you will find your path of research aided by my and others' experiences and methodology.

              Wayne
              Kirkland, Washington, USA



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Kay Inglis
              My scottish ancesters were iron/coal miners eventually moving to Northern England, Whitehaven and Seaton Delaval. Both mining towns. There they married Irish
              Message 6 of 28 , Mar 31 6:01 AM
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                My scottish ancesters were iron/coal miners eventually moving to
                Northern England, Whitehaven and Seaton Delaval. Both mining towns.
                There they married Irish (McGarrigle, Woods). Whitehaven was a center
                of shipping, slave and rum running and coal mining. It also had some of
                the worst slum housing in England. Ireland is very close to England at
                this point so the Irish were used to work in the shipping and mining
                (also the scottish). When my relatives came to North America (coal
                mining on Vancouver Island) we thought most of them were Scottish but
                they are mostly Irish. The funny thing is my Scottish surnames are
                Anderson, Nielsen and Robertson. While I have them traced back to the
                1700's in Scotland me thinks they might be from Denmark, etc.. Who are
                we really!


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Brandy Burton-Tarantino
                ... born in: Scotland or Ireland. Some early ... first. ... Which brings to mind a question. Using myself as an example.......I was born in England of an
                Message 7 of 28 , Apr 2, 2007
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                  --- Julian <julianlovegrove@...> wrote:

                  > Hello Gayle,
                  > The only way to prove for sure, is to check death
                  > certificates which should show parents names and
                  born in: Scotland or Ireland. Some early
                  > censuses might also help. Ships passenger lists
                  > might also help, but you will need their names
                  first.
                  >
                  > Theres no other way I'm afraid.
                  > All the best of luck.
                  > Julian

                  Which brings to mind a question. Using myself as an
                  example.......I was born in England of an American
                  father so by law I'm a citizen of both countries.
                  Am I English, or am I American....or....

                  We muddy the waters....my mother was born in
                  Scotland...her siblings born from Ireland (oldest)
                  thru Scotland into England (sucsessive births moving
                  further South). Is she a Scot? Is her eldest sister
                  Irish? Her youngest English?

                  Her father is easy...he's a Scot, born of Scots, born
                  of Scots, in Scotland. But what would you consider
                  his children?





                  SnoLine/Schneegrenze Kennels Brandy Burton-Tarantino
                  Labrador Retrievers & German Shepherd Dogs
                  PNW Rescue Representative for the Labrador Retriever Club, Inc.
                  ** http://www.eskimo.com/~snoline & http://www.jtvisions.com **
                  ** SNOLINE BOARDING KENNELS - ARLINGTON, WA **



                  ____________________________________________________________________________________
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                • Trena
                  ... From: Wayne.D.Jackson@comcast.net Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2007 4:05 AM Subject: Re: [scots-origins] Colvin, Herron, McQueen Finding myself in a similar
                  Message 8 of 28 , Apr 2, 2007
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                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Wayne.D.Jackson@...
                    Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2007 4:05 AM
                    Subject: Re: [scots-origins] Colvin, Herron, McQueen

                    Finding myself in a similar situation, upon the advice of experienced
                    searchers, I traced my family (McGen, McGan, Machan, and a
                    legion of permutations) BACKWARDS FROM THE PRESENT TIME
                    *****
                    Hello Wayne,

                    This appears to be a great problem with many people ... they do not start
                    with themselves, working backwards _ proving _ the facts with documentation
                    .. at the very least, where the documents are with reference numbers, so
                    anyone else coming along afterward can verify the data. As you say also,
                    the surname may not be spelt the way you think. Just because your parent
                    spelt it one way, doesn't mean granddad did. We have two brothers in one
                    family who couldn't agree on how their surname was spelt, which is still an
                    'argument' within the family to this day!
                    *****

                    until I found my earliest direct descendants listed in US Census Records
                    (1850-1930 all include country of birth). Since my relatives consistently
                    listed Scotland as their Country of Birth in these census records from
                    1850-1880, I accept it that they were born in Scotland.
                    ****rest snipped****

                    Once you have exhausted all the records in [your case] the USA [with the
                    exception of finding passenger listings/ship's manifest], you can then make
                    the 'tentative' leap to Scotland [again in your case], as your ancestors
                    consistantly listed Scotland as their country of origin.

