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Re: [SCA Newcomers] coat of arms

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  • Sara L Uckelman
    ... Both you and your wife should check out this FAQ entry from the www.heraldica.org website: http://www.heraldica.org/faqs/mfaq This will probably explain
    Message 1 of 10 , Jan 3, 2008
      Quoth "wayne_schlapkohl":
      > I'm a complete newbie at this, so excuse a naive question. My wife just
      > received a copy of her coat of arms from a heraldry site. She was a bit
      > sceptical though saying, "I come from a long line of peasants and
      > farmers. Why would my family need a coat of arms?" I don't have an
      > answer. Did even relatively rare names or names of people in lower
      > economic statuses have coat of arms. That would include my name too. I
      > think I too come from a long line of peasants.

      Both you and your wife should check out this FAQ entry from the
      www.heraldica.org website:

      http://www.heraldica.org/faqs/mfaq

      This will probably explain some of the (prefectly correct!) skepticism
      that she had. Arms belonged to a person, not a family or a surname.

      -Aryanhwy



      --
      vita sine literis mors est
      http://www.ellipsis.cx/~liana/
    • wayne_schlapkohl
      Thanks a ton for those responses. Labhaoise s comment has me curious now! Labhaoise commented Just because there is a coat of arms for your name doesn t
      Message 2 of 10 , Jan 3, 2008
        Thanks a ton for those responses.

        Labhaoise's comment has me curious now!

        Labhaoise commented "Just because there is a coat of arms for "your"
        name doesn't mean that you are in any way qualified to it. ...Why do
        you think your name is rare? Are you the only ones you know, have
        they died out in the area you come from? Many names that are rare
        here and now, were common somewhere and sometime."


        You are right, I know very few Schlapkohl(s) and I think I read once
        there are only 90 in North America. But in Germany there may be many
        more.

        I am probably barking up a dead end here, and I've read the latter
        comments that say if I am interested in a coat of arms I should speak
        to a herald to help me design one of mine own. OK, I'm happy to do
        that but, but, well I am curious if I come from the line of
        Schlapkohls that once had the coat of arms I've seen (yes in malls
        and heraldry web sites). Is there a way of finding out what
        individual had been granted a coat of arms or is that just
        impossible. Schlapkohl is an old name (the oldest reference I've seen
        is the 1380s so were talking about some 700 years of relatives here),
        so I would (maybe with some grumbling:) accept it if you folks
        said "no, it's just impossible to do that kind of geneology."

        Thanks again,

        Wayne
      • Sara L Uckelman
        ... It s possible, but sometimes difficult. If the coat of arms was either granted by the English College of Arms, or is something that was ratified by them,
        Message 3 of 10 , Jan 3, 2008
          Quoth "wayne_schlapkohl":
          > and heraldry web sites). Is there a way of finding out what
          > individual had been granted a coat of arms or is that just
          > impossible.

          It's possible, but sometimes difficult.

          If the coat of arms was either granted by the English College
          of Arms, or is something that was ratified by them, then it's
          probably possible to find information in their records
          (though those records are in general restricted in access).

          Another way to find out whether someone with a particular
          surname had a coat of arms would be to look through medieval
          rolls of arms or armorials; these are page of arms, usually
          in full achievement, listed with the bearer's name. The
          Medieval Heraldry Archive, http://www.s-gabriel.org/heraldry/,
          has links to a number of armorials available in electronic
          format. As libraries digitize their old books and manuscripts,
          more of these armorials are becoming easily accessible.

          -Aryanhwy


          --
          vita sine literis mors est
          http://www.ellipsis.cx/~liana/
        • Carrie McGinnis
          ... Pray tell who is spreading this nasty rumor?!!! I sent but one teensey weensie little e-mail to one herald, and he sent it to one of those e-mail lists you
          Message 4 of 10 , Jan 3, 2008
            On Jan 2, 2008 9:17 PM, Signora Beatrice <signorabeatrice@...> wrote:

            > [reluctant snippage of some very amusing content]



            > Contrary to (occasionlly pouplar) belief, Heralds are not ogres, and we
            > really do WANT to help you.
            >
            Pray tell who is spreading this nasty rumor?!!! I sent but one teensey
            weensie little e-mail to one herald, and he sent it to one of those e-mail
            lists you mentioned, and then forwarded close to 10 replies to me -- some
            incredibly volumous -- within half a day. I've never seen such helpful
            people!

            *e-hugs random herald*

            --Carrie


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Signora Beatrice
            ... Carrie, thank you for your support, and I m glad you had such a positive experience with the Heralds. Unfortunately, there are a few things that can happen
            Message 5 of 10 , Jan 3, 2008
              --- Carrie McGinnis <furdreams@...> wrote:

              > On Jan 2, 2008 9:17 PM, Signora Beatrice <signorabeatrice@...>
              > wrote:
              >
              > > [reluctant snippage of some very amusing content]
              >
              > > Contrary to (occasionlly pouplar) belief, Heralds are not ogres, and
              > > we really do WANT to help you.
              > >
              > Pray tell who is spreading this nasty rumor?!!! I sent but one teensey
              > weensie little e-mail to one herald, and he sent it to one of those
              > e-mail lists you mentioned, and then forwarded close to 10 replies to
              > me -- some incredibly volumous -- within half a day. I've never seen
              > such helpful people!

              Carrie, thank you for your support, and I'm glad you had such a positive
              experience with the Heralds.

              Unfortunately, there are a few things that can happen that lead to people
              having a negative impression of heralds:

              1) Running into a particularly crotchety herald (I've met them, they do
              exist, but they're becoming more rare)

              2) Getting your heart set on something that WILL NOT pass, and taking it
              personally when the heralds tell you so (repeatedly).

              3) Being told by a well meaning person one answer, and finding out later
              from a herald that the answer you were given is wrong (see #2 above).

              Heraldic registration in the SCA, thanks to the internet, is becoming more
              and more a transparent process, which leads to more and better information
              out there, and easy ways to debunk myths and misinformation before it
              spreads too far. (I imagine this is true for any area of SCA research,
              but with most areas, you don't have the Laurel Sovereign making judgement
              on everyone's submissions.) The internet has also helped even the most
              remote branches get access to the best Heralds in the world, making
              research and shared knowledge easier (again, true for any discipline).

              As I said before, Heralds are happy to help, anxious to help, and would be
              overjoyed to be asked to help BEFORE you get your heart set on something,
              so we can steer you towards more period sources and designs.

              I would like to think that the overall impression that non-heralds have of
              heralds is positive, and is becoming more positive over time. The College
              of Arms is working for that, as is each Kingdom College of Heralds. I'm
              glad to see, Carrie, that it is positive for you.

              *sighs* Now if we could just take chips off shoulders and erase bad
              memories of heralds-past....




              In Service,
              Signora Beatrice Domenici della Campana, AoA
              Tree-Girt-Sea, Midlands, Middle Kingdom


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