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Re: [SCA Newcomers] Dark skin dye?

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  • Tonya
    You might want to try Jan Tana tanning products. Its what bodybuilders use to get a deep dark tan for competions. I ve heard it stains the skin and takes days
    Message 1 of 19 , Jul 9, 2009
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      You might want to try Jan Tana tanning products. Its what bodybuilders use to get a deep dark tan for competions. I've heard it stains the skin and takes days to come off completely but will bleed off some on clothes but might work to get u through a weekend event. There website is www.jantana.com

      Maerwynn
      Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel

      -----Original Message-----
      From: Judith Epstein <judith@...>

      Date: Thu, 9 Jul 2009 10:52:10
      To: <scanewcomers@yahoogroups.com>; <sca-middle@...>; <SCA-Tree-Girt-Sea@yahoogroups.com>
      Subject: [SCA Newcomers] Dark skin dye?


      I'm pasty-pale, and I want my persona to be quite dark. I know it's
      okay to be pale even when one has a pale persona, but I LIKE darker
      skin, and would love to have it, even if for only a few days out of
      the year. I'm very pale, freckled, red-haired (or, ahem, I was a
      redhead before it all started turning darker and then white), and I'm
      going for... well, as dark as I can get, anything from deep black like
      a Nubian to a cinnamon brown like an Indian or dark Arab. I can't be
      the only person who's tried this, but I hope someone out there has
      been more successful than I have! Here's what I've tried without
      success, and why it doesn't work for me:

      1. Henna. Turns me orange, not brown.

      2. Make-up/cosmetics. Washes right off, especially my hands, which I
      wash often for hygiene. Also, it smears onto my clothes.

      3. Walnut hull. It goes on dark, changes my hair color and any cloth
      it touches, but then washes right off my skin as if it were never
      there. Sad, because this was my best bet so far.

      4. The solution from "Black Like Me," tanning pills plus an injection
      of a certain chemical. I've spoken to my doctor about this. It works
      by damaging the skin cells and making them extremely sun-sensitive,
      which I don't need; it puts a person at a higher risk of skin cancer,
      which I also don't need because it already runs in my family; and it's
      expensive.

      5. Tanning pills. Either they don't work, or they turn the skin orange
      like henna.

      6. Self-tanning lotions. I've only tried a handful of these, but so
      far, they've all turned me orange instead of brown.

      Any thoughts? Ideally I'd only have to apply it once (or daily over a
      period of a few days) in order for it to last at least the duration of
      a weekend-long event, complete with showering and lots of hand
      washing. Even better if it would last for the duration of, say,
      Pennsic (I can't go this year, but I'm hoping for next year).

      -- Judith / Divash




      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Coblaith Muimnech
      ... I m going to assume you meant The Society for Creative Anachronism , since that s the organization with this Yahoo! Group is associated. I wouldn t
      Message 2 of 19 , Jul 16, 2009
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        PMC wrote:
        > I have noticed that in The Society For Professional Anachronism at
        > least as far as the United States of America is concerned seems to
        > primarily appeal to people of the white or paler
        > complexion.. . .Would my friends of darker complexion feel welcome
        > in your groups?

        I'm going to assume you meant "The Society for Creative Anachronism",
        since that's the organization with this Yahoo! Group is associated.

        I wouldn't hesitate to take a friend of any phenotype to an S.C.A.
        event or meeting. I'm sure there are bigoted apples in the barrel
        and that the degree to which color is an issue varies from branch to
        branch in the Society as it does from town to town within the rest of
        the U.S. population, but I think it likely that the S.C.A., as a
        whole, is a little more "colorblind" than American society, as a
        whole. Generally speaking, we tend to attract more folks who stand
        closer to the live-and-let-live end of the spectrum than to the
        different-from-me-is-wrong end.

        My barony is based in Austin, Texas. We have only a handful of
        members who aren't white (based on their appearance--I haven't done
        any polls to determine self-perceived identities), but most of the
        people who come looking for us or who happen across one of our
        meetings are also white. I think the proportions are probably about
        the same. I know that our officers, guild leaders, and event
        planners approach and respond to prospective and current members the
        same way regardless of their apparent ethnicities, and that all the
        people with whom I've spent much time at meetings and events do
        likewise. If there is anyone in the branch who doesn't, they keep it
        subtle and out of public view (like most modern racists in most
        settings), and are doubtless aware that the majority response to any
        overt racism would be strongly negative. I suspect that is true of
        most, if not all, S.C.A. branches.