                    The big question then becomes ... "Just where in Scotland?" Adding to that:
                    If it was MCGEN, MCGAN et al in the USA, that doesn't mean the name(s) were
                    used in Scotland. They could be corruptions another surnames and/or
                    aliases. The further back you go, the more likely this is so, especially
                    with MC and MAC surnames. MacDonald, MacGreggor/MacGreigor, Stewart/Stuart
                    (+ spelling variations) etc, are just a couple of examples of surnames which
                    others unrelated to the original bearer of the name, 'adopted' as their own
                    and/or used as an alias.

                    Personally I'm quite happy I have none of those surnames within my direct
                    line, for no doubt I'd be coming to a dead end with any one of them, if I
                    were lucky enough to find my own at all, in the early 1800s or back into the
                    1700s. Bad enough some of my ancestors are from Shetland where the use of
                    patronymics was the norm pre-1800, but in some cases continued until
                    mid-1800s.

                    Seems to me, Wayne, you are doing things the correct way, backwards one step
                    at a time, verifying each tid-bit of data. May you find the ship(s) which
                    brought your ancestors to the US shores and hopefully find the [true]
                    connection within Scotland.

                    Good luck and all the best,
                    Toni ~ Ontario
                    Seeking REIDFORDs world wide/originating NE Scotland.

                    AND on the eighth day God said, "OK, Murphy, take over."
                  • Gayle
                    Dear Kay, I just am getting around to reading my emails and I ve gotta tell you, your email was so reassuring for me. I have felt so confused and absolutely
                    Message 9 of 28 , Apr 2, 2007
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                      Dear Kay,

                      I just am getting around to reading my emails and I've gotta tell you,
                      your email was so reassuring for me. I have felt so confused and
                      absolutely lost over who I am and what my lineage really is that I think
                      I will die long before it is every figured out, if it ever is. I wanted
                      so much to be able to leave my children a legacy of knowing the truth of
                      their ancestry, good or bad, just to know the truth, but I am afraid the
                      truth is long gone and will never be known. I think in my family's case
                      although they often appeared to be intelligent educated industrious
                      folks, there are reasons to suspect they were up to something that made
                      them often want to disappear into the nights.

                      I hope you find your lines, like you, Scottish, Irish, Danish, Welsh,
                      whatever, wouldn't it just be nice to know?

                      Gayle


                      Kay Inglis wrote:
                      >
                      > My scottish ancesters were iron/coal miners eventually moving to
                      > Northern England, Whitehaven and Seaton Delaval. Both mining towns.
                      > There they married Irish (McGarrigle, Woods). Whitehaven was a center
                      > of shipping, slave and rum running and coal mining. It also had some of
                      > the worst slum housing in England. Ireland is very close to England at
                      > this point so the Irish were used to work in the shipping and mining
                      > (also the scottish). When my relatives came to North America (coal
                      > mining on Vancouver Island) we thought most of them were Scottish but
                      > they are mostly Irish. The funny thing is my Scottish surnames are
                      > Anderson, Nielsen and Robertson. While I have them traced back to the
                      > 1700's in Scotland me thinks they might be from Denmark, etc.. Who are
                      > we really!
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      >


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Gayle
                      Hi Wayne, I wish I could even get one legal document that stated a birth place other than in the USA. My oldest record is the 1850 which shows my Colvin
                      Message 10 of 28 , Apr 2, 2007
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                        Hi Wayne,

                        I wish I could even get one legal document that stated a birth place
                        other than in the USA. My oldest record is the 1850 which shows my
                        Colvin ancestor living in Indiana and born in Kentucky. A researcher of
                        Colvins in California told me a few more generations back she had in her
                        records, but still, nothing that took me off of US soil. And this gal,
                        who is suppose to really know her stuff, says any trace dies right
                        there. My confirmed line ends in mid-1700s when Joseph Colvin of
                        Augusta Virginia was recorded on a deed, he later died in Crab Orchard,
                        Lincoln, Kentucky around the early 1800s. Beyond that, there is a
                        William Colvin in the 1700s who was supposedly born in Spotsvania
                        Virginia and died in Lincoln Kentucky toward the end of that century,
                        and he and his wife Susannah can't even be confirm as the father of
                        Joseph, just hypothesized. So, even if I could confirm Wm, I still
                        haven't a clue who his parents were or where they were from.

                        As far as the name Colvin is, it apparently isn't really a name that
                        existed much further back than the period I note. At some point it was
                        changed from some other name, many suggested possibilities, and each one
                        sends me in a different direction (Irish, Scottish, Welsh, Spanish,
                        English, etc).

