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simple feminine garb (was: New again to the SCA)

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  • Coblaith Muimnech
    ... Undertunic, overtunic, belt, veil sounds good to me. If the tunics are very long and bloused over the belt, you ll have look reminiscent of the
    Message 1 of 9 , Dec 1, 2009
      Maryelizabeth wrote:
      > We are interested in Pennsic and I would like to have simple
      > clothes for it. Would it be proper for a female to have an
      > undertunic, over tunic and a tie-belt, and wear the veil on the
      > virtue site?

      Undertunic, overtunic, belt, veil sounds good to me. If the tunics
      are very long and bloused over the belt, you'll have look reminiscent
      of the 13th-century Maciejowski Bible <http://www.medievaltymes.com/
      courtyard/images/maciejowski/leaf4/otm4rb.gif> <http://
      www.medievaltymes.com/courtyard/images/maciejowski/leaf4/
      otm4vb.gif>. If they just reach the ground and aren't bloused, it'll
      be more like something from the 14th-century manuscript shelfmarked
      Bodleian 264 <http://image.ox.ac.uk/images/bodleian/ms.bodl.
      264/49r.jpg> <http://image.ox.ac.uk/images/bodleian/ms.bodl.
      264/52r.jpg>.

      I'm not sure what you mean by "tie-belt", though.

      > One other question - if it is very hot, can you do without the
      > undertunic?

      I suppose you could. But I wouldn't recommend it. Imagine what's
      going to happen if you're wearing only one layer of fabric and you
      start to sweat heavily. (T-shirts aren't the only things that cling
      when wet.)

      If you're expecting to be overly hot, the best thing to do is leave
      off the belt. There are a lot of women pictured without them in
      period manuscripts, including the aforementioned Bodl. 264 <http://
      image.ox.ac.uk/images/bodleian/ms.bodl.264/21v.jpg>. If the tunics
      aren't too fitted and they don't drag the ground, breezes will be
      able to get under your skirts and run up your body all the way to the
      shoulder. It makes a *lot* of difference, as I can attest from
      personal experiences under the Texas sun.

      If you're wearing a belt so you'll have somewhere to hang a pouch,
      don't bother. You can just carry your stuff in a shoulder-bag
      <http://coblaith.net/Bags/TrapezoidalBag/default.html> or a basket.


      Coblaith Muimnech
      Barony of Bryn Gwlad
      Kingdom of Ansteorra
      <mailto:Coblaith@...>
      <http://coblaith.net>
    • Judith Epstein
      ... Absolutely correct. Maryelizabeth, there s a reason that the most body-covering, modest clothing styles originated in the hotter areas of the world. Loose,
      Message 2 of 9 , Dec 1, 2009
        On 1 Dec 2009, at 3:55 PM, Coblaith Muimnech wrote:

        > Maryelizabeth wrote:
        >> One other question - if it is very hot, can you do without the undertunic?
        >
        > I suppose you could. But I wouldn't recommend it. Imagine what's going to happen if you're wearing only one layer of fabric and you
        > start to sweat heavily. (T-shirts aren't the only things that cling when wet.)
        >
        > If you're expecting to be overly hot, the best thing to do is leave off the belt. There are a lot of women pictured without them in
        > period manuscripts, including the aforementioned Bodl. 264 <http://image.ox.ac.uk/images/bodleian/ms.bodl.264/21v.jpg>. If the tunics aren't too fitted and they don't drag the ground, breezes will be able to get under your skirts and run up your body all the way to the shoulder. It makes a *lot* of difference, as I can attest from personal experiences under the Texas sun.

        Absolutely correct. Maryelizabeth, there's a reason that the most body-covering, modest clothing styles originated in the hotter areas of the world. Loose, flowing clothing allows breezes, while covering up the skin so that one doesn't dehydrate or sunburn. If you expect to spend the majority of your SCA time in hotter places, I highly recommend an Indian or North African persona.

        -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
        D'vorah, mka Judith Epstein
        Master Albrecht Waldfurster's Egg
        Middle Kingdom, Midlands, Ayreton, Tree-Girt-Sea (Chicago, IL)
        judith@...
        -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
      • bronwynmgn@aol.com
        Absolutely. In fact, that pretty much describes my 12th century garb, and it s actually pretty darned authentic. A long-sleeved white linen undertunic; a
        Message 3 of 9 , Dec 1, 2009
          Absolutely.