        Apparent ethnicity is certainly not a barrier to participation in any
        area of Society life. Gentles of varied backgrounds hold high
        offices, are inducted into prestigious orders, and adopt personae
        from whichever cultures interest them. (Our most active "Persian",
        locally, has red hair and freckles, and the "Welsh" lady who used to
        be principal of our dance guild has epicanthic folds.) And there
        aren't any color-based glass ceilings. The crown prince and princess
        present when I received my Award of Arms were African American
        <http://historian.ansteorra.org/wiki/index.php?title=54th_Crown>, for
        example, and the peerages are (from what I've seen) about as
        ethnically diverse as the rest of the Society.


        Coblaith Muimnech
        Barony of Bryn Gwlad
        Kingdom of Ansteorra
        <mailto:Coblaith@...>
        <http://coblaith.net>
      • Stefan li Rous
        Callahan Patrick callahanpatrick@yahoo.co.uk naspiritwalker@prodigy.net asked:
        Message 3 of 19 , Jul 16, 2009
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          "Callahan Patrick" callahanpatrick@... naspiritwalker@...
          asked:

          <<< I have noticed that in The Society For Professional Anachronism at
          least as far as the United States of America is concerned seems to
          primarily appeal to people of the white or paler complexion. I
          understand that this could be interpreted as a natural out growth of
          The Society For Professional Anachronism's mission to study and learn
          about certain aspects of European History, however if it would be
          possible I would be very interested in knowing to what extent if any
          other races participate in your games of skill and more generally in
          the context of your events. Do you believe that people of these other
          races generally treated well and excepted in The Society For
          Professional Anachronism. Would my friends of darker complexion feel
          welcome in your groups? Does anyone have information on this? >>>

          In some ways this sounds like a troll trying to stir up confrontation,
          which I've seen through the years on the Rialto (rec.org.sca).
          However, I will assume you are not doing this and will try to answer
          your questions.

          Likely, the SCA appeals mostly to those of white, European and Middle
          Eastern descent because those are the areas that the SCA concentrates
          on. However, skin color means little in the Society. I've seen plenty
          of red-haired blue-eyed Japanese personas and blond Italians. Frankly,
          most of the people in the SCA tend to be on the more liberal side,
          especially with freedom of action and personal choice. Skin color
          makes little difference and it is also very tolerant of non-mainstream
          religions.

          As an example, one of the most popular kings we've had in Ansteorra
          was Mahti, who happens to be a fairly dark-skinned black man. While it
          is possible to win the kingship on brute strength alone, it tends to
          require more and it definitely requires more to be known as a good
          monarch and a chivalrous fighter who people are happy to see win.

          I am in the same barony as Coblaith, but lest you think we are too
          small a sample size, there are these files in the SCA-SOCIOLOGY
          section of the Florilegium. They give a cross-section of viewpoints
          from other regions across the Known World.

          SCA-gays-msg (16K) 9/17/98 Acceptance of Gays and Lesbians in
          the SCA.
          http://www.florilegium.org/files/SCA-SOCIOLOGY/SCA-gays-msg.html

          SCA-minorites-msg (7K) 10/31/00 Attitudes in the SCA toward
          minorities.
          http://www.florilegium.org/files/SCA-SOCIOLOGY/SCA-minorties-msg.html

          Stefan
          --------
          THLord Stefan li Rous Barony of Bryn Gwlad Kingdom of Ansteorra
          Mark S. Harris Austin, Texas StefanliRous@...
          **** See Stefan's Florilegium files at: http://www.florilegium.org ****
        • bronwynmgn@aol.com
          In a message dated 7/15/2009 11:33:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, callahanpatrick@yahoo.co.uk writes:
          Message 4 of 19 , Jul 16, 2009
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            In a message dated 7/15/2009 11:33:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
            callahanpatrick@... writes:

            <<I have noticed that in The Society For Professional Anachronism at least
            as far as the United States of America is concerned seems to primarily
            appeal to people of the white or paler complexion. I understand that this could
            be interpreted as a natural out growth of The Society For Professional
            Anachronism's mission to study and learn about certain aspects of European
            History, however if it would be possible I would be very interested in knowing
            to what extent if any other races participate in your games of skill and
            more generally in the context of your events. Do you believe that people of
            these other races generally treated well and excepted in The Society For
            Professional Anachronism. Would my friends of darker complexion feel welcome
            in your groups? Does anyone have information on this?>>