                        I do find it interesting when I type in Colvin for links to various
                        locales, sometimes it will suggest areas in Northern Ireland or near
                        there to the West that notes Colvins in the Ulster area and
                        thereabouts. Same with my husband's name, Herron, but in reality I have
                        yet to find one person who lived there other than in contemporary times.

                        Thanks for the support and encouragement, it is great to be making new
                        pals on the internet, I guess we are all in this together.

                        Gayle

                        Wayne.D.Jackson@... wrote:
                        >
                        > Gayle-
                        >
                        > Finding myself in a similar situation, upon the advice of experienced
                        > searchers, I traced my family (McGen, McGan, Machan, and a legion of
                        > permutations) BACKWARDS FROM THE PRESENT TIME until I found my
                        > earliest direct descendants listed in US Census Records (1850-1930 all
                        > include country of birth). Since my relatives consistently listed
                        > Scotland as their Country of Birth in these census records from
                        > 1850-1880, I accept it that they were born in Scotland.
                        >
                        > Of course, my family may have moved from Ireland to Scotland at
                        > anytime before 1818, which is the date of oldest Scottish birth I have
                        > been able to document with US Census Records; e.g., some McGen's are
                        > recorded in the 1841 Scottish Census as having been born in Ireland
                        > prior to 1820. The meagerness of computerized Scottish Records prior
                        > to the enactment of the Scottish registration laws of 1855 has further
                        > hindered my search
                        >
                        > As for my family's date of arrival in North America (sometime between
                        > 1825-1844), the exact arrival date and location (US or Canada) are
                        > uncertain due to my inability to find them in published passenger
                        > lists. My first hard evidence of US residence is a birth recorded in
                        > Vermont in 1845.
                        >
                        > Hopefully, you will find your path of research aided by my and others'
                        > experiences and methodology.
                        >
                        > Wayne
                        > Kirkland, Washington, USA
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Gayle
                        Lynda, Janet gave me a link to a great site that I have found interesting. I haven t found anything concrete for me, yet, but at least it gives me hope as it
                        Message 11 of 28 , Apr 2, 2007
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                          Lynda,

                          Janet gave me a link to a great site that I have found interesting. I
                          haven't found anything concrete for me, yet, but at least it gives me
                          hope as it does acknowledge the names I am researching. Every other
                          link I've been given suggests the same area but hasn't given me any kind
                          of support specific to our names. May I suggest you also check this
                          below in her reply?

                          I think there was some really weird stuff going on in Ireland and
                          Scotland during the 1700 and 1800s that drove folks back and forth
                          between islands and eventually across the ocean to the west. I mean, I
                          know there was all the religious political thing, and the famiine, and I
                          know statistically most of any of our ancestors must be part of the
                          masses (peasants) and therefore seldom note worthy, but geeze this is
                          hard. My Colvin name seems pretty much made-up from some other name of
                          which could have many one of many possibilities, and my husband's Herron
                          isn't much better.

                          Good luck, I hope that link gives you hope it did me.

                          Gayle

                          Lynda Lewis wrote:
                          >
                          > Hi,
                          >
                          > I hope someone can help point me in the right direction. I live in
                          > Barbados
                          > and have traced my ancestry back to mid 1700's but cannot locate
                          > connection
                          > to UK. I have always heard that we are either Scottish / Irish, possibly
                          > deported, indentured slaves or emigrants. Can anyone help with the
                          > surnames
                          > Lewis and Corbin?
                          >
                          > Lynda
                          >
                          > _____
                          >
                          > From: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com
                          > <mailto:scots-origins%40yahoogroups.com>
                          > [mailto:scots-origins@yahoogroups.com
                          > <mailto:scots-origins%40yahoogroups.com>]
                          > On Behalf Of Janet
                          > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 11:07 AM
                          > To: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com <mailto:scots-origins%40yahoogroups.com>
                          > Subject: Re: [scots-origins] Colvin, Herron, McQueen
                          >
                          > I think you might find the information at this site interesting, if not
                          > totally accurate of your ancestry, as you do not say from which part
                          > of the
                          > island of Ireland you thought you originated. http://www.ulsteran
                          > <http://www.ulsterancestry.com/ulster-scots.html
                          > <http://www.ulsterancestry.com/ulster-scots.html>>
                          > cestry.com/ulster-scots.html
                          >
                          > Janet
                          >
                          > ----- Original Message -----
                          > From: "branson_mom" <gayleannherron@
                          > <mailto:gayleannherron%40centurytel.net> centurytel.net>
                          >
                          > > All my life I heard I was Irish, my husband the same; only recently we
                          > > have learned in all likelihood our lineages are actually Scotish in
                          > > origin.
                          > >
                          > > Does anyone have any feedback on either theory? We cannot get our
                          > > family tree far enough to link to a crossing to the USA, so no hints
                          > > there.
                          > >
                          > > Thanks, have a great Spring day.
                          > > gayle
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          >


