Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Kendoist wanting to get more practice...

Expand Messages
  • SirRichTS
    Hello all, I m the new guy on the list and just wanted to ask a few questions.... 1) Would my standard Kendo Armour work in a SCA event? 2) I m from KC, are
    Message 1 of 16 , Jul 6, 2002
    • 0 Attachment
      Hello all, I'm the new guy on the list and just wanted to ask a few
      questions....

      1) Would my standard Kendo Armour work in a SCA event?
      2) I'm from KC, are there any units around that "Go Samurai"?
      3) Where can I pick up pieces to suplement my SCA Samurai gear?
      (Kote, SCA legal shinai, etc, etc)
      4) Any advice you vets feel a newbie should have

      Thanks All

      Rich
    • Don Luby
      ... Mostly - not being completely familiar with all of the pieces for kendo armor, I cannot say for certain; also, armor requirements vary from kingdomto
      Message 2 of 16 , Jul 6, 2002
      • 0 Attachment
        On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, SirRichTS wrote:

        > Hello all, I'm the new guy on the list and just wanted to ask a few
        > questions....
        >
        > 1) Would my standard Kendo Armour work in a SCA event?

        Mostly - not being completely familiar with all of the pieces for
        kendo armor, I cannot say for certain; also, armor requirements vary
        from kingdomto kingdom.
        SCA minimum armor requirements are:

        16 ga. steel helmet, with no more than 1" gaps in any place,
        extending 1" below the jaw line;
        'Rigid with padding' protection on the throat, elbows, knees,
        hands, kidneys, and groin.

        So, for example, your do would be fine for body armor, but standard
        kendo head and hand protection would not be.

        > 2) I'm from KC, are there any units around that "Go Samurai"?

        I know of a few knights in that general area who have Japanese
        personae, as well as several other fighters; whether they have any
        units, or form part of a European-style unit, I cannot say.
        The household that I belong to, Clan Yamakaminari, is probably the
        largest Japanese (at least in armor and weapons forms) unit in the
        SCA, having on the order of 20 heavy fighters, as well as about a
        dozen or more combat archers (with some overlap), though we only
        really fight as a unit at Pennsic.

        > 3) Where can I pick up pieces to suplement my SCA Samurai gear?
        > (Kote, SCA legal shinai, etc, etc)

        Kote, in the traditional sense, are mot SCA-legal armor, because
        they do not cover the hand (esp. the fingers) enough; I (and most/all
        of my household) wear black plastic gauntlets, made by someone in the
        SCA from Kentucky, which are not too intrusive-looking (they look
        pretty much like lacquered steel at 10'), and, for what we do, are IMO
        far more durable than metal.
        In general, for wear to get useful armor for SCA, you have pretty
        much three options:

        1. Luck out and find an armorer who does Japanese (for example, my
        squire brother, Date, does excellent work, and his URL is
        http://www.kabutographics.com); I've had the excellent for
        fortune to find four locally over the course of my SCA career,
        though most will shy away from it out, usually out of ignorance,
        especially when it comes to kabuto.
        2. Make it yourself - we have rather good instructions on our Clan
        website, http://www.nb.net/~kmeg/kaminari; it's a reasonable
        attempt at looking and armoring in a period fashion, and has been
        emperically battle-tested over the course of years.
        3. Buy modern sporting equipment and modify / hide it as necessary -
        for example, I wear rollerblade elbow and knee pads, and child's
        soccer shinguards on my forearms, but under my kosode and hakama,
        so no-one has to see them.

        As for weapons, all SCA weapons (with the exception of some spears)
        are made from, at their base, 1.25" (or greater) rattan shafts, cut to
        length and planed for better grip, then covered in fibreglass
        strapping tape and duct tape; you can order shafts of rattan from
        http://www.hhperkins.com, following the links for 'rattan fighting
        swords' - I've been ordering from them from years, and have never had
        any problems with the quality of the rattan, or the speed of service.
        Spears are usually made from 1.25" poltruded fiberglass shafts;
        unfortuneately, I don't have any good online soruce for them - I buy
        them at events.

        For more specific information regarding armor and weapons, you
        should look over the SCA armored combat regs at
        http://www.sca.org/officers/marshal/combat/armored/index.html, as well
        as the rules for where you live (the kingdom of Calontir), at
        http://www.calontir.org/~marshal/; you can probably also hook up with
        locals via the Calontir website. Based on the list of warranted
        marshals in Calontir, there are at least two with Japanese personae,
        though there is no geographical information for them lsited.