          In fact, that pretty much describes my 12th century garb, and it's actually pretty darned authentic. A long-sleeved white linen undertunic; a colored long-sleeved overtunic, either wool if it's cool or linen if it's hot, and a linen veil held on by any of a number of methods. If very hot, drop the undertunic and wear a colored linen long-sleeved tunic and the veil. I've found that I do best with veils that do NOT wrap under my chin when it's really hot.

          You may find that you also want some braies (basically, underpants, but they look like drawstring shorts for the most part) to prevent chafing of the thighs when it is hot. Or, make do with a modern equivalent such as bike shorts - nobody can see them under your gowns anyway.


          Brangwayna Morgan
          Shire of Silver Rylle, East Kingdom
          Lancaster, PA


          -----Original Message-----
          From: peterbenma <peterbenma@...>
          To: scanewcomers@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Mon, Nov 30, 2009 9:55 pm
          Subject: [SCA Newcomers] New again to the SCA




          Our family is coming back to the SCA after a few years and I thinnk I have forgotten everything!

          My sons and I were members when they were little, but once remarried, that dropped off due to location and the husband being totally disinterested. Lucky for us, he is now very interested and the boys are much older.

          I am working on basic garb for us (t-tunics and trousers for the guys, a simple Ren for me) and have a garb question.

          We are interested in Pennsic and I would like to have simple clothes for it. Would it be proper for a female to have an undertunic, over tunic and a tie-belt, and wear the veil on the virtue site?

          One other question - if it is very hot, can you do without the undertunic?

          My stepdaughter is interested in the SCA as well and would like to have simple and easy garb, as well.

          Thank you so much for your help.

          Maryelizabeth







          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Finnseach de Locheil/Judith Winner
          bronwynmgn@aol.com wrote: [...] to prevent chafing of the thighs when it is hot. Or, make do with a modern equivalent such as bike shorts - nobody can see
          Message 4 of 9 , Dec 2, 2009
            bronwynmgn@... wrote:
            [...] to prevent chafing of the thighs when it is hot. Or, make do with a
            modern equivalent such as bike shorts - nobody can see them under your gowns anyway.

            The only issue with wearing bike/cycling shorts under your gowns is that most of
            them are made with lots of lycra (think spandex) which can actually contribute
            to your overheating.

            I would recommend the linen undergarments myself. It's what I'm switching to. :)

            Finnseach
            Dernehealde, Midrealm

            --
            "I'm buying this fleece/fiber now in case I have an emergency... you know,
            sickness, flood, injury, mosquito infestations, not enough chocolate in the
            house, it's Tuesday, I need it for my research project..." ;)
          • Stefan li Rous
            Maryelizabeth said: In some ways returning to the SCA
            Message 5 of 9 , Dec 2, 2009
              Maryelizabeth said:

              <<< Our family is coming back to the SCA after a few years and I
              thinnk I have forgotten everything! >>>

              In some ways returning to the SCA is like moving to a new area of the
              Known World.

              Here are some good files to read in the NEWCOMERS section of the
              Florilegium:
              Othr-Newcomrs-art (16K) 2/23/03 "The 'Other' Newcomers" by Lady
              Wilhelmina
              Catharin de Rochelle. For SCA folks moving from one group to another.
              http://www.florilegium.org/files/NEWCOMERS/Othr-Newcomrs-art.html
              SCA-trans-msg (18K) 1/ 4/96 How to handle the move from one
              group to another. For the people in the group too.
              http://www.florilegium.org/files/NEWCOMERS/SCA-trans-msg.html

              While you are there, read through some of the other files in that
              section. Some stuff may be new to you. Others may just be good
              reminders.

              If you've not been to the Florilegium before, the address is below in
              my signature line.

              <<< My sons and I were members when they were little, but once
              remarried, that dropped off due to location and the husband being
              totally disinterested. Lucky for us, he is now very interested and
              the boys are much older. >>>

              You don't mention how old your sons are now. There is also a CHILDREN
              section in the Florilegium which might be of use.

              <<< I am working on basic garb for us (t-tunics and trousers for the
              guys, a simple Ren for me) and have a garb question.

              We are interested in Pennsic and I would like to have simple clothes
              for it. Would it be proper for a female to have an undertunic, over
              tunic and a tie-belt, and wear the veil on the virtue site? >>>

              Unless you are just dropping in for a day or two, you are going to
              want more clothes for that event than one set. Plus the weather at
              Pennsic can range from hot and sunny to cold and rainy and often both.
              You do have time to accumilate some clothing before then since that is
              over half a year off. After you get this first set of clothes done,
              you might want to concentrate on some cloaks for everyone, which will
              help with both cold and wet weather. There is some information on
              cloaks in the CLOTHING section of the Florilegium.

