Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Fabric

Expand Messages
  • Barbara Nostrand
    Noble Cousins! Wayne Farris just posted a note to pmjs about hemp and cotton that will probably be interesting to people. Your Humble Servant Solveig
    Message 1 of 14 , Oct 10, 2001
    View Source
    • 0 Attachment
      Noble Cousins!

      Wayne Farris just posted a note to pmjs about hemp and cotton that will
      probably be interesting to people.

      Your Humble Servant
      Solveig Throndardottir
      Amateur Scholar


      >Dear Morgan,
      > I found your message interesting. Hemp, of course, was the preferred
      >cloth for peasants until at least the late fifteenth century, when cotton
      >entered from Korea. I have not looked at the references you cited, but to
      >make hemp cloth, there was quite a lot of "tezukuri" necessary, as I
      >understand. The stalks of the karamushi had to be stripped of their outer
      >skin, and then those skins were pounded to make them softer. Then one could
      >weave cloth. Unlike cotton, clothing made from hemp was cold and
      >scratchy--thus cotton was a big advance when it did come in.
      > I know of a few articles for you to refer to if you like, including an
      >oldie but goodie by Nagahara Keiji.
      > See why studying commoners and their industries can be so valuable?
      > Best wishes,
      > Wayne Farris
      >
      >::::: pmjs footer:::::
      >
      >Nixi Cura's list of upcoming talks & exhibitions
      >http://www.nyu.edu/gsas/dept/fineart/html/chinese/attend.html
      >
      >queries: watson@...
      >post to list: pmjs@...
      >http://www.meijigakuin.ac.jp/~pmjs
      >
      >

      --
      +---------------------------------------------------------------------+
      | Barbara Nostrand, Ph.D. | Solveig Throndardottir, CoM |
      | deMoivre Institute | Carolingia Statis Mentis Est |
      | mailto:nostrand@... | mailto:bnostran@... |
      +---------------------------------------------------------------------+
      | Ignored domains: bestbiz.net, pop.net, hotmail.com, aibusiness.com |
      | vdi.net, usa.net, tpnet.pl, myremarq.com |
      | netscape.net, excite.com, bigfoot.com, public.com |
      | com.tw, eranet.net, yahoo.com, success.net |
      | mailcity.com, net.tw, twac.com, netcenter.com |
      | techie.com, msn.com |
      +---------------------------------------------------------------------+
    • the.lady.phoenix@gmail.com
      Mina-tachi I just got a bit of fabric 100% cotton, pale yellow or washed out orange with yellow-orangish leaves that are a darker color but still pretty light
      Message 2 of 14 , Jun 22, 2009
      View Source
      • 0 Attachment
        Mina-tachi

        I just got a bit of fabric 100% cotton, pale yellow or washed out orange
        with yellow-orangish leaves that are a darker color but still pretty light
        it's 44/45 by 6.25 yards. I'm thinking or maybe making a light weight
        kosode or kimono out of it. I can't share a picture as I can't upload it
        via an email. But if anyone sews wants to take a look please email me
        off-list and I'll send a small picture your way. But I wonder if it's too
        modern a pattern for one or not, plus if there is enough fabric to make a
        one or if I need more.

        But I just wonder what colour Obi would be good as well as the Obi-Cord
        (sorry I forget the proper name for it), any ideas would be welocme.

        Sara


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Luiseach@aol.com
        Pre-1600 kosode have a narrower obi and don t have an obijime or obi cord. Luighseach **************Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes for the
        Message 3 of 14 , Jun 23, 2009
        View Source
        • 0 Attachment
          Pre-1600 kosode have a narrower obi and don't have an obijime or obi cord.


          Luighseach
          **************Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes for the
          grill. (http://food.aol.com/grilling?ncid=emlcntusfood00000004)


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Erin Kelly
          I was just obi shopping myself. The first thing to worry about is avoiding the SCA reserved belt colors. White, red, green, and yellow belts have special
          Message 4 of 14 , Jun 23, 2009
          View Source
          • 0 Attachment
            I was just obi shopping myself.

            The first thing to worry about is avoiding the SCA reserved belt colors. White, red, green, and yellow belts have special meanings and you shouldn't wear them if you're not qualified to wear them. I think blue belts have a meaning too, but it's not exclusive like white and red (green and yellow I'm not 100% sure). Do a web search for "SCA sumptuary laws" if you need more information about that.