            From what I've seen in 20 years, I don't think it makes much difference to
            most people in the SCA what anybody looks like. My local group is, yes,
            primarily Caucasian and has been for 20 years, although we have had several
            Hispanic members including one currently. Certainly none of us could care
            less what a person's ethnicity is.
            In thinking back over people I've met in 20 years, I can think of a number
            of black and Asian members that I've seen, and oddly enough, most of the
            ones I think of hold high rank in the SCA. Duchess Isabella of York, not
            only a royal peer but also a Laurel (for Elizabethan costuming) is a black
            woman married to a white man. Sir Diablu, commonly referred to as "The Black
            Knight of the East". Mistress Dorigen, a Laurel. Another lady whose name
            I am not sure of, who is a Pelican. Count Jafar of the Midrealm, may he
            rest in peace. There are more beyond that. (Laurels are recognized
            Society-wide for their skill in the arts, Pelicans for their service, and Knight
            for prowess in heavy weapons combat. Duchess and Count and similar titles
            denote those who have served as King and Queen.)

            For what it's worth, there's little if any prejudice towards anyone with a
            handicap, either. I've known a number of people with physical disabilities
            who have participated fully in the SCA, including a knight who is an
            amputee (and he joined the SCA after he lost the leg and was knighted for
            fighting prowess, fighting on one leg and a crutch), people with hearing or
            vision loss, and people with a variety of neurologic disabilities such as
            cerebral palsy and spina bifida.

            Brangwayna Morgan
            Shire of Silver Rylle, East Kingdom
            Lancaster PA

            **************S T R E T C H your technology dollars with great laptop
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            D5)
          • Justinos Tekton called Justin
            ... That s unfortunate, and I urge you to reconsider. Percentage-wise, there are many more Laurels who are helpful and courteous. Many people who earn that
            Message 5 of 19 , Jul 16, 2009
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              On Thu, 2009-07-16 at 07:15 +0000, Ziddinaaitzumar@... wrote:
              > I suspect that, as with any organization spread out around the world,
              > there will be pockets of bigotry and prejudice. Personally, I've been
              > prejudiced against LAURELS - of any and all colors - thanks to the
              > behavior of that one woman...


              That's unfortunate, and I urge you to reconsider. Percentage-wise, there
              are many more Laurels who are helpful and courteous. Many people who
              earn that title did so largely because of their enthusiasm for teaching
              others, and they give freely hundreds or even thousands of hours of
              their time to help others learn.

              I, too, have encountered "bad peers" of all three Orders (Laurel,
              Pelican, and Knight). But I have encountered a lot more good ones than
              bad.

              In my experience, the SCA is full of 98% wonderful people, and 2% jerks.
              With 30,000 members, that means there are 600 jerks. A few of them
              happen to have peerages or crowns. Ignore or avoid the 2%, and have fun
              with the other 98%. :-)

              Kind regards,

              Justin

              --
              ()xxxx[]::::::::::::::::::> <::::::::::::::::::[]xxxx()
              Maistor Justinos Tekton called Justin (Scott Courtney)
              Gules, on a bezant a fleam sable and on a chief dovetailed Or two keys
              fesswise reversed sable.

              justin@... http://4th.com/sca/justin/
            • Justinos Tekton called Justin
              ... Sir Diablu is a truly wonderful human being! I have known him for years. He was also married to a white woman, Dame Anna Herold von Ossenheim, who
              Message 6 of 19 , Jul 16, 2009
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                On Thu, 2009-07-16 at 07:48 -0400, bronwynmgn@... wrote:
                > Duchess Isabella of York, not
                > only a royal peer but also a Laurel (for Elizabethan costuming) is a
                > black woman married to a white man. Sir Diablu, commonly referred to
                > as "The Black Knight of the East".


                Sir Diablu is a truly wonderful human being! I have known him for years.
                He was also married to a white woman, Dame Anna Herold von Ossenheim,
                who regrettably passed away a couple of years ago. She was a dear
                friend, and a colleague in the Chirurgeonate.

