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Re: [SCA Newcomers] Hand Kissing questions

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  • Len Stewart
    One female s opinion: Hand kissing is nice. It makes me feel attractive but in no way am I offended if someone does not do it. Usually I assume that they are
    Message 1 of 11 , Jan 15, 2004
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      One female's opinion:
      Hand kissing is nice. It makes me feel attractive but in no way am I offended if someone does not do it. Usually I assume that they are with someone or have more important things on their mind then flattering a girl and I take no offense to that. So as much as what Justin says is completely correct about still hand kissing when married but knowing the bounds, you need to decide what you and your spouse feel comfortable with. I also think you need not worry too much. Take your spouses opinion into account but as far as we go don't worry too much about if some ladies will get offended because in the end we aren't that important in the scale of your life. The important things are that your spouse doesn't get hurt and you are able to lossen up and have fun at the event.

      Len

      Garrett <garrett241@...> wrote:
      Greetings Mi Lords and Ladies,

      Alright, I know this sounds silly but I have some questions and i
      hope the wisdom of the board can help me.

      When I first started in the SCA 14-15 years ago, I was in college,
      single, ect ect. I loved kissing the hand of a lady I met. When
      ever I was introduced to a lady or introduced myself I would kiss her
      hand if she offered it.

      I fell off of the world for some time and after being gone ten or so
      years I am just now coming back to the SCA. I'm now married and a
      father of three kids. I'm not comfortable with the hand kissing
      thing now. My Lady often does not attend SCA functions with me.

      So, what are the norms or unwriten rules of hand kissing. Is
      it "proper" to just shake hands when meeting a lady for the first
      time? Do ladies expect to have their hand kissed and are surpised
      when a gentleman does not kiss her? Am I getting more worked up
      about this then I need to be? (ok I already knew the answer to that
      one..)

      Thank you one and all
      Eric von Wald





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    • Susan King
      I’m going to go ahead and put in my opinion on hand kissing, mostly because I don’t care for it myself. Having a strange man kissing my hand isn’t
      Message 2 of 11 , Jan 15, 2004
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        I’m going to go ahead and put in my opinion on hand kissing, mostly
        because I don’t care for it myself. Having a strange man kissing my hand
        isn’t something I’m comfortable with. I will always offer my hand to be
        shook, which is perfectly fine. But I have had men grab my hand and then
        kiss it, which is rude. I generally don’t make an issue of it, I just
        put more space between myself and that person rather than be put in that
        position again. My opinion is if the lady doesn’t offer her hand to be
        kissed, don’t assume its ok to do so.
        Lady Alvör


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Katie Pleasance
        I completely agree. Wait for the woman to offer her hand AND watch her reaction. This might take a little practice and a lot of quick judgement, but ... her
        Message 3 of 11 , Jan 15, 2004
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          I completely agree. Wait for the woman to offer her hand AND watch her
          reaction. This might take a little practice and a lot of quick judgement,
          but ... her body language will probably give you an indication of whether a
          kiss on the hand is welcome or a handshake would be more congenial (and
          possibly safer ... There is one creature of the male persuasion with whom I
          will shake hands to be friendly in public but if he *ever* tries to kiss
          even my hand, he will find himself rolling on the ground holding his
          precious private parts.)

          I'm married and way over flirting age. Kiss my hand and you will leave me
          smiling all day (unless you are the guy mentioned above). For me, it has
          nothing to do with marriage or hoped-for seduction. It is a custom, a
          politeness, an appreciation of my femininity -- appropriate in certain
          *limited* circumstances.

          And for gawds sake, keep it saliva-free and quiet -- your lips don't even
          need to touch her hand. It's the CHIVALROUS GESTURE that counts.

          As always, my opinion.

          Katherine de la Pleasance

          Lady Alvör wrote:
          >My opinion is if the lady doesn’t offer her hand to be
          >kissed, don’t assume its ok to do so.
        • Ld. Dylan
          Another alternative to kissing the hand is to touch the back of the proffered hand to your forehead...I have seen this done...and even once, after having
          Message 4 of 11 , Jan 16, 2004
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            Another alternative to kissing the hand is to touch the back of the
            proffered hand to your forehead...I have seen this done...and even
            once, after having kissed the ladies' hand, the lady in question
            returned the gesture by this forehead touch (the back of MY hand to
            her forehead). There have been instances when the lady kissed my hand
            as well...see, it goes both ways. In any case, hand kissing is quite
            proper if done correctly. And I agree that slobbering is a definate
            no-no. BTW, has anyone ever seen a hand-kiss to the PALM of the hand
            rather than the back? Again, I have seen this and interpret it to
            mean that there is more between the two people involved than mear
            friendship. Remarks to this?