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Gayle
                          Hi Julian, I just spent about three hours after about ten yesterday and uncounted this weekend doing my research and have decided my ancestors were either
                          Message 12 of 28 , Apr 3, 2007
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                            Hi Julian, I just spent about three hours after about ten yesterday and
                            uncounted this weekend doing my research and have decided my ancestors
                            were either bandits that evaded prosecution by changing their names and
                            locations in the dark of night, or they swam here from unknown origins
                            and washed upon shores onto to have forgotten their names and picked
                            Colvin because it sounded good at the time, or we have to revisit the
                            odd-ball theory of aliens from outer space.

                            Serious though, it might as well be any of the latter because I don't
                            think my relations were accounted in birth, death, or marriage records
                            in the early 1700s or latter 1600s, or there was a name change that made
                            any link impossible - any way, I don't see any way of connecting those
                            exited ships to those in my ancestry. Well, humor aside, I am done for
                            the day, I'm gonna go vote.

                            Have a great day and thanks for the encouragement.

                            Gayle

                            Brandy Burton-Tarantino wrote:
                            >
                            > --- Julian <julianlovegrove@...
                            > <mailto:julianlovegrove%40hotmail.com>> wrote:
                            >
                            > > Hello Gayle,
                            > > The only way to prove for sure, is to check death
                            > > certificates which should show parents names and
                            > born in: Scotland or Ireland. Some early
                            > > censuses might also help. Ships passenger lists
                            > > might also help, but you will need their names
                            > first.
                            > >
                            > > Theres no other way I'm afraid.
                            > > All the best of luck.
                            > > Julian
                            >
                            > Which brings to mind a question. Using myself as an
                            > example.......I was born in England of an American
                            > father so by law I'm a citizen of both countries.
                            > Am I English, or am I American....or....
                            >
                            > We muddy the waters....my mother was born in
                            > Scotland...her siblings born from Ireland (oldest)
                            > thru Scotland into England (sucsessive births moving
                            > further South). Is she a Scot? Is her eldest sister
                            > Irish? Her youngest English?
                            >
                            > Her father is easy...he's a Scot, born of Scots, born
                            > of Scots, in Scotland. But what would you consider
                            > his children?
                            >
                            > SnoLine/Schneegrenze Kennels Brandy Burton-Tarantino
                            > Labrador Retrievers & German Shepherd Dogs
                            > PNW Rescue Representative for the Labrador Retriever Club, Inc.
                            > ** http://www.eskimo.com/~snoline <http://www.eskimo.com/%7Esnoline> &
                            > http://www.jtvisions.com <http://www.jtvisions.com> **
                            > ** SNOLINE BOARDING KENNELS - ARLINGTON, WA **
                            >
                            > __________________________________________________________
                            > It's here! Your new message!
                            > Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar.
                            > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/
                            > <http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/>
                            >
                            >


                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • MITSFN1@aol.com
                            Herron is Scottish. I know because my great Uncle Hector Herron was from Scotland. Michele ************************************** See what s free at
                            Message 13 of 28 , Apr 3, 2007
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                              Herron is Scottish. I know because my great Uncle Hector Herron was from
                              Scotland.

                              Michele



                              ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com


                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • Janet
                              I have an idea that the test is that where there are two parents of the same origin, i.e. Scots, and two grand parents of Scots origin, the grand child is
                              Message 14 of 28 , Apr 3, 2007
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                                I have an idea that the test is that where there are two parents of the same origin, i.e. Scots, and two grand parents of Scots origin, the grand child is Scots, but that test stops if one of the grand parents is Scots and the other English; it would mean that the child is half English, half Scots.
                                It happens in my lineage, my father Scots born, my Mother born England of a Scots father [putatively] and grandmother who wasnt born in Scotland but here parents were both born in Scotland.
                                On the other hand, it seems that my father may not have been Scottish since I found some evidence there was a marriage in Ireland and children born in Ireland. On the basis however that marriages usually took place where the bride was born, it may just be that my Father is full Scots after all. We do know that people of Ireland travelled to Scotland to find work, and vice versa.