        > 4) Any advice you vets feel a newbie should have

        As far as fighting goes, keep in mind that SCA fighting has
        different rules from kendo and kenjutsu, though the basic mindset and
        exercise will probably serve you well.
        Do not be disheartened by relative lack of success against
        western-style (i.e. sword & shield) opponents; SCA fighting rules are
        designed (consciously or not) to give that form an advantage, but it
        is certainly more unsurmountable, given practice and diligence.
        If you want to be a Japanese persona, do not let anyone dissuade
        from doing so because "it's weird" or "it's not what the SCA is
        'really' about" - the SCA is so diverse, both in geography and time,
        that there is no singular 'right' way, and they should be welcoming
        the diversity.
        Don't be afraid to ask questions, even if you think they may be
        obvious or simplistic; most people will be happy to answer yoru
        question to the best of their ability. You'll probably also find that
        if you ask a wide range of people same question, you'll get a wide
        range of answers; try and learn from all of them.
        Enjoy the SCA, and the comeradery and friendships that will come
        from it.

        > Thanks All
        >
        > Rich


        Koredono

        -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        Don Luby Magariki Katsuichi no Koredono
        djl@... Yama-kaminari-ryu
        Pittsburgh, PA Debatable Lands, AEthelmearc
      • Kevin Newman
        Konnichi-wa, Unfortunately I am in Missoula. Mt in Artemesia. In Artemesia your kendo armor and shinai would be a no go. Check here at the Clan Genj homepage
        Message 3 of 16 , Jul 6, 2002
        • 0 Attachment
          Konnichi-wa,
          Unfortunately I am in Missoula. Mt in Artemesia. In Artemesia your kendo armor and shinai would be a no go. Check here at the Clan Genj homepage it may be able to help you get in contact with others of the clan that are in your area.
          Minamoto Genkuro Tanekage
          Joshu Yama Sui-shoo Genji
          For Glory and Honor of the Genji
          SirRichTS <DavrosRTS@...> wrote: Hello all, I'm the new guy on the list and just wanted to ask a few
          questions....

          1) Would my standard Kendo Armour work in a SCA event?
          2) I'm from KC, are there any units around that "Go Samurai"?
          3) Where can I pick up pieces to suplement my SCA Samurai gear?
          (Kote, SCA legal shinai, etc, etc)
          4) Any advice you vets feel a newbie should have

          Thanks All

          Rich


          UNSUBSCRIBE: E-mail sca-jml-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



          ---------------------------------
          Do You Yahoo!?
          New! SBC Yahoo! Dial - 1st Month Free & unlimited access

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Grim Shieldsson
          ... No. We use rattan, not bamboo. Rattan will break most of the Kendo gear I ve seen quite easily, and the person underneath. Unless you re talking about
          Message 4 of 16 , Jul 7, 2002
          • 0 Attachment
            --- SirRichTS <DavrosRTS@...> wrote:
            > Hello all, I'm the new guy on the list and just wanted to ask a few
            > questions....
            >
            > 1) Would my standard Kendo Armour work in a SCA event?

            No. We use rattan, not bamboo. Rattan will break most of the Kendo
            gear I've seen quite easily, and the person underneath.

            Unless you're talking about Shinai, in which case.. depends on Kingdom.
            Here in Atenveldt Shinai is banned.

            > 2) I'm from KC, are there any units around that "Go Samurai"?

            Dunno

            > 3) Where can I pick up pieces to suplement my SCA Samurai gear?
            > (Kote, SCA legal shinai, etc, etc)

            Check out Effinghams stuff in the files and links section of the group
            page.

            > 4) Any advice you vets feel a newbie should have

            Ask Effingham about wood and bamboo armor. THen duck. Always good for
            reflex training :)

            Seriously, first get out and play, talk to the folks in your area
            who've been playing a while. Take their advice for a few months...
            this may mean taking up sword and shield for a bit. See what you're
            gonna be letting yourself into. Most of the Kendo students I've seen
            on the field don't do well on the field. What they practice doesn't
            translate well to what happens in the SCA. They get discouraged and
            instead of figuring what works and what doesn't, they just go away.
            Take some time before you go completley japanese in your fighting
            style.
            SCA is sorta real, sorta not. Starting western and moving to eastern
            will allow you to see how most fighters are trained and how best to
            apply what you know.
            Andt he most important thing.... if you aren't having fun, you aren't
            doing it right!


            =====
            Grim Shieldsson (James A Barrows)
            Acting Chieftain of Clan StormWolf
            Barbarian Freehold Alliance
            "The real destroyer of the liberties of the people is he who spreads among them bounties, donations and benefits."
            --Plutarch

            __________________________________________________
            Do You Yahoo!?
            Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free
            http://sbc.yahoo.com
          • Ii Saburou
            ... Go ahead, that s what this list is for! Before I go on, let me introduce myself. I am Ii Saburou Katsumori, in the Barony of Steirbach, Kingdom of
            Message 5 of 16 , Jul 7, 2002
            • 0 Attachment
              On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, SirRichTS wrote:

              > Hello all, I'm the new guy on the list and just wanted to ask a few
              > questions....