                Justin

                --
                ()xxxx[]::::::::::::::::::> <::::::::::::::::::[]xxxx()
                Maistor Justinos Tekton called Justin (Scott Courtney)
                Gules, on a bezant a fleam sable and on a chief dovetailed Or two keys
                fesswise reversed sable.

                justin@... http://4th.com/sca/justin/
              • Ziddinaaitzumar@comcast.net
                Alas, it was losing my little tykes to such vicious cruelty - I TRUSTED those people with something very precious to me, they were LIVING THINGS that should
                Message 7 of 19 , Jul 16, 2009
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                  Alas, it was losing my little 'tykes' to such vicious cruelty - I TRUSTED those people with something very precious to me, they were LIVING THINGS that should not have been so cruelly allowed to die of thirst and starvation...



                  That hurt way more than the behavior of that laurel...  (tho, her laurel buddies tended to use only a very few books to declare what THEY thought 'period' should be.  That was another 'turn-off'.)



                  I also adopted a stray cat - rescued it - at the urging of another SCA woman in this area - even tho I'd just rescued one from my own street and found a home for it - at my own expense.



                  When I got that poor little black cat, she was almost dead of starvation.  It didn't dawn on me at the time, but why wasn't that SCA woman who TOLD me about the cat, FEEDING it, even if she couldn't ADOPT it because of the apartment complex rules???  Instead she dumped the whole thing in my lap - and I live 15 miles away from her apartment complex!



                  Sorry.  Too much whining.  But that sort of behavior towards something helpless and innocent - just boggles my mind....



                  Oversharing??  Ziddina


                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "Justinos Tekton called Justin" <justin@...>
                  To: scanewcomers@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 7:04:27 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain
                  Subject: Re: [SCA Newcomers] Dark skin dye?

                   




                  On Thu, 2009-07-16 at 07:15 +0000, Ziddinaaitzumar@... wrote:
                  > I suspect that, as with any organization spread out around the world,
                  > there will be pockets of bigotry and prejudice. Personally, I've been
                  > prejudiced against LAURELS - of any and all colors - thanks to the
                  > behavior of that one woman...

                  That's unfortunate, and I urge you to reconsider. Percentage-wise, there
                  are many more Laurels who are helpful and courteous. Many people who
                  earn that title did so largely because of their enthusiasm for teaching
                  others, and they give freely hundreds or even thousands of hours of
                  their time to help others learn.

                  I, too, have encountered "bad peers" of all three Orders (Laurel,
                  Pelican, and Knight). But I have encountered a lot more good ones than
                  bad.

                  In my experience, the SCA is full of 98% wonderful people, and 2% jerks.
                  With 30,000 members, that means there are 600 jerks. A few of them
                  happen to have peerages or crowns. Ignore or avoid the 2%, and have fun
                  with the other 98%. :-)

                  Kind regards,

                  Justin

                  --
                  ()xxxx[]::::::::::::::::::> <::::::::::::::::::[]xxxx()
                  Maistor Justinos Tekton called Justin (Scott Courtney)
                  Gules, on a bezant a fleam sable and on a chief dovetailed Or two keys
                  fesswise reversed sable.

                  justin@... http://4th.com/sca/justin/




                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Shere'e
                  As an apartment manager I can tell you a POSSIBLE reason. In our house rules (and many others) it clearly states that feeding strays or birds is considered
                  Message 8 of 19 , Jul 16, 2009
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                    As an apartment manager I can tell you a POSSIBLE reason. In our house
                    rules (and many others) it clearly states that feeding strays or birds is
                    considered "keeping a pet without permission" and is a major lease
                    violation.

                    It may seem cruel but here is a very good reason for this. Folks will feed
                    strays which in turn attracts more strays and urban wildlife (skunks,
                    possums, rats, mice, ect). Next thing you know you have a huge problem with
                    them and all it takes is for one little kid to try petting the feral kitty,
                    get bit and mom sues the apartment for allowing feral animals to congrigate
                    on the property. In the meantime, Junior has to go in for a very painful set
                    of Rabies shots because he THINKS it was a tabby kitty, No wait, it was a
                    black kitty, no it was a white kitty. Maybe it was a skunk?

                    In case you think I am anti-animal I am not, we have 5 cats, all of which
                    are rescues. Nor is my complex. Animals are more than welcome. I think about
                    40% of my tenants have animals of some sort and our rules are set up to
                    encourage people to have a pet. We will even allow payments on the pet
                    deposit as low as $10 a month and do not charge a "pet rent" which some
                    places do.