                                Janet



                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: "Brandy Burton-Tarantino" <b2t@...>
                                >
                                > Her father is easy...he's a Scot, born of Scots, born
                                > of Scots, in Scotland. But what would you consider
                                > his children?
                              • David Kilgour
                                Linda. the 1745 rebellion ended at Culloden, when about 1200 Scots Highlanders were literally slaughtered. 1150 survivors were rounded up and sent to
                                Message 15 of 28 , Apr 4, 2007
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                                  Linda. the 1745 rebellion ended at Culloden, when about 1200 Scots
                                  Highlanders were literally slaughtered. 1150 survivors were rounded up
                                  and sent to Barbados, to live in slavery. You might try looking in to
                                  this to find your ancestors
                                  David Kilgour


                                  "I hope someone can help point me in the right direction. I live in
                                  Barbados
                                  and have traced my ancestry back to mid 1700's but cannot locate
                                  connection
                                  to UK. I have always heard that we are either Scottish / Irish, possibly
                                  deported, indentured slaves or emigrants. Can anyone help with the
                                  surnames
                                  Lewis and Corbin?

                                  Lynda"

                                  _____




                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • Janet
                                  There were no formal records of birth marriage and death before 1855 in Scotland. Prior thereto one has to rely on Old Parish Records that only give the name
                                  Message 16 of 28 , Apr 11, 2007
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                                    There were no formal records of birth marriage and death before 1855 in Scotland. Prior thereto one has to rely on Old Parish Records that only give the name of the parties and not their parents etc. This is why you are finding it difficult to find them with certainty.
                                    If you have a birth certificate for 1855 you can find a lot of information upon it.
                                    Records for Ireland, many of them, were destroyed in a huge fire in Dublin in 1922.
                                    Sorry to be the bringer of bad tidings but we are all in the same boat swimming against the genealogy tide. ;-)

                                    Janet


                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    From: "Gayle" <gayleannherron@...>


                                    > Hi Julian, I just spent about three hours after about ten yesterday and
                                    > uncounted this weekend doing my research and have decided my ancestors
                                    > were either bandits that evaded prosecution by changing their names and
                                    > locations in the dark of night, or they swam here from unknown origins
                                    > and washed upon shores onto to have forgotten their names and picked
                                    > Colvin because it sounded good at the time, or we have to revisit the
                                    > odd-ball theory of aliens from outer space.
                                    >
                                    > Serious though, it might as well be any of the latter because I don't
                                    > think my relations were accounted in birth, death, or marriage records
                                    > in the early 1700s or latter 1600s, or there was a name change that made
                                    > any link impossible - any way, I don't see any way of connecting those
                                    > exited ships to those in my ancestry. Well, humor aside, I am done for
                                    > the day, I'm gonna go vote.
                                    >
                                    > Have a great day and thanks for the encouragement.
                                    >
                                    > Gayle
                                    >
                                    > Brandy Burton-Tarantino wrote:
                                  • Rachel Selway
                                    Gayle, Have you thought that they may have been part of a religious reformist group? I don t know how things work in the States but I have family that were
                                    Message 17 of 28 , Apr 11, 2007
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                                      Gayle,



                                      Have you thought that they may have been part of a religious reformist
                                      group?

                                      I don't know how things work in the States but I have family that were
                                      Methodists and no records exist for them in the 1700's as the Methodists
                                      kept their own records.

                                      It's just a thought but for me the trail went dead as soon as I got into the
                                      1700's and it wasn't until I enlisted the help of a genealogist that I found
                                      the reason I couldn't find anything on them.

                                      Luckily there was a will which helped but I'm still stuck with them.



                                      Rachel



                                      _____

                                      From: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com [mailto:scots-origins@yahoogroups.com]
                                      On Behalf Of Gayle
                                      Sent: 03 April 2007 16:39
                                      To: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com
                                      Subject: Re: [scots-origins] Scot? Irish? What?



                                      Hi Julian, I just spent about three hours after about ten yesterday and
                                      uncounted this weekend doing my research and have decided my ancestors
                                      were either bandits that evaded prosecution by changing their names and
                                      locations in the dark of night, or they swam here from unknown origins
                                      and washed upon shores onto to have forgotten their names and picked
                                      Colvin because it sounded good at the time, or we have to revisit the
                                      odd-ball theory of aliens from outer space.

                                      Serious though, it might as well be any of the latter because I don't
                                      think my relations were accounted in birth, death, or marriage records
                                      in the early 1700s or latter 1600s, or there was a name change that made
                                      any link impossible - any way, I don't see any way of connecting those
                                      exited ships to those in my ancestry. Well, humor aside, I am done for
                                      the day, I'm gonna go vote.