              Go ahead, that's what this list is for! Before I go on, let me introduce
              myself. I am Ii Saburou Katsumori, in the Barony of Steirbach, Kingdom of
              Atlantia.

              > 1) Would my standard Kendo Armour work in a SCA event?

              No. Kendo armor isn't (and never was) meant to stand up to the type of
              punishment that SCA combat produces. Furthermore, it is meant to protect
              selected targets from people who have been trained to hit them with bamboo
              shinai. Thus, it leaves the back of your head open (not good if someone
              throws a rap) leaves your elbows unprotected (not to bad v. shinai, but
              terribly dangerous agains wooden clubs), and the legs are an afterthought.
              I'm not even sure that the do would be decent protection for the kidneys
              as most I've seen don't cover it enough to my satisfaction.

              If you want to fight in the SCA, I recommend looking into getting your own
              set of armor. It is expensive, but can cost less than the full kendo
              gear.

              > 3) Where can I pick up pieces to suplement my SCA Samurai gear?
              > (Kote, SCA legal shinai, etc, etc)

              Well, as far as shinai goes, I'm not sure what the rules are for shinai
              combat in your area. The three main types of fighting in the SCA --
              heavy, rapier, and shinai (well, I know some places also have boffer for
              children) -- each have their own rules and requirements. Check with your
              local marshal for advice on what is good for each.

              > 4) Any advice you vets feel a newbie should have

              I'm hardly a vet, but I can think of a few things.

              First off, have fun. This is a hobby, and if you aren't having fun, you
              should be doing something that you do enjoy. Also, don't be discouraged.
              Some people have a tendancy to look down on Japanese personae as outside
              of the game. If you need help, this list is a great place to come.

              On fighting, be aware that kendo--even batto--is a far cry from what goes
              on here. For one, the bushi didn't have to worry about western shields,
              and kendo doesn't really teach you how to attack a shields. I recommend
              you at least play with a shield for a little bit, whatever weapon you
              eventually take up. Don't be discouraged, but realize that kendo and sca
              combat are two different arts with different foci and thus there are
              different manners of moving. I've been learning that the hard way for a
              while, although I also started SCA just a little bit before starting
              kendo, which may have helped.

              Oh, and did I mention you should try to have fun.

              -Ii
            • SirRichTS
              Moshi moshi! OHKO!!!! Well thanks for all the help all! Now for the next question... I have no time to build my own Armour and was wondering if any of you
              Message 6 of 16 , Jul 7, 2002
              • 0 Attachment
                Moshi moshi!

                OHKO!!!! Well thanks for all the help all! Now for the next
                question...

                I have no time to build my own Armour and was wondering if any of you
                would sell or trade an old set of your armour? Have a Tyranid army
                for Warhammer 40K up for grabs or a bit of cash. Where some of you
                said it would be best to start as Sword and Shield corp, I thought on
                that and desided We are Samuari, We learn as Samuari, we die as
                Samuari. Karma eh Karma eh?

                My first foray into SCA will be as Tendo Sato, the Ronin Wander and
                will go from there. Can anyone help Arm, Armour and Equip me? These
                are a few things I would like to pick up...

                Armour (Duh, I'll just wear my kendo stuff for class and formals)
                No Dachi style sword (The Japanese version of the Great sword)
                Spear
                Long and Short sword set
                Hakama and Jacket
                Maybe a overmantle

                .... All the weapons and gear of course need to be SCA Legal, I'm not
                made of money but we could work out a arrangement. As the Bushido
                says once a Samuari sets oneself on a course he must not faulter. If
                I'm going to do this I'm going all the way.

                Plus what is the name of the SCA group in Kansas City or around here?
                I need to get in touch with them. Thanks Guys.. Gomen.. Domo Arigato
                Gosimasu

                Tendo Sato (Richard Sutton)
                Ronin
              • Park McKellop
                The breastplate may survive, none of the rest, I am told is sufficient. In Wichita (Barony of Vatavia, where I am the Baron) we have a Japanese household. If
                Message 7 of 16 , Jul 7, 2002
                • 0 Attachment
                  The breastplate may survive, none of the rest, I am told is sufficient. In Wichita (Barony of Vatavia, where I am the Baron) we have a Japanese household. If you are interested, contact me.
                  Alcyoneus/Kondei Ichimusai Niten
                  SirRichTS <DavrosRTS@...> wrote: Hello all, I'm the new guy on the list and just wanted to ask a few
                  questions....

