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Re: procedure and attitude

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  • vodican
    ukyo-dono/mokurai-dono, durring the later period the wakazashi was always with the samuria durring the tea ceremony. It was placed on the letf side on the
    Message 1 of 10 , Dec 7, 2001
      ukyo-dono/mokurai-dono,

      durring the later period the wakazashi was always with the samuria
      durring the tea ceremony. It was placed on the letf side on the floor
      with the blade parallell to your body with thye blade edge toward your
      body. as to make it dificult to draw quickly. If you placethe blade
      edge away from your body then you are saying you dont trust your
      host/guest. I the imperial palace only those who were of a high
      enough court rank was allowed in so they were deamed worthy of carring
      the wakazashi. No one was allowed to carry a weapon in the presence
      of the emperor or his family. To do so was an imediate order for
      sepuku. You can find more on effinghams web page. Look under the
      miscellany and read the sword artical and the ettiquete and protocal
      artical.

      Hideyoshi yoshimitsu no Ju-hachi-i


      >


      Greetings Ukyo-dono,
      >
      > The one instance where you would remove all weapons (that I am aware
      of) is
      > the tea ceremony. In the confines of the tea room, all participants
      wee
      > expected to be peaceful and to regard each other more or less as
      equals. It
      > was an opportunity for open dialogue and relaxation. Needless to
      say, there
      > are many instances of samurai not wanting to give up all their
      weapons
      > before entering (and generally being considered ill-cultured as a
      result)
      > and of attempted assassinations in the tea room where one could
      reasonably
      > expect one's victim to be unarmed and unsuspecting. Never the less,
      the
      > tradition stood up.
      >
      > I also believe that you would be totally unarmed in the imperial
      palace -
      > certainly in the Imperial presence. But not many of our persona
      would be of
      > a high enough rank for this to occur.
      >
      > - mokurai
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: arelyx79 [mailto:Arelyx@h...]
      > Sent: Friday, December 07, 2001 12:27 AM
      > To: sca-jml@y...
      > Subject: [SCA-JML] procedure and attitude
      >
      >
      > the wearing of the Daisho in the Samurai class was a symbol of ones
      > status in later period Japan, correct? and when a Samurai went to
      > the house of a guest he offered up his long sword but retained his
      > short sword as a line of defense and also as a badge of station, if
      i
      > remember right. Would there be any instance that you would be asked
      > to surrender your short sword? if so, would this be an insult as if
      > trying to take away your station? If so who would be likely to ask
      > you to give up your short sword and who would be least likely? Also
      > does anyone know what the general reaction would be to such an
      > occurance??? For example, would your Daimyo be likely to ever ask
      > you to surrender your short sword or your buddy Samurai who you've
      > gone to visit. Trying to narrow down some specifics here...
      >
      >
      > Ukyo
      >
      >
      >
      > UNSUBSCRIBE: E-mail sca-jml-unsubscribe@y...
      >
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    • Carl Grasso
      question... what is proper for sca court? The way to make your dreams come true is to wake up. -Phil Jackson __________________________________________ Get
      Message 2 of 10 , Dec 7, 2001
        question... what is proper for sca court?

        The way to make your dreams come true is to wake up.
        -Phil Jackson
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      • mokurai
        Typically, you are expected to divest yourself of all steel before entering the presence of the Royals. So you can wear what you want, but if you are called
        Message 3 of 10 , Dec 7, 2001
          Typically, you are expected to divest yourself of all steel before entering
          the presence of the Royals. So you can wear what you want, but if you are
          called up, you have to leave it behind. Some folks make a show of removing
          the weapons and ceremoniously placing them on the floor or some such. It's
          easier to just hand them to a friend. I don't think people worry as much
          about things like eating daggers, though.

          - mokurai


          -----Original Message-----
          From: Carl Grasso [mailto:webmaster@...]
          Sent: Friday, December 07, 2001 10:20 AM
          To: sca-jml@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [SCA-JML] Re: procedure and attitude


          question... what is proper for sca court?

          The way to make your dreams come true is to wake up.
          -Phil Jackson
          __________________________________________
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        • Ron Martino
          ... Keep in mind, this is quite kingdom-specific. For example, in Artemisia one of the perks of an Award of Arms is the right to enter the Crown s presence
          Message 4 of 10 , Dec 7, 2001
            > Typically, you are expected to divest yourself of all steel before entering
            > the presence of the Royals. So you can wear what you want, but if you are
            > called up, you have to leave it behind. Some folks make a show of removing
            > the weapons and ceremoniously placing them on the floor or some such. It's
            > easier to just hand them to a friend. I don't think people worry as much
            > about things like eating daggers, though.
            >
            > - mokurai

            Keep in mind, this is quite kingdom-specific. For example, in Artemisia
            one of the 'perks' of an Award of Arms is the right to enter the Crown's
            presence while armed. (After all, the theory goes, they are nobles of
            the Court. Why should the Royalty fear their loyalty?)