                                      Have a great day and thanks for the encouragement.

                                      Gayle

                                      Brandy Burton-Tarantino wrote:
                                      >
                                      > --- Julian <julianlovegrove@ <mailto:julianlovegrove%40hotmail.com>
                                      hotmail.com
                                      > <mailto:julianlovegrove%40hotmail.com>> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > > Hello Gayle,
                                      > > The only way to prove for sure, is to check death
                                      > > certificates which should show parents names and
                                      > born in: Scotland or Ireland. Some early
                                      > > censuses might also help. Ships passenger lists
                                      > > might also help, but you will need their names
                                      > first.
                                      > >
                                      > > Theres no other way I'm afraid.
                                      > > All the best of luck.
                                      > > Julian
                                      >
                                      > Which brings to mind a question. Using myself as an
                                      > example.......I was born in England of an American
                                      > father so by law I'm a citizen of both countries.
                                      > Am I English, or am I American....or....
                                      >
                                      > We muddy the waters....my mother was born in
                                      > Scotland...her siblings born from Ireland (oldest)
                                      > thru Scotland into England (sucsessive births moving
                                      > further South). Is she a Scot? Is her eldest sister
                                      > Irish? Her youngest English?
                                      >
                                      > Her father is easy...he's a Scot, born of Scots, born
                                      > of Scots, in Scotland. But what would you consider
                                      > his children?
                                      >
                                      > SnoLine/Schneegrenze Kennels Brandy Burton-Tarantino
                                      > Labrador Retrievers & German Shepherd Dogs
                                      > PNW Rescue Representative for the Labrador Retriever Club, Inc.
                                      > ** http://www.eskimo. <http://www.eskimo.com/~snoline> com/~snoline
                                      <http://www.eskimo. <http://www.eskimo.com/%7Esnoline> com/%7Esnoline> &
                                      > http://www.jtvision <http://www.jtvisions.com> s.com <http://www.jtvision
                                      <http://www.jtvisions.com> s.com> **
                                      > ** SNOLINE BOARDING KENNELS - ARLINGTON, WA **
                                      >
                                      > __________________________________________________________
                                      > It's here! Your new message!
                                      > Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar.
                                      > http://tools. <http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/>
                                      search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/
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                                      search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/>
                                      >
                                      >

                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • Alistair Cameron
                                      ... David, one of my Highlands male relatives disappeared much later, after 1812. For his sins he may well have been deported as a convict so I tried but
                                      Message 18 of 28 , Apr 11, 2007
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                                        David Kilgour wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Linda. the 1745 rebellion ended at Culloden, when about 1200 Scots
                                        > Highlanders were literally slaughtered. 1150 survivors were rounded up
                                        > and sent to Barbados, to live in slavery.

                                        David, one of my Highlands male relatives "disappeared" much
                                        later, after 1812. For his sins he may well have been
                                        deported as a convict so I tried but failed to recognise him
                                        among the very great numbers sent to AUSTL. 1788- 1850s

                                        Do you know whether Barbados was a destination for convicts,
                                        most of whom had rather minor civil crimes?

                                        Alistair
                                      • petal@sunbeach.net
                                        Hi David, Thanks for the lead will follow-up. Do you know of any records/books that detail the names of those sent or any other information pertaining to that
                                        Message 19 of 28 , Apr 11, 2007
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                                          Hi David,
                                          Thanks for the lead will follow-up.
                                          Do you know of any records/books that detail the names of those sent
                                          or any other information pertaining to that period?
                                          Our Barbados records are quite good once I have a name/ship etc that I
                                          can work with. The records of births, deaths, wills, marriages are
                                          good ... with the exception of some church records lost at sea by
                                          ships sinking in hurricanes!!
                                          Thanks
                                          Lynda Lewis

                                          ----- Message from kilgour1@... ---------
                                          Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2007 15:09:15 -0500
                                          From: David Kilgour <kilgour1@...>
                                          Reply-To: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com
                                          Subject: RE: [scots-origins] Colvin, Herron, McQueen
                                          To: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com


                                          >
                                          > Linda. the 1745 rebellion ended at Culloden, when about 1200 Scots
                                          > Highlanders were literally slaughtered. 1150 survivors were rounded up
                                          > and sent to Barbados, to live in slavery. You might try looking in to
                                          > this to find your ancestors
                                          > David Kilgour
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > "I hope someone can help point me in the right direction. I live in
                                          > Barbados
                                          > and have traced my ancestry back to mid 1700's but cannot locate
                                          > connection
                                          > to UK. I have always heard that we are either Scottish / Irish, possibly
                                          > deported, indentured slaves or emigrants. Can anyone help with the
                                          > surnames
                                          > Lewis and Corbin?
                                          >
                                          > Lynda"
                                          >
                                          > _____
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          >
                                          >