                    I agree with Justin that just because someone has an award does not mean
                    that they are a perfect person. Look at the BOD meeting minutes. You will
                    see that some of the people who are banished have titles and awards. You are
                    dealing with PEOPLE and they are as good and as bad as any other group.

                    Lady Miranda

                    www.webeweddings.com
                    Unique Weddings for Unique Couples


                    (SNIPPING FOR LENGTH)

                    On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 8:36 AM, <Ziddinaaitzumar@...> wrote:

                    >
                    >
                    > When I got that poor little black cat, she was almost dead of starvation.
                    > It didn't dawn on me at the time, but why wasn't that SCA woman who TOLD me
                    > about the cat, FEEDING it, even if she couldn't ADOPT it because of the
                    > apartment complex rules??? Instead she dumped the whole thing in my lap -
                    > and I live 15 miles away from her apartment complex!
                    > Oversharing?? Ziddina
                    >
                    >


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Ziddinaaitzumar@comcast.net
                    Not to keep going on this subject, cause it is so painful and probably brings up painful memories for other people, but - the woman had a pet dog in her
                    Message 9 of 19 , Jul 16, 2009
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                      Not to keep going on this subject, 'cause it is so painful and probably brings up painful memories for other people, but - the woman had a pet dog in her apartment and CLAIMED to like animals...



                      It was only later that she blurted out - in front of four other SCA'ers - that she'd been RAT FINKING on OTHERS who had pets - and pets were allowed, if one paid a small fee - within the apartment complex.  Her speech went something like, "Oh, there are all these stray cats around our apartment complex; 'course, I tell the management when someone has a pet and shouldn't have - oh, maybe I'm responsible for all those cats running around the apartment complex!"  She said it with the most disgusting "Oh, My? What have I done?" cutesy-pie expression in her voice...



                      I absolutely dropped her like a millstone [we had previously been 'friends'] at that instant.  Vicious, bizarre, and MENTal...



                      And now you know the rest of the story.  By the way, I assume that there are rescue organizations that you might be able to call - as well as the local Humane Society and in worse-case scenarios the local Animal Control people - to assist with the pet overpopulations situation???  If people would only have their animals spayed/neutered...  So sad.  Ziddina


                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: "Shere'e" <shereerobinson@...>
                      To: scanewcomers@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2009 9:53:59 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain
                      Subject: Re: [SCA Newcomers] Cruel threesome allowing my hamsters to  starve/thirst to death

                       




                      As an apartment manager I can tell you a POSSIBLE reason. In our house
                      rules (and many others) it clearly states that feeding strays or birds is
                      considered "keeping a pet without permission" and is a major lease
                      violation.

                      It may seem cruel but here is a very good reason for this. Folks will feed
                      strays which in turn attracts more strays and urban wildlife (skunks,
                      possums, rats, mice, ect). Next thing you know you have a huge problem with
                      them and all it takes is for one little kid to try petting the feral kitty,
                      get bit and mom sues the apartment for allowing feral animals to congrigate
                      on the property. In the meantime, Junior has to go in for a very painful set
                      of Rabies shots because he THINKS it was a tabby kitty, No wait, it was a
                      black kitty, no it was a white kitty. Maybe it was a skunk?

                      In case you think I am anti-animal I am not, we have 5 cats, all of which
                      are rescues. Nor is my complex. Animals are more than welcome. I think about
                      40% of my tenants have animals of some sort and our rules are set up to
                      encourage people to have a pet. We will even allow payments on the pet
                      deposit as low as $10 a month and do not charge a "pet rent" which some
                      places do.

                      I agree with Justin that just because someone has an award does not mean
                      that they are a perfect person. Look at the BOD meeting minutes. You will
                      see that some of the people who are banished have titles and awards. You are
                      dealing with PEOPLE and they are as good and as bad as any other group.

                      Lady Miranda

                      www.webeweddings.com
                      Unique Weddings for Unique Couples

                      (SNIPPING FOR LENGTH)

                      On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 8:36 AM, < Ziddinaaitzumar@... > wrote:

                      >
                      >
                      > When I got that poor little black cat, she was almost dead of starvation.
                      > It didn't dawn on me at the time, but why wasn't that SCA woman who TOLD me
                      > about the cat, FEEDING it, even if she couldn't ADOPT it because of the
                      > apartment complex rules??? Instead she dumped the whole thing in my lap -
                      > and I live 15 miles away from her apartment complex!
                      > Oversharing?? Ziddina
                      >
                      >

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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