                  1) Would my standard Kendo Armour work in a SCA event?
                  2) I'm from KC, are there any units around that "Go Samurai"?
                  3) Where can I pick up pieces to suplement my SCA Samurai gear?
                  (Kote, SCA legal shinai, etc, etc)
                  4) Any advice you vets feel a newbie should have

                  Thanks All

                  Rich


                  UNSUBSCRIBE: E-mail sca-jml-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                  ---------------------------------
                  Do You Yahoo!?
                  New! SBC Yahoo! Dial - 1st Month Free & unlimited access

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Kevin Newman
                  Ohayo, Go to www.sca.org to locate the nearest group. They will likely have a loaner set that you can use until you have your own armor, Weapons are
                  Message 8 of 16 , Jul 7, 2002
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Ohayo, Go to www.sca.org to locate the nearest group. They will likely have a loaner set that you can use until you have your own armor, Weapons are individualistic and so we make our own with our own little quirks. Everthing can be made by you but you will probably want to buy a kabuto from a reputable dealer. Bokalo's is on such and he will be at an event near there this next weekend I bellieve at WW. He will also have some armor pieces I believe.
                    Minamoto Genkuro Tanekage
                    SirRichTS <DavrosRTS@...> wrote: Moshi moshi!

                    OHKO!!!! Well thanks for all the help all! Now for the next
                    question...

                    I have no time to build my own Armour and was wondering if any of you
                    would sell or trade an old set of your armour? Have a Tyranid army
                    for Warhammer 40K up for grabs or a bit of cash. Where some of you
                    said it would be best to start as Sword and Shield corp, I thought on
                    that and desided We are Samuari, We learn as Samuari, we die as
                    Samuari. Karma eh Karma eh?

                    My first foray into SCA will be as Tendo Sato, the Ronin Wander and
                    will go from there. Can anyone help Arm, Armour and Equip me? These
                    are a few things I would like to pick up...

                    Armour (Duh, I'll just wear my kendo stuff for class and formals)
                    No Dachi style sword (The Japanese version of the Great sword)
                    Spear
                    Long and Short sword set
                    Hakama and Jacket
                    Maybe a overmantle

                    .... All the weapons and gear of course need to be SCA Legal, I'm not
                    made of money but we could work out a arrangement. As the Bushido
                    says once a Samuari sets oneself on a course he must not faulter. If
                    I'm going to do this I'm going all the way.

                    Plus what is the name of the SCA group in Kansas City or around here?
                    I need to get in touch with them. Thanks Guys.. Gomen.. Domo Arigato
                    Gosimasu

                    Tendo Sato (Richard Sutton)
                    Ronin


                    UNSUBSCRIBE: E-mail sca-jml-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                    Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                    ---------------------------------
                    Do You Yahoo!?
                    New! SBC Yahoo! Dial - 1st Month Free & unlimited access

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Ii Saburou
                    ... I would recommend trying that question at the armour archive (www.armourarchive.org). They may be able to help you find the best of what you re looking
                    Message 9 of 16 , Jul 7, 2002
                    • 0 Attachment
                      On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, SirRichTS wrote:

                      > My first foray into SCA will be as Tendo Sato, the Ronin Wander and
                      > will go from there. Can anyone help Arm, Armour and Equip me? These
                      > are a few things I would like to pick up...

                      > Armour (Duh, I'll just wear my kendo stuff for class and formals)

                      I would recommend trying that question at the armour archive
                      (www.armourarchive.org). They may be able to help you find the best of
                      what you're looking for.

                      > No Dachi style sword (The Japanese version of the Great sword)
                      > Spear
                      > Long and Short sword set

                      Find a rattan dealer online or near you. I believe there is someone out
                      in CA who ships them across the country. Otherwise, look for someone
                      nearby (your local SCA branch should be able to help you out). Look at
                      www.sca.org for the marshal handbooks which will tell you what kind of
                      measurements you will need.

                      > Hakama and Jacket

                      ??

                      I would recommend starting with a kosode and hakama. Look under the
                      'files' section of the Yahoo!groups page for patterns--they are fairly
                      easy. Check with your local Arts and Sciences minister if you need help
                      putting them together; most places I know have garb workshops at least
                      once a month, if not more. Japanese garb is nice because it is basically
                      rectangles, for the most part.

                      > Maybe a overmantle

                      After the kosode, go with a hitatare for formal wear. Maybe a kataginu
                      (hitatare without the arms). For leisure wear you want a dobuku, and
                      perhaps a jinbaori when you start fighting. For information on any of
                      these, check out www.sengokudaimyo.com--look at the clothing section.

