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Re: [scots-origins] Re: Presbyterian Convenators on the great plains

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  • Terry Delany
    It must have been very difficult on family unity. All my Scottish and Irish ancestors (Grant, England, Fuller, Street) fought for the British during the
    Message 1 of 37 , Aug 31, 2004
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      It must have been very difficult on family unity. All my Scottish and Irish ancestors (Grant, England, Fuller, Street) fought for the British during the Revolutionary War. John Grant had
      been posted to Boston prior to the war and helped set up a Mason Lodge. I have often wondered if Scots who were friends and family before the war ended up giving each other consideration
      when they ended up fighting on opposite sides? Perhaps they were used to it from the many clan wars but it seems that many of the Americans really resented their neighbors who did not
      support them and confiscated their property, hence why so many ended up in Canada.

      gordon crooks wrote:

      > Peaches Cream: I have a little news for you, while the southern Irish might
      > not have had any bias, the northern ones certain did. Look at info on the
      > Plantation period, the Northern Irish were driven off their land to make
      > room for the English and Scotch settlers in the 1600's All of this was
      > because the English kings were trying to rid Ireland of the Catholic Church
      > and substitute it with Protestants, of course the dear old kings had
      > something else in mind which was money (see doomsday book). So you can look
      > at most of the strife back hundreds of years based on control, religion, and
      > wealth. Who contributed to all of this well the Scots naturally they made up
      > a substantial part of there mercenaries fighting in the various European
      > battles and countries, fighting is what they knew best!Futhermore they never
      > forgot this, every male in my family from age 17 to 60 (7 all told) joined
      > George Washington's Army in the American Revolution.
      >
      > Gordon Crooks
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "Peaches Cream" <soda_farl@...>
      > To: <scots-origins@yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2004 2:26 PM
      > Subject: Re: [scots-origins] Re: Presbyterian Convenators on the great
      > plains
      >
      > > The free staters do not hate the Scots-Irish.
      > >
      > >
      > > James Parkhill <jmparkhill@...> wrote:
      > > Interesting. Because my ancestors were Scottish mercenaries that
      > > King William wanted and helped King William of Orange win the Battle
      > > of the Boyne. So this is very interesting. No wonder the Southern
      > > Irish hate the Scot-Irish.
      > > --- In scots-origins@yahoogroups.com, "gordon crooks"
      > > wrote:
      > > > Jim: Here goes John Knox 1505-1572 who had studied under John
      > > Calvin in
      > > > Switzerland helped establish the Reformation of 1560 in Scotland
      > > and as a
      > > > result the Church of Scotland was founded (Presbyterian), it also
      > > spread to
      > > > England itself. You must remember that during this period 1500-
      > > 1600's there
      > > > was constant upheavels in governance and religious leanings. Example
      > > > Scotland for the most part had Catholic Kings whereas the bulk of
      > > the
      > > > population were protestant. It was all a matter of control, the
      > > State (king)
      > > > wanted to control the churches and appoint bishops. In 1638 a
      > > National
      > > > Convenant was signed by many Scots protesting this. THESE PEOPLE
      > > WERE THE
      > > > CONVENATORS.
      > > > Now here is where it becomes personal my ancestor Rev. William
      > > Crooks was
      > > > deposed (thrown out of office) by King James 11 because he would
      > > not swear
      > > > feailty to the King's Bishop.The Rev. Crooks along with his two
      > > sons were
      > > > defenders of Derry/Londonderry during the siege of 1689-1690, this
      > > was the
      > > > revolution which lead to the over throw of King James 11, the last
      > > Catholic
      > > > King of Scotland. William of Orange lifted the siege in 1690 and
      > > became the
      > > > King.
      > > > You might be interested in knowing that their is a Convenator town
      > > at
      > > > Clarinda, Iowa which still, exists today.
      > > >
      > > > Gordon Crooks
      > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > From: "James Parkhill"
      > > > To:
      > > > Sent: Monday, August 23, 2004 7:16 PM
      > > > Subject: [scots-origins] Re: Presbyterian Convenators on the great
      > > plains
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > > I am another person who is interested in what the Presbyterian
      > > > > Covenantors were? Can anyone explain it to us dumb old scottish
      > > > > descendants? My ancestors were Scottish Presbyterian Covenantors
      > > but
      > > > > I don't know what that is or means?
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > --- In scots-origins@yahoogroups.com, lroth@a... wrote:
      > > > > > Could someone tell me what Presbyterian Convenators were? I'm
      > > > > Looking for a john Williamson and a John Martin both from Scotland
      > > > > who came to Hanover, Va. John Williamson came around the 1750's
      > > or
      > > > > earlier his great nephew John Martin came before 1765. Any
      > > > > information would be helpful. Thanks, Lynn P.s. My new email
      > > > > address is lynnroth@s...
      > > > > >
      > > > > > -------------- Original message from AnneDunne@a...: -----------
      > > ---
      > > > > >
      > > > > > > Gordon,
      > > > > > > Clarinda Scotland is what I put into Google.com You will find
      > > > > pages and
      > > > > > > pages on Clarinda / Scotland.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Regards,
      > > > > > > Anna Wyber Dunne
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
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    • lroth@att.net
      Thanks for the information. Have you come across a Rev.smuel Davies? zi m not sure if he came from Scotland ornot, But he the presbyterian minister in
      Message 37 of 37 , Oct 1, 2004
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        Thanks for the information. Have you come across a Rev.smuel Davies? zi'm not sure if he came from Scotland ornot, But he the presbyterian minister in hanover co. va. and along with John Williamson a founder of the founder of Hanover presbytery in 1755. He also gave to 2 congregations of the presbytery, Ground Squirrel Providence Church in louisaCounty, serviced by Rev. John Todd, and Pork meeting house in Hanover Co. John Williamson was one of the
        elders at Pork Meeting House.

        -------------- Original message from Bruce Humphrey : --------------

        > lroth@... wrote:
        >
        > >Bruce, I really injoyed you explaination of the Presbyterian Conventors. I do
        > have a question for you that relates to a slightly later time. I have several
        > ancestors who came over from Scotland in the early 1700's. They were considered
        > discentor's. Do you know what this was about? I have a john williamson who was
        > in Virigia listed as owning land in 1713, 1714. Hemapparently sent for his
        > nearest relative John Martin Presbyterian minister ans a great- nephew John
        > Martin who came before John Williamson's death in 1767. Thanks, Lynn
        > >
        >
        > It's possible that these were covenantors or cameronians. The
        > covenantors did not accept the restored Stuarts, and Charles II/James
        > VII certainly did not accept the covenant, asserting their position as
        > head of the kirk. The cameronians (followers of Richard Cameron)
        > continued sporadic resistance, certainly until Cameron himself was
        > killed at the "battle" of Aird's Moss in 1680. But the
        > cameronians/covenanters as such were pardoned in 1690 (or about then,
        > not sure of the exact date) and their forces became part of the
        > "regular" army, hence the Cameronian Regiment.
        > Dissenting societies/churches of Cameronians and Covenanters continued
        > to exist (without actual fighting) and certainly conducted their own
        > marriages and baptisms. There exists (but I have no idea where you might
        > find it) a "Register of Rev John McMillan" for such marriages and
        > baptisms in Scotland until at least 1751.
        > It is quite possible that your ancestors were dissenters at that time
        > and emigrated; but not likely that they were transported (for
        > dissenting) or forced into exile. It would more likely be voluntary. The
        > covenanting church still exists both in Scotland and, especially, in
        > U.S. You might be able to track down records over there.
        >
        > B
        >
        >
        >
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