            Beyond that, find a color you like. For inspiration, obviously, look at the historical pictures in the Kyoto costume museum (http://www.iz2.or.jp/english/)

            Note that the period (pre-Edo) obi are quite basic; in fact I can't even see any in the Heian models.

            I don't know about cord, I'm a simple Kamakuran girl (or sometimes a boy) and she doesn't bother with froofy stuff like that. But the only fancy cord I see in the costume museum is on the Kamakura "courtesan," who you may or may not want to emulate. And of course, red is still out. (Unless you're a squire, in which case you can go to town with the red! And it would probably look nice.) But I'm pretty sure you can get that kind of drapery cord in gold and some other colors if it's important for you.

            Good luck!

            ERIN
          • wodeford
            ... This depends entirely on kingdom custom. The only one that is specifically reserved is white for the Order of the Chivalry. Obi are easy. From my website:
            Message 5 of 14 , Jun 23, 2009
            View Source
            • 0 Attachment
              --- In sca-jml@yahoogroups.com, Erin Kelly <tupan4@...> wrote:
              > The first thing to worry about is avoiding the SCA reserved belt colors. White, red, green, and yellow belts have special meanings and you shouldn't wear them if you're not qualified to wear them.

              This depends entirely on kingdom custom. The only one that is specifically reserved is white for the Order of the Chivalry.

              Obi are easy. From my website:

              "The obi. Everyone assumes that this is so simple that nobody ever tells you how to make one! Your obi is simply a long, narrow rectangle of fabric. For women: the finished width should be 2" to 3" inches and it should be long enough to be knotted simply around your waist and have the ends fall to about knee length or a little below. (I find that having it long enough to go around twice provides a bit more security in holding one's kosode closed.) For men: the finished width should be about 4" inches and it should be long enough to wrap around your waist two or three times and tie with a knot. (You'll be wearing it over your kosode and under your hakama.) Once you determine how long is long enough, cut a strip that length plus an inch: 7 inches wide for a 3" wide obi, 5 inches wide for a 2" wide obi, 9 inches wide for a man's 4" wide obi. Fold it in half lengthwise. If you use an iron to press the edges inward first, you can sew it without the annoyance of having to turn a long skinny tube of fabric inside out to finish the unsewn end. To add crispness, particularly with lightweight fabrics, buy an equivalent amount of interfacing at your local sewing store and put that between the two sides before stitching it closed.

              Trade Secret: The eBay Obi Makeover. [Text directs you to a photo of me wearing a green obi and BTW, I'm not anyone's apprentice, so it's just a green obi, 'kay?] See that pretty green obi in the photo just below this paragraph on the right? I bought it on eBay. Do your search on "hanhaba obi" or "han haba obi". Hanhaba obi are half the width of modern formal obi and are usually used with women's yukata. However, yukata with fancy hanhaba are frequenly worn by festival dance troupes and you can occasionally find some of these for sale on eBay. Don't bother with the plain ones that are different colors on each side - look for the ones made out of synthetic brocades as they often use design motifs that are period-appropriate. Check the seller's photos to see if they appear to be made of two lengths of fabric sewn together, because that's what you want. If you find one and win, simply use a seam ripper to carefully separate the front fabric from the backing. Fold the fabric lengthwise and sew it back together. If the backing fabric is just as nice, you've just gotten two obi for the price of one. "
              http://www.wodefordhall.com/kosode.htm

              Saionji no Hanae
              West Kingdom
            • Solveig Throndardottir
              Noble Cousin! Greetings from Solveig! White is the only reserved belt color. The others are conventional. Further, most colors are already taken. I recall
              Message 6 of 14 , Jun 25, 2009
              View Source
              • 0 Attachment
                Noble Cousin!

                Greetings from Solveig! White is the only "reserved" belt color. The
                others are conventional. Further, most colors are already taken. I
                recall encountering places where black and brown are reserved.
                Further, a queen once mistook my brown belt for a yellow belt.
                Basically, you can't win. Just go with anything but white. That is
                the only color that will seriously disjoint people's noses.

                > Note that the period (pre-Edo) obi are quite basic; in fact I can't
                > even see any in the Heian models.