                      > .... All the weapons and gear of course need to be SCA Legal, I'm not
                      > made of money but we could work out a arrangement. As the Bushido
                      > says once a Samuari sets oneself on a course he must not faulter. If
                      > I'm going to do this I'm going all the way.

                      Very well. If you would like assistance on any particular
                      part--documenting a name, etc.--please let us know.

                      > Plus what is the name of the SCA group in Kansas City or around here?
                      > I need to get in touch with them. Thanks Guys.. Gomen.. Domo Arigato
                      > Gosimasu

                      Dou itashimashite*. (BTW, just an FYI, if you use Japanese it is usually
                      a good idea to translate it also as not everybody understands Japanese).

                      Go to www.sca.org for more info on local groups, as I believe someone else
                      mentioned.

                      Hope we are helping!


                      -Ii



                      *--'you're welcome'
                    • Richard Sutton
                      ... This site rocks! Thanks!!! ... Check Will Do! ... Okay, will Do. I m not good at sewing so will have to find help who will work for coins of the realm! A
                      Message 10 of 16 , Jul 7, 2002
                      • 0 Attachment
                        >I would recommend trying that question at the armour archive
                        >(www.armourarchive.org). They may be able to help you find the best of
                        >what you're looking for.

                        This site rocks! Thanks!!!

                        >Find a rattan dealer online or near you. I believe there is someone out
                        >in CA who ships them across the country. Otherwise, look for someone
                        >nearby (your local SCA branch should be able to help you out). Look at
                        >www.sca.org for the marshal handbooks which will tell you what kind of
                        >measurements you will need.

                        Check Will Do!


                        >I would recommend starting with a kosode and hakama. Look under the
                        >'files' section of the Yahoo!groups page for patterns--they are fairly
                        >easy. Check with your local Arts and Sciences minister if you need >help
                        >putting them together; most places I know have garb workshops at >least
                        >once a month, if not more. Japanese garb is nice because it is >basically
                        >rectangles, for the most part.
                        >
                        >
                        >After the kosode, go with a hitatare for formal wear. Maybe a kataginu
                        >(hitatare without the arms). For leisure wear you want a dobuku, and
                        >perhaps a jinbaori when you start fighting. For information on any of
                        >these, check out www.sengokudaimyo.com--look at the clothing section.

                        Okay, will Do. I'm not good at sewing so will have to find help who will
                        work for coins of the realm! A shopping I will go it seems!
                        www.sengokudaimyo.com Seems to be the site everone is sending me too! It
                        works very well, Domo! Great Site...

                        >Very well. If you would like assistance on any particular
                        >part--documenting a name, etc.--please let us know.

                        Wow BIG THANKS for this, I have no idea where to start in doing the
                        documentation. Where does one start? I'm thinking Starting as Ronin was the
                        best way to go, how else historicily could I explain why I'm in Europe? Any
                        help would be Great!


                        >Dou itashimashite*. (BTW, just an FYI, if you use Japanese it is usually
                        >a good idea to translate it also as not everybody understands Japanese).

                        Cool, So on the field do We speak "Brokin Engrish" or just plain old English
                        peppered with "Hai" and other snippits and bits of Nipon-go?

                        Dou itashimashite*

                        Tendo Sato

                        (*Here's that translation for the gaijin.. Thank You ;-} )

                        _________________________________________________________________
                        Join the world�s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
                        http://www.hotmail.com
                      • Ii Saburou
                        ... Well, most of us don t try to explain it. I always like Fujiwara no Aoi-hime s explanation--I got on an oxcart, and when I got off, here I was! Remember,
                        Message 11 of 16 , Jul 7, 2002
                        • 0 Attachment
                          On Mon, 8 Jul 2002, Richard Sutton wrote:

                          > >Very well. If you would like assistance on any particular
                          > >part--documenting a name, etc.--please let us know.
                          >
                          > Wow BIG THANKS for this, I have no idea where to start in doing the
                          > documentation. Where does one start? I'm thinking Starting as Ronin was the
                          > best way to go, how else historicily could I explain why I'm in Europe? Any
                          > help would be Great!

                          Well, most of us don't try to explain it. I always like Fujiwara no
                          Aoi-hime's explanation--I got on an oxcart, and when I got off, here I
                          was! Remember, the Knowne World is not Europe--it is the stage for our
                          performances.

                          Now, if someone does require an explanation, we do know that Europeans
                          contacted Japanese persons in India, at least, (I believe that Francis
                          Xavier was urged to go to Japan by a Japanese convert in India) and there
                          was an envoy of young nobles sent to Rome right on the cusp of the 17th
                          Century (IIRC, they left to go find out more about Catholicism, and came
                          back to find that Christianity had been banned). That isn't so good an
                          excuse, though, because we know all the names of these individuals and its
                          not like you could easily sneak into the party. Furthermore, it is of no
                          help unless you want to play only in the tail end of the period, and there
                          is so much fun to be had earlier on!