            Yumitori
            --

            yumitori(AT)montana(DOT)com
          • Grim Shieldsson
            To be more precise.. it depends on the kingdom.. in Atenveldt you wear your steel when called up. ... ===== Grim Shieldsson (James A Barrows) Acting Chieftain
            Message 5 of 10 , Dec 7, 2001
              To be more precise.. it depends on the kingdom.. in Atenveldt you wear
              your steel when called up.

              --- mokurai <mokurai@...> wrote:
              > Typically, you are expected to divest yourself of all steel before
              > entering
              > the presence of the Royals. So you can wear what you want, but if you
              > are
              > called up, you have to leave it behind. Some folks make a show of
              > removing
              > the weapons and ceremoniously placing them on the floor or some such.
              > It's
              > easier to just hand them to a friend. I don't think people worry as
              > much
              > about things like eating daggers, though.
              >
              > - mokurai
              >
              >
              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: Carl Grasso [mailto:webmaster@...]
              > Sent: Friday, December 07, 2001 10:20 AM
              > To: sca-jml@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: Re: [SCA-JML] Re: procedure and attitude
              >
              >
              > question... what is proper for sca court?
              >
              > The way to make your dreams come true is to wake up.
              > -Phil Jackson
              > __________________________________________
              > Get your free domain name and domain-based
              > e-mail from Namezero.com
              > New! Namezero Plus domains now available.
              > Find out more at: http://www.namezero.com
              >
              >
              > UNSUBSCRIBE: E-mail sca-jml-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
              > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
              >
              >
              >


              =====
              Grim Shieldsson (James A Barrows)
              Acting Chieftain of Clan StormWolf
              Barbarian Freehold Alliance
              Oppurtunity doesn't knock. It only presents itself after you kick down the door.
              --Kyle Chandler

              __________________________________________________
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            • Carl Grasso
              that s what i was thinking. here in the east it is custom to remove the steel. though i ve seen people make a big deal of keeping their sword, even refusing to
              Message 6 of 10 , Dec 7, 2001
                that's what i was thinking. here in the east it is custom to remove the steel. though i've seen
                people make a big deal of keeping their sword, even refusing to enter the royal presence without
                their permission to keep the blade.
                -seiryu

                --- Grim Shieldsson <grimshieldsson@...> wrote:
                > To be more precise.. it depends on the kingdom.. in Atenveldt you wear
                > your steel when called up.


                =====
                http://www.dharmacats.com

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              • chagin1
                ... wear ... Doesn t it also depend on your rank ? An award of arms can be held to imply that you can bear arms, and I haven t seen Patents or Grants of
                Message 7 of 10 , Dec 13, 2001
                  --- In sca-jml@y..., Grim Shieldsson <grimshieldsson@y...> wrote:
                  > To be more precise.. it depends on the kingdom.. in Atenveldt you
                  wear
                  > your steel when called up.

                  Doesn't it also depend on your "rank"? An "award of arms" can be
                  held to imply that you can bear arms, and I haven't seen Patents or
                  Grants of Arms divest themselves of weaponry (although most with whom
                  I'm acquainted do not wear huge amounts at court - they've been in
                  long enough that the novelty seems to have worn off seomwhat).

                  - seamus/jutte
                • Grim Shieldsson
                  That s probably a custom. In Atenveldt, it doesn t matter.. you go up as is. ... ===== Grim Shieldsson (James A Barrows) Acting Chieftain of Clan StormWolf
                  Message 8 of 10 , Dec 13, 2001
                    That's probably a custom. In Atenveldt, it doesn't matter.. you go up
                    as is.

                    --- chagin1 <chagin1@...> wrote:
                    > --- In sca-jml@y..., Grim Shieldsson <grimshieldsson@y...> wrote:
                    > > To be more precise.. it depends on the kingdom.. in Atenveldt you
                    > wear
                    > > your steel when called up.
                    >
                    > Doesn't it also depend on your "rank"? An "award of arms" can be
                    > held to imply that you can bear arms, and I haven't seen Patents or
                    > Grants of Arms divest themselves of weaponry (although most with whom
                    >
                    > I'm acquainted do not wear huge amounts at court - they've been in
                    > long enough that the novelty seems to have worn off seomwhat).
                    >
                    > - seamus/jutte
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >


                    =====
                    Grim Shieldsson (James A Barrows)
                    Acting Chieftain of Clan StormWolf
                    Barbarian Freehold Alliance
                    Oppurtunity doesn't knock. It only presents itself after you kick down the door.
                    --Kyle Chandler

                    __________________________________________________
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