                Well, they may simply be called himo, but there are cloth cords that
                serve the function of holding your clothes on.

                > And of course, red is still out. (Unless you're a squire, in which
                > case you can go to town with the red! And it would probably look
                > nice.)

                Nope. Red really isn't out. It isn't protected or reserved to squires
                who are technically in a personal relationship with their knight.
                Being a squire is not a rank or title within the Society itself. A
                number of years ago, Firebrand Herald (a member of the Order of the
                Pelican) was trying to put together a group of people who would wear
                all of the unofficial bling (and especially red belts) that exists in
                the Society at some prominent event such as Pennsic.

                Your Humble Servant
                Solveig Throndardottir
                Amateur Scholar
              • Angela
                Hello friends, I am thinking of making a sleeveless give (mainly for a pirate persona, but also for peasant-ish clothing) and i dont know what to do about the
                Message 7 of 14 , Sep 7, 2012
                View Source
                • 0 Attachment
                  Hello friends,

                  I am thinking of making a sleeveless give (mainly for a pirate persona, but also for peasant-ish clothing) and i dont know what to do about the fabric. Here is the thing, i know next to nothing about fabric. From my understanding it is heavier than regular cotton, but do any of you have any preferences? or can tell me what to look for?

                  again this is for a top that will be worn mainly by itself (with pants of course) so it should be heavy enough to be worn with only a bra or undershrit
                • the.lady.phoenix@gmail.com
                  Good rule of thumb is to get fabric that is heavy or light enough for you to be comfortable in. Natual fabrics preferred. and in case you forgot, no
                  Message 8 of 14 , Sep 9, 2012
                  View Source
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Good rule of thumb is to get fabric that is heavy or light enough for
                    you to be comfortable in. Natual fabrics preferred. and in case you
                    forgot, no peasants in the SCA :).

                    Also the Japanese aesthetic is for more flat chested women rather then
                    the current standard for big breasts that cause back problems. Just
                    saying they didn't wear bras, and even after the western world made
                    contact retained that lack of supportive undergarments. Until the
                    modern times. Again just saying, and this is just from what I've
                    read.

                    On 08/09/2012, Angela <dragonwithin15@...> wrote:
                    > Hello friends,
                    >
                    > I am thinking of making a sleeveless give (mainly for a pirate persona, but
                    > also for peasant-ish clothing) and i dont know what to do about the fabric.
                    > Here is the thing, i know next to nothing about fabric. From my
                    > understanding it is heavier than regular cotton, but do any of you have any
                    > preferences? or can tell me what to look for?
                    >
                    > again this is for a top that will be worn mainly by itself (with pants of
                    > course) so it should be heavy enough to be worn with only a bra or
                    > undershrit
                    >
                    >
                  • Angela Jackson
                    No peasants? Hmm no one told me that. I knew we couldn t known nobles and I understand not being peasant class, but what of the merchant class? Oh well I ll
                    Message 9 of 14 , Sep 9, 2012
                    View Source
                    • 0 Attachment
                      No peasants? Hmm no one told me that. I knew we couldn't known nobles and I understand not being peasant class, but what of the merchant class? Oh well I'll just save it for my non sca pirate.

                      As for the bra, that's just personal, thankfully I'm flat chested in nature but I'm not comfortable walking around without a bra or some form of bandage >.>

                      On Sep 9, 2012, at 1:45 PM, the.lady.phoenix@... wrote:

                      > Good rule of thumb is to get fabric that is heavy or light enough for
                      > you to be comfortable in. Natual fabrics preferred. and in case you
                      > forgot, no peasants in the SCA :).
                      >
                      > Also the Japanese aesthetic is for more flat chested women rather then
                      > the current standard for big breasts that cause back problems. Just
                      > saying they didn't wear bras, and even after the western world made
                      > contact retained that lack of supportive undergarments. Until the
                      > modern times. Again just saying, and this is just from what I've
                      > read.
                      >
                      > On 08/09/2012, Angela <dragonwithin15@...> wrote:
                      > > Hello friends,
                      > >
                      > > I am thinking of making a sleeveless give (mainly for a pirate persona, but
                      > > also for peasant-ish clothing) and i dont know what to do about the fabric.
                      > > Here is the thing, i know next to nothing about fabric. From my
                      > > understanding it is heavier than regular cotton, but do any of you have any
                      > > preferences? or can tell me what to look for?
                      > >
                      > > again this is for a top that will be worn mainly by itself (with pants of
                      > > course) so it should be heavy enough to be worn with only a bra or
                      > > undershrit
                      > >
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • JL Badgley
                      ... Everyone is assumed to be noble, but that doesn t mean you have to be. I have seen several very noble peasants who pulled it off well. -Ii [Non-text
                      Message 10 of 14 , Sep 9, 2012
                      View Source
                      • 0 Attachment
                        On Sep 9, 2012 4:45 PM, <the.lady.phoenix@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Good rule of thumb is to get fabric that is heavy or light enough for
                        > you to be comfortable in. Natual fabrics preferred. and in case you
                        > forgot, no peasants in the SCA :).
                        >