                                          ----- End message from kilgour1@... -----



                                          --------------------------------------------------------------
                                          This message was sent using the Sunbeach Web Messaging Service
                                        • David Kilgour
                                          HI Lynda, sorry I don t have any detailed information that would be helpful to you in this regard. David ... From: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com
                                          Message 20 of 28 , Apr 13, 2007
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                                            HI Lynda, sorry I don't have any detailed information that would be
                                            helpful to you in this regard.
                                            David

                                            -----Original Message-----
                                            From: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com
                                            [mailto:scots-origins@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of petal@...
                                            Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 1:21 PM
                                            To: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com
                                            Subject: RE: [scots-origins] Colvin, Herron, McQueen

                                            Hi David,
                                            Thanks for the lead will follow-up.
                                            Do you know of any records/books that detail the names of those sent
                                            or any other information pertaining to that period?
                                            Our Barbados records are quite good once I have a name/ship etc that I
                                            can work with. The records of births, deaths, wills, marriages are
                                            good ... with the exception of some church records lost at sea by
                                            ships sinking in hurricanes!!
                                            Thanks
                                            Lynda Lewis

                                            .
                                            .

                                            <http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=1085472/grpspId=1705040837/m
                                            sgId=39348/stime=1176472057/nc1=4438971/nc2=3848541/nc3=3>



                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • David Kilgour
                                            Alastair, I have no information in this area. My main interest is in the broader issue of the Clearances, in particular the Selkirk Settlers who came to
                                            Message 21 of 28 , Apr 13, 2007
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              Alastair, I have no information in this area. My main interest is in the
                                              broader issue of the Clearances, in particular the Selkirk Settlers who
                                              came to Winnipeg in 1812.A group of us are building a duplicate of the
                                              Emigrants Monument recently built at Helmsdale. The statuea are being
                                              cast right now in Nairn, and will be shipped to Winnipeg shortly.If
                                              interested see the following ( note the article says statues are 30 feet
                                              tall, in fact they are 10 feet. The earliest proposals were to build
                                              them 30 feet tall but costs were too high)

                                              http://www.sutherland-business.co.uk/article.php?id=149

                                              David

                                              David, one of my Highlands male relatives "disappeared" much
                                              later, after 1812. For his sins he may well have been
                                              deported as a convict so I tried but failed to recognise him
                                              among the very great numbers sent to AUSTL. 1788- 1850s

                                              Do you know whether Barbados was a destination for convicts,
                                              most of whom had rather minor civil crimes?

                                              Alistair



                                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            • IACSCOTT@aol.com
                                              In a message dated 13/04/2007 14:48:55 GMT Standard Time, wightway@tiscali.co.uk writes: There were no formal records of birth marriage and death before 1855
                                              Message 22 of 28 , Apr 13, 2007
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                                                In a message dated 13/04/2007 14:48:55 GMT Standard Time,
                                                wightway@... writes:

                                                There were no formal records of birth marriage and death before 1855 in
                                                Scotland. Prior thereto one has to rely on Old Parish Records that only give the
                                                name of the parties and not their parents etc.


                                                Birth or Baptism entries will normally give the names of the parents
                                                together with the names of the witnesses. In addition, if the parents were married
                                                the child would be described as 'lawful' but if they were not the child would
                                                be described as 'natural'. In some cases you will get both the date of birth
                                                and the baptism.

                                                Where deaths are recorded they are likely to be either a record of the hire
                                                of the mortcloth or the burial in the churchyard and if younare lucky you may
                                                find the place of residence of the deceased and their age. Where the death
                                                was accidental I have found a note to that effect.

                                                Ian A C Scott






                                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                              • Gayle
                                                Michele, thanks for the info about your great uncle Hector Herron, do you happen to have a family tree on ancestry.com or one I could view to see his info and
                                                Message 23 of 28 , Apr 15, 2007
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                                                  Michele, thanks for the info about your great uncle Hector Herron, do you happen to have a family tree on ancestry.com or one I could view to see his info and how it ties is?

                                                  Thanks

                                                  Gayle Colvin Herron


                                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                                  From: MITSFN1@...
                                                  To: scots-origins@yahoogroups.com
                                                  Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2007 10:57 AM
                                                  Subject: Re: [scots-origins] Colvin, Herron, McQueen



                                                  Herron is Scottish. I know because my great Uncle Hector Herron was from
                                                  Scotland.