              You'll want to start collecting some feastgear for both regular events
              and Pennsic. To start off with, some plates and cups and perhaps some
              eating utensils that don't look overly modern (avoid brightly colored
              plastics) will work.

              feastgear-msg (44K) 3/24/08 Obtaining feastgear for use in the
              SCA.
              cleaning wooden feastgear.
              http://www.florilegium.org/files/FEASTS/feastgear-msg.html

              For Pennsic info you might find some of the files in the PENNSIC
              section of the Florilegium might be of use such as:
              New-2-Pennsic-msg (44K) 6/23/04 Information for those new to Pennsic.
              http://www.florilegium.org/files/PENNSIC/New-2-Pennsic-msg.html
              Pennsic-Prep-art (12K) 8/22/02 "A Newcomer's Guide for Pre-Pennsic
              Prep" by Lady Meliora Leuedai de Ardescote.
              http://www.florilegium.org/files/PENNSIC/Pennsic-Prep-art.html

              I hope this helps you get started again.

              Stefan
              --------
              THLord Stefan li Rous Barony of Bryn Gwlad Kingdom of Ansteorra
              Mark S. Harris Austin, Texas StefanliRous@...
              **** See Stefan's Florilegium files at: http://www.florilegium.org ****
            • Maryelizabeth Hancock
              I was thinking of linen or cotton bloomer-type shorts - not as baggy as the ones from later time periods, but that is the best term I could think of.  I
              Message 6 of 9 , Dec 2, 2009
                I was thinking of linen or cotton bloomer-type shorts - not as baggy as the ones from later time periods, but that is the best "term" I could think of.  I think the biker shorts would be a bit too tight, making you sweat worse in certain areas.  I was thinking that the bloomer/shorts idea would be a great use of extra pieces of fabric that are left over from other projects.  Am I right or would the bloomer/loose shorts still cause chafing?


                Maryelizabeth Hancock

                 

                --- On Wed, 12/2/09, Finnseach de Locheil/Judith Winner <fionnseachdelochielle@...> wrote:


                From: Finnseach de Locheil/Judith Winner <fionnseachdelochielle@...>
                Subject: Re: [SCA Newcomers] New again to the SCA
                To: scanewcomers@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Wednesday, December 2, 2009, 9:23 AM


                 



                bronwynmgn@aol. com wrote:
                [...] to prevent chafing of the thighs when it is hot. Or, make do with a
                modern equivalent such as bike shorts - nobody can see them under your gowns anyway.

                The only issue with wearing bike/cycling shorts under your gowns is that most of
                them are made with lots of lycra (think spandex) which can actually contribute
                to your overheating.

                I would recommend the linen undergarments myself. It's what I'm switching to. :)

                Finnseach
                Dernehealde, Midrealm

                --
                "I'm buying this fleece/fiber now in case I have an emergency... you know,
                sickness, flood, injury, mosquito infestations, not enough chocolate in the
                house, it's Tuesday, I need it for my research project..." ;)










                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • bronwynmgn@aol.com
                To: scanewcomers@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, Dec 2, 2009 8:08 pm Subject: Re:
                Message 7 of 9 , Dec 5, 2009
                  <<-----Original Message-----
                  From: Maryelizabeth Hancock <peterbenma@...>
                  To: scanewcomers@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Wed, Dec 2, 2009 8:08 pm
                  Subject: Re: [SCA Newcomers] New again to the SCA




                  I was thinking of linen or cotton bloomer-type shorts - not as baggy as the ones from later time periods, but that is the best "term" I could think of. I think the biker shorts would be a bit too tight, making you sweat worse in certain areas. I was thinking that the bloomer/shorts idea would be a great use of extra pieces of fabric that are left over from other projects. Am I right or would the bloomer/loose shorts still cause chafing?

                  Maryelizabeth Hancock
                  >>


                  No, the loose linen or cotton (I even have a few old polycotton pairs) bloomer/shorts thing works fine; that's what I use. Just make sure the legs are long enough to cover the areas of your thighs that rub. Some of mine tend to ride up a bit, causing me to do a periodic shimmy to make them drop down again. The only reason I even suggested the bike shorts is because I know people who use them and say they work.

                  Brangwayna Morgan
                  Shire of Silver Rylle, East KIngdom
                  Lancaster PA







                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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