                        Everyone is assumed to be noble, but that doesn't mean you have to be. I
                        have seen several very "noble" peasants who pulled it off well.

                        -Ii


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • the.lady.phoenix@gmail.com
                        Ohh I fully understand that no bra thing, I can get away with not wearing one, but it feels uncomfortable. and by the way cotton isn t always thin, you can
                        Message 11 of 14 , Sep 9, 2012
                        View Source
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Ohh I fully understand that no bra thing, I can get away with not
                          wearing one, but it feels uncomfortable. and by the way cotton isn't
                          always thin, you can get it in heavier weight weaves, but if you used
                          cotton to line a wool outer that might work well for you. IE using
                          the cotton to line a heavier often scratchier but warmer material...
                          especially if you have to go bra-less.... Like a midnight run to the
                          bathroom..... Just saying! If your in Atlantia look me up we could
                          do a sewing weekend/week for you if you wanted. I do have an
                          industrial sewing machine so I could help you quickly make whatever it
                          is you need garb-wise.

                          Ai

                          On 10/09/2012, Angela Jackson <dragonwithin15@...> wrote:
                          > No peasants? Hmm no one told me that. I knew we couldn't known nobles and I
                          > understand not being peasant class, but what of the merchant class? Oh well
                          > I'll just save it for my non sca pirate.
                          >
                          > As for the bra, that's just personal, thankfully I'm flat chested in nature
                          > but I'm not comfortable walking around without a bra or some form of bandage
                          >>.>
                        • Solveig Throndardottir
                          Noble Cousins! Greetings from Solveig! I don t believe that wool was regularly used in Japan. Consider using hemp, linen, ramie, silk, or cotton for that
                          Message 12 of 14 , Sep 9, 2012
                          View Source
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Noble Cousins!

                            Greetings from Solveig! I don't believe that wool was regularly used in Japan. Consider using hemp, linen, ramie, silk, or cotton for that matter. Japanese clothing can be quite warm.

                            Your Humble Servant
                            Solveig Throndardottir
                            Amateur Scholar



                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • the.lady.phoenix@gmail.com
                            I know it wasn t (wool) used often in Japan, however it is available over here more regularly then the others or is substantially less expensive. Plus I was
                            Message 13 of 14 , Sep 9, 2012
                            View Source
                            • 0 Attachment
                              I know it wasn't (wool) used often in Japan, however it is available
                              over here more regularly then the others or is substantially less
                              expensive. Plus I was just grabbing a couple of fabrics I'm more used
                              to sewing and their properties. I agree your list is more authentic,
                              sadly we often have to go with what we can find/afford :(

                              Ai

                              On 10/09/2012, Solveig Throndardottir <nostrand@...> wrote:
                              > Noble Cousins!
                              >
                              > Greetings from Solveig! I don't believe that wool was regularly used in
                              > Japan. Consider using hemp, linen, ramie, silk, or cotton for that matter.
                              > Japanese clothing can be quite warm.
                              >
                              > Your Humble Servant
                              > Solveig Throndardottir
                              > Amateur Scholar
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              >
                              >
                            • Angela
                              thanks again everyone, this helps a lot. sadly i live in LA so wouldnt be able to meet up with you. but we do have a really good garment district ^^. thanks
                              Message 14 of 14 , Sep 10, 2012
                              View Source
                              • 0 Attachment
                                thanks again everyone, this helps a lot.

                                sadly i live in LA so wouldnt be able to meet up with you.
                                but we do have a really good garment district ^^.

                                thanks guys
                              Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.