                                                  Michele

                                                  ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com

                                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                • Janet
                                                  Ian, thanks. I was highlighting the absence of information prior to 1855 in comparison with certificates which, as you say have the names of parents, and
                                                  Message 24 of 28 , Apr 23, 2007
                                                  • 0 Attachment
                                                    Ian, thanks. I was highlighting the absence of information prior to 1855 in comparison with certificates which, as you say have the names of parents, and witnesses.

                                                    As you say, also, I have found a lot in death certificates, where they were born in the late 1700s and died at a ripe old age. One gave him a different father causing me to find another of the same name, with the father I thought was his, and, of course, a different Mother, adding to my tree.

                                                    Janet





                                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                                    From: <IACSCOTT@...>


                                                    >
                                                    > In a message dated 13/04/2007 14:48:55 GMT Standard Time,
                                                    > wightway@... writes:
                                                    >
                                                    > There were no formal records of birth marriage and death before 1855 in
                                                    > Scotland. Prior thereto one has to rely on Old Parish Records that only give the
                                                    > name of the parties and not their parents etc.
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    > Birth or Baptism entries will normally give the names of the parents
                                                    > together with the names of the witnesses. In addition, if the parents were married
                                                    > the child would be described as 'lawful' but if they were not the child would
                                                    > be described as 'natural'. In some cases you will get both the date of birth
                                                    > and the baptism.
                                                    >
                                                    > Where deaths are recorded they are likely to be either a record of the hire
                                                    > of the mortcloth or the burial in the churchyard and if younare lucky you may
                                                    > find the place of residence of the deceased and their age. Where the death
                                                    > was accidental I have found a note to that effect.
                                                    >
                                                    > Ian A C Scott
                                                  • David Sutherland
                                                    David I live in Winnipeg MB. Canada and this is the first I have heard of the statues. Where are they to be located? David
                                                    Message 25 of 28 , Apr 23, 2007
                                                    • 0 Attachment
                                                      David

                                                      I live in Winnipeg MB. Canada and this is the first I have heard of the
                                                      statues. Where are they to be located?

                                                      David

                                                      David Kilgour wrote:
                                                      >
                                                      > Alastair, I have no information in this area. My main interest is in the
                                                      > broader issue of the Clearances, in particular the Selkirk Settlers who
                                                      > came to Winnipeg in 1812.A group of us are building a duplicate of the
                                                      > Emigrants Monument recently built at Helmsdale. The statuea are being
                                                      > cast right now in Nairn, and will be shipped to Winnipeg shortly.If
                                                      > interested see the following ( note the article says statues are 30 feet
                                                      > tall, in fact they are 10 feet. The earliest proposals were to build
                                                      > them 30 feet tall but costs were too high)
                                                      >
                                                      > http://www.sutherland-business.co.uk/article.php?id=149
                                                      > <http://www.sutherland-business.co.uk/article.php?id=149>
                                                      >
                                                      > David
                                                      >
                                                      > David, one of my Highlands male relatives "disappeared" much
                                                      > later, after 1812. For his sins he may well have been
                                                      > deported as a convict so I tried but failed to recognise him
                                                      > among the very great numbers sent to AUSTL. 1788- 1850s
                                                      >
                                                      > Do you know whether Barbados was a destination for convicts,
                                                      > most of whom had rather minor civil crimes?
                                                      >
                                                      > Alistair
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                    • Alistair Cameron
                                                      ... A group of us are building a duplicate of the ... Ahah I now feel at home. We lived some time in Cawdor, regularly shopped and used Library in Nairn. As in
                                                      Message 26 of 28 , Apr 23, 2007
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                                                        David Kilgour wrote:

                                                        > Alastair, I have no information in this area. My main interest is in the
                                                        > broader issue of the Clearances, in particular the Selkirk Settlers who
                                                        > came to Winnipeg in 1812.......................



                                                        A group of us are building a duplicate of the
                                                        > Emigrants Monument recently built at Helmsdale. The statuea are being
                                                        > cast right now in Nairn, and will be shipped to Winnipeg shortly.

                                                        Ahah I now feel at home. We lived some time in Cawdor,
                                                        regularly shopped and used Library in Nairn. As in the movie
                                                        Local Hero we'd wait at the public phone near Cawdor post
                                                        office so as to receive pre-arranged calls from Australia!!

                                                        Alistair
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