                          So, just dig up a Japanese history and have fun. If the SCA ever decides
                          to kick us out completely (and there are vampires, kitsune, Tuchux, and
                          cavaliers to get through first) then we will see if we can't just form our
                          shinobi society--all the Japanese personae acting like perfectly normal
                          Englishmen, at least on the outside...

                          I would recommend not going the ronin route. This is mainly because being
                          a ronin was NOT the romantic thing it is made out to be today. The word
                          'samurai' comes from 'saburau', meaning 'to serve'. And a servant who's
                          not serving... but that's another song.

                          Instead, how about marketing yourself as a bushi? A member of the
                          buke--the warrior houses. The bushi were the samurai, and found work in
                          the service of others--even the Shogun was technically just serving the
                          August being. As soon as you find out who your local baron and/or
                          baroness are go ahead and offer your service (or through a local
                          household, etc.) Sure, most will just nod politely and let you go on with
                          what you're doing. At the same time, I find little more enjoyable than
                          attending upon someone at an event--follow along just behind them (unless
                          it is your job to clear the road) and make sure that they are not lacking
                          for anything--run errands if need be, interpose yourself should there be
                          any chance of harm, and at other times, be as unobtrusive as
                          possible--preferrably down on one knee. Watch a lot of samurai movies and
                          notice all the bowing and scraping that takes place (at the same time it
                          is also interesting to notice when it doesn't take place as well...)

                          On the subject of a name--well, sengokudaimyo.com has all the basics.
                          Look at the miscellany, IIRC, under the heraldry section. There should be
                          a bit in there about names, about titles, and about mon. Generally
                          speaking, however, there are three parts that are important:

                          Family name -- this is your 'first' name in most cases. It is how you
                          will be called unless there is another member of your family present
                          (actually, I believe it would be more appropriate to call someone by their
                          title, but that is hard since many people in the SCA don't even have a
                          supernumary position). For me, my family is 'Ii' and so that is how I am
                          called.

                          Common Name (YOBINA) -- This is a common name, and is generally used to
                          call you only by those who are intimate with you. Often this is a name
                          based on your birth order such as Ichirou, Jirou, Saburou, etc. (1st son,
                          2nd son, 3rd son, etc.). I am 'Saburou', which implies that I was the
                          third son. Occassionally there is something prepended to this name--I
                          could have been 'Isaburou', but that would have come out as Ii Isaburou
                          and I didn't want to confuse people too much.

                          Famous Name (Nanori) -- This is the name under which your deeds will be
                          recorded. It is a name which changes a lot in the life of a bushi, it
                          would seem. In the "Heike Monogatari" you see a change take place in
                          several different chapters. It is usually two characters, each of two
                          syllables and read with the Japanese (as opposed to the 'Chinese')
                          reading. Names like Yoshimitsu, Hideyoshi, Naomasa, Ieyasu, Nobunaga,
                          Shigemori--to name a few. Don't worry about this name just yet. The most
                          important part is the family name.

                          You were talking about taking the name Tendo Sato. As in Tendou Soun?
                          Satou and Tendou are both family names in the cases I've seen them--that
                          doesn't mean they weren't used as common names as well. I'm not sure that
                          I can remember seeing either one in period off the top of my head. I will
                          keep my eyes out. My gut tells me to go with Satou as the safe bet,
                          however, since I know that it is a common modern family name, whereas I've
                          only seen Tendou on the tv.

                          Not sure if I've been any help or just muddled the situation. As it is
                          growing late it is hard to tell.

                          > >Dou itashimashite*. (BTW, just an FYI, if you use Japanese it is usually
                          > >a good idea to translate it also as not everybody understands Japanese).
                          >
                          > Cool, So on the field do We speak "Brokin Engrish" or just plain old English
                          > peppered with "Hai" and other snippits and bits of Nipon-go?

                          That depends on a) how good is your Japanese and b) how much do you want
                          people to understand you. As an example, I was the herald for her
                          Excellency, Johanna of Storvik at the recent Novice Tourney. Instead of
                          'Oyez! Oyez!' I shouted 'Minasama wo KIKE!' ('Everbody listen!') and then
                          went on in English. Likewise, I have been known to issue challenges to an
                          opponent in Japanese before a bout as flair. That is because I don't care
                          if people understand such things; they get the gist of it. Answering the
                          questions of a servant bringing you food at feast in Japanese might mean
                          you go hungry, however...