            Dylan


            --- In scanewcomers@yahoogroups.com, Katie Pleasance <katie@k...>
            wrote:
            > I completely agree. Wait for the woman to offer her hand AND watch
            her
            > reaction. This might take a little practice and a lot of quick
            judgement,
            > but ... her body language will probably give you an indication of
            whether a
            > kiss on the hand is welcome or a handshake would be more congenial
            (and
            > possibly safer ... There is one creature of the male persuasion
            with whom I
            > will shake hands to be friendly in public but if he *ever* tries to
            kiss
            > even my hand, he will find himself rolling on the ground holding
            his
            > precious private parts.)
            >
            > I'm married and way over flirting age. Kiss my hand and you will
            leave me
            > smiling all day (unless you are the guy mentioned above). For me,
            it has
            > nothing to do with marriage or hoped-for seduction. It is a custom,
            a
            > politeness, an appreciation of my femininity -- appropriate in
            certain
            > *limited* circumstances.
            >
            > And for gawds sake, keep it saliva-free and quiet -- your lips
            don't even
            > need to touch her hand. It's the CHIVALROUS GESTURE that counts.
            >
            > As always, my opinion.
            >
            > Katherine de la Pleasance
            >
            > Lady Alvör wrote:
            > >My opinion is if the lady doesn't offer her hand to be
            > >kissed, don't assume its ok to do so.
          • bridgetthestargazer
            I have to say that I agree with the replies thus far. I remember having a discussion about this a number of years ago with friends in Atenveldt. There are
            Message 5 of 11 , Jan 16, 2004
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              I have to say that I agree with the replies thus far. I remember
              having a discussion about this a number of years ago with friends in
              Atenveldt. There are several factors in how a lady's hand is treated
              when offered to a gentleman. One of the most important ones is for
              both parties to be paying attention (which you should be doing anyway
              if being introduced or greeting someone). There have been a few
              gentelmen to whom I have been introduced that when I offered my hand
              I let them raise it only so far. A little pressure downward as the
              hand is being accepted should be enough to let the gentleman know
              that the preference is for him to kiss the air above the hand or
              simply bow over it.

              Depending on the situation, you can always bow over the lady's hand.
              After all, you never know when you might be coming down with a cold.

              This is one custom that can make both the lady and gentleman involved
              feel more like a lady and a gentelman than the mundane world
              sometimes allows IF they are both attentive to and respectful of each
              other's boundaries. I am fortunate enough to have never had my hand
              slobbered on. The genetlemen I have met have all been courteous.

              As others have mentioned, establish your own boundaries based on your
              comfort level and that of your wife. Those are the most important
              factors.

              Hope this rambling made some sense,
              Bridget the Stargazer
            • chemistbb3
              Don t do much hand kissing myself, unless it is someone I am involved with, and that included non-SCA Ladies also. Both sides of the hand are fair game in
              Message 6 of 11 , Jan 19, 2004
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                Don't do much hand kissing myself, unless it is someone I am involved
                with, and that included non-SCA Ladies also. Both sides of the hand
                are fair game in that case. *grin* I have kissed a hand when it was
                requested for a photo op at an event for a couple of Ladies who were
                newcomers and checking things out. Normally, instead of kissing a
                hand, I will grasp the Lady's hand as I would to kiss it, cover it
                with my other hand, bring it to my chest height and eloquently tell
                her how my day is now much brighter by getting to meet her.

                William

                --- In scanewcomers@yahoogroups.com, "Ld. Dylan"
                <lddylanmacleod@y...> wrote:
                > Another alternative to kissing the hand is to touch the back of the
                > proffered hand to your forehead...I have seen this done...and even
                > once, after having kissed the ladies' hand, the lady in question
                > returned the gesture by this forehead touch (the back of MY hand to
                > her forehead). There have been instances when the lady kissed my
                hand
                > as well...see, it goes both ways. In any case, hand kissing is
                quite
                > proper if done correctly. And I agree that slobbering is a definate
                > no-no. BTW, has anyone ever seen a hand-kiss to the PALM of the
                hand
                > rather than the back? Again, I have seen this and interpret it to
                > mean that there is more between the two people involved than mear
                > friendship. Remarks to this?
                >
                > Dylan
                >
              • SCARayne@aol.com
                William, You have a most wonderful solution!! And I would be very pleased to have someone greet me this manner. I do not like hand-kissing and my husband
                Message 7 of 11 , Jan 20, 2004
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                  William,

                  You have a most wonderful solution!! And I would be very pleased
                  to have someone "greet" me this manner.

                  I do not like hand-kissing and my husband does not like hand-kissing.
                  If it is, but a quick brush on the top of the hand it will "slide",
                  but any long lingering action with get you confronted by an irate
                  "Mi'lord, I think you have introduced yourself quite long enough!".

                  Rayne
                  Meridies

                  Normally, instead of kissing a
                  > hand, I will grasp the Lady's hand as I would to kiss it, cover it
                  > with my other hand, bring it to my chest height and eloquently tell
                  > her how my day is now much brighter by getting to meet her.
                  >
                  > William
                  >
                • chemistbb3
                  ... kissing. ... it ... tell
                  Message 8 of 11 , Jan 20, 2004
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                    --- In scanewcomers@yahoogroups.com, SCARayne@a... wrote:
                    > William,
                    >
                    > You have a most wonderful solution!! And I would be very pleased
                    > to have someone "greet" me this manner.
                    >
                    > I do not like hand-kissing and my husband does not like hand-
                    kissing.
                    > If it is, but a quick brush on the top of the hand it will "slide",
                    > but any long lingering action with get you confronted by an irate
                    > "Mi'lord, I think you have introduced yourself quite long enough!".
                    >
                    > Rayne
                    > Meridies
                    >
                    > Normally, instead of kissing a
                    > > hand, I will grasp the Lady's hand as I would to kiss it, cover
                    it
                    > > with my other hand, bring it to my chest height and eloquently
                    tell
                    > > her how my day is now much brighter by getting to meet her.
                    > >
                    > > William
                    > >
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