                          -Ii
                        • Richard Sutton
                          ... ~nods liking the Oxcart Explanation~ Hmmmmmmm Deep! ... Alright!!! IMA IMA!!! Time to go wack me a Scot!!!! ICHI-BAN!!! ... Good Point... ... Bushi is a
                          Message 12 of 16 , Jul 7, 2002
                          • 0 Attachment
                            >Well, most of us don't try to explain it. I always like Fujiwara no
                            >Aoi-hime's explanation--I got on an oxcart, and when I got off, here I
                            >was! Remember, the Knowne World is not Europe--it is the stage for our
                            >performances.

                            ~nods liking the "Oxcart Explanation~ Hmmmmmmm Deep!

                            >So, just dig up a Japanese history and have fun. If the SCA ever >decides
                            >to kick us out completely (and there are vampires, kitsune, >Tuchux, and
                            >cavaliers to get through first) then we will see if we >can't just form our
                            >shinobi society--all the Japanese personae acting >like perfectly normal
                            >Englishmen, at least on the outside...

                            Alright!!! IMA IMA!!! Time to go wack me a Scot!!!! ICHI-BAN!!!

                            >I would recommend not going the ronin route. This is mainly because >being
                            >a ronin was NOT the romantic thing it is made out to be today. >The word
                            >'samurai' comes from 'saburau', meaning 'to serve'. And a >servant who's
                            >not serving... but that's another song.

                            Good Point...

                            >Instead, how about marketing yourself as a bushi? A member of the
                            >buke--the warrior houses. The bushi were the samurai, and found work >in
                            >the service of others--even the Shogun was technically just serving >the
                            >August being. As soon as you find out who your local baron and/or
                            >baroness are go ahead and offer your service (or through a local
                            >household, etc.) Sure, most will just nod politely and let you go on >with
                            >what you're doing. At the same time, I find little more >enjoyable than
                            >attending upon someone at an event--follow along just >behind them (unless
                            >it is your job to clear the road) and make sure >that they are not lacking
                            >for anything--run errands if need be, >interpose yourself should there be
                            >any chance of harm, and at other >times, be as unobtrusive as
                            >possible--preferrably down on one knee. >Watch a lot of samurai movies and
                            >notice all the bowing and scraping >that takes place (at the same time it
                            >is also interesting to notice >when it doesn't take place as well...)

                            Bushi is a better thought. Domo, now serving a Baron would be something
                            different. Great so I'll get to spend a wad of cash to equip up to become a
                            Errandboy (J/K). Well time to start a movie night of Shogun(the long
                            version) and a stack of Kirwasorwa films ~LOL~ Break out the Sake and Tuna
                            Rolls!!!

                            >You were talking about taking the name Tendo Sato. As in Tendou Soun?
                            >Satou and Tendou are both family names in the cases I've seen them--that
                            >doesn't mean they weren't used as common names as well. I'm not >sure that
                            >I can remember seeing either one in period off the top of my >head. I will
                            >keep my eyes out. My gut tells me to go with Satou as >the safe bet,
                            >however, since I know that it is a common modern family >name, whereas I've
                            >only seen Tendou on the tv.

                            Okay, the reason I picked Sato was because that was what I was called in my
                            Japanese class, and as for Tendo...well... My wife picked that cause she is
                            a Ranma fan ~LOL~. So now I got to find a family name, and a Honorrific
                            name. Got it.. Thanks for keeping your eyes open and the help!

                            >Not sure if I've been any help or just muddled the situation. As it is
                            >growing late it is hard to tell.

                            Helped Alot! Thank you again!

                            >That depends on a) how good is your Japanese and b) how much do you >want
                            >people to understand you. As an example, I was the herald for her
                            >Excellency, Johanna of Storvik at the recent Novice Tourney. Instead of
                            >'Oyez! Oyez!' I shouted 'Minasama wo KIKE!' ('Everbody listen!') and >then
                            >went on in English. Likewise, I have been known to issue >challenges to an
                            >opponent in Japanese before a bout as flair. That is >because I don't care
                            >if people understand such things; they get the >gist of it. Answering the
                            >questions of a servant bringing you food at >feast in Japanese might mean
                            >you go hungry, however...

                            Well my Japanese is So-so but I know enough to be basic and use it for
                            flair, That would be a cool psych-out before a dual. Thanks! and "Engrish"
                            WILL be used when food is envolved! Now when I do a Cho-noh-yo or cook "Real
                            Food" in camp is a whole other story! Thanks again for all your help!

                            Sato: The Bushi in Creation


                            _________________________________________________________________
                            MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
                            http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
                          • vodican
                            I have a set of armour i am willing to part with. At the bottom i have posted a link to it. The do is about 3 years old. It can be resized with little work.
                            Message 13 of 16 , Jul 8, 2002
                            • 0 Attachment
                              I have a set of armour i am willing to part with. At the bottom i
                              have posted a link to it. The do is about 3 years old. It can be
                              resized with little work. I also make these as a part time deal. I
                              charge $75 to $150 for the do. depending on the amount of lacing you
                              wish to have. I have a good sorce for the plastic barrels (white,
                              black, green, blue). I am willing to part with this one. We can
                              barter a deal if you are interested. I can also tell you how to make
                              sca legal sunate and a elbow that is low profile and hides very will
                              under armour.

                              in service to the crowns of atlantia
                              Hideyoshi Yoshimitsu no Ryu no Kyoto no Kami

                              here are the links:
                              my main page www.geocities.com/vodican
                              http://www.geocities.com/vodican/yoshi2swd2.jpg
                              http://www.geocities.com/vodican/yoshiGS2.jpg
                              http://www.geocities.com/vodican/yoshiGS.jpg
                            • tadatsune
                              ... for ... and Engrish ... cook Real ... help! ... If you are really good at Engrish.... Come to Karaoke night at Clan Yama Kaminari on the last Fri of
                              Message 14 of 16 , Jul 9, 2002
                              • 0 Attachment
                                > Well my Japanese is So-so but I know enough to be basic and use it
                                for
                                > flair, That would be a cool psych-out before a dual. Thanks!
                                and "Engrish"
                                > WILL be used when food is envolved! Now when I do a Cho-noh-yo or
                                cook "Real
                                > Food" in camp is a whole other story! Thanks again for all your
                                help!
                                >
                                > Sato: The Bushi in Creation
                                >
                                >
                                > _________________________________________________________________
                                > MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
                                > http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx

                                If you are really good at Engrish.... Come to Karaoke night at Clan
                                Yama Kaminari on the last Fri of Pennsic. Hachirou is a hoot getting
                                all the Gajin singing in a bad Japanese accent with Feeeeling.


                                Hidesada Tadatsune
                                Retainer to Katurua Hachirou Arahito
                                House Ni Yama
                                Clan Yama Kaminari
                                http://www.geocities.com/Tadatsune

                                (under the 20 ft banners seen from Troll)
                              • Ii Saburou
                                ... Don t you mean Fui-ringu! * -Ii Nigerou *Nashin moa zan, fui-ringu!
                                Message 15 of 16 , Jul 9, 2002
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  On Tue, 9 Jul 2002, tadatsune wrote:

                                  >
                                  > If you are really good at Engrish.... Come to Karaoke night at Clan
                                  > Yama Kaminari on the last Fri of Pennsic. Hachirou is a hoot getting
                                  > all the Gajin singing in a bad Japanese accent with Feeeeling.

                                  Don't you mean 'Fui-ringu!'*

                                  -Ii Nigerou

                                  *Nashin' moa zan, fui-ringu!
                                • Richard Sutton
                                  Well not this year for Pennsic, I need to finish getting everything in place... but next year ~Evil Smile~ ...
                                  Message 16 of 16 , Jul 9, 2002
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Well not this year for Pennsic, I need to finish getting everything in
                                    place... but next year ~Evil Smile~


                                    >From: "tadatsune" <tadatsune@...>
                                    >Reply-To: sca-jml@yahoogroups.com
                                    >To: sca-jml@yahoogroups.com
                                    >Subject: [SCA-JML] Re: Kendoist with no time needing armour!
                                    >Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 18:42:40 -0000
                                    >
                                    > > Well my Japanese is So-so but I know enough to be basic and use it
                                    >for
                                    > > flair, That would be a cool psych-out before a dual. Thanks!
                                    >and "Engrish"
                                    > > WILL be used when food is envolved! Now when I do a Cho-noh-yo or
                                    >cook "Real
                                    > > Food" in camp is a whole other story! Thanks again for all your
                                    >help!
                                    > >
                                    > > Sato: The Bushi in Creation
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > _________________________________________________________________
                                    > > MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
                                    > > http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
                                    >
                                    >If you are really good at Engrish.... Come to Karaoke night at Clan
                                    >Yama Kaminari on the last Fri of Pennsic. Hachirou is a hoot getting
                                    >all the Gajin singing in a bad Japanese accent with Feeeeling.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >Hidesada Tadatsune
                                    >Retainer to Katurua Hachirou Arahito
                                    >House Ni Yama
                                    >Clan Yama Kaminari
                                    >http://www.geocities.com/Tadatsune
                                    >
                                    >(under the 20 ft banners seen from Troll)
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >UNSUBSCRIBE: E-mail sca-jml-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                    >
                                    >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




                                    _________________________________________________________________
                                    Join the world�s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
                                    http://www.hotmail.com
                                  Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.