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  • Jennifer Oaks
    Anyone know of any documentation resouces for favors and tokens? What would the Japanese give to each other as favors and tokens? I ve given out small pieces
    Message 1 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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      Anyone know of any documentation resouces for favors and tokens?
      What would the Japanese give to each other as favors and tokens?
      I've given out small pieces of calligraphy work of the kanji
      for "kotobuki" (congratulations) in the past. Would this be
      appropriate? Would the exchange of poetry fall under this category
      as well? I have written some haiku in English, but haven't yet
      learned how to write them in kana.

      Thanks,
      Keiaiji no Nyudo Nyodai
    • Date Saburou Yukiie
      Konnichi wa, tomodachi, The Japanese as a rule did not give favors or tokens to their loved ones for battle in the same way that Western Chivalry were offered
      Message 2 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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        Konnichi wa, tomodachi,
        The Japanese as a rule did not give favors or tokens to their loved
        ones for battle in the same way that Western Chivalry were offered
        tokens for combat. That concept of "fighting for someone you loved"
        did not exist in Japan as a chivalric norm.
        However, Taiheiki often mentions lovers exchanging tokens, or of a
        man stealing away with a memento of a trist...
        Genji, no doubt, had a closet full of them, as he was quite an
        amourous fellow...but it is doubtfull he took them into battle to
        remind him of his loved ones...

        Date Saburou Yukiie
        Yama Kaminari Ryu


        --- In sca-jml@yahoogroups.com, "Jennifer Oaks" <onewringgold@a...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Anyone know of any documentation resouces for favors and tokens?
        > What would the Japanese give to each other as favors and tokens?
        > I've given out small pieces of calligraphy work of the kanji
        > for "kotobuki" (congratulations) in the past. Would this be
        > appropriate? Would the exchange of poetry fall under this category
        > as well? I have written some haiku in English, but haven't yet
        > learned how to write them in kana.
        >
        > Thanks,
        > Keiaiji no Nyudo Nyodai
      • Date Saburou Yukiie
        Just so people know... I posted a bunch of new poetry gathered for the Yama Kaminari Poetry Slam...cool stuff...check it out and submit some poetry!
        Message 3 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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          Just so people know...
          I posted a bunch of new poetry gathered for the Yama Kaminari Poetry
          Slam...cool stuff...check it out and submit some poetry!
          http://www.nb.net/~kmeg/kaminari/

          Thanks...
          Date Saburou Yukiie
          Yama Kaminari Ryu
        • John Mooers
          Letters - poems - were written or painted onto fans and specialty paper with or without incense. Consider carrying those items vs. a belt favor into battle
          Message 4 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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            Letters - poems - were written or painted onto fans and specialty paper with or without incense. Consider carrying those items vs. a "belt favor" into battle just as you have your death poem attached to your kabuto in the likely event your untimely decapitation renders your prepared speach moot.

            Date Saburou Yukiie <kabuto@...> wrote:
            Konnichi wa, tomodachi,
            The Japanese as a rule did not give favors or tokens to their loved
            ones for battle in the same way that Western Chivalry were offered
            tokens for combat. That concept of "fighting for someone you loved"
            did not exist in Japan as a chivalric norm.
            However, Taiheiki often mentions lovers exchanging tokens, or of a
            man stealing away with a memento of a trist...
            Genji, no doubt, had a closet full of them, as he was quite an
            amourous fellow...but it is doubtfull he took them into battle to
            remind him of his loved ones...

            Date Saburou Yukiie
            Yama Kaminari Ryu


            --- In sca-jml@yahoogroups.com, "Jennifer Oaks" <onewringgold@a...>
            wrote:
            >
            > Anyone know of any documentation resouces for favors and tokens?
            > What would the Japanese give to each other as favors and tokens?
            > I've given out small pieces of calligraphy work of the kanji
            > for "kotobuki" (congratulations) in the past. Would this be
            > appropriate? Would the exchange of poetry fall under this category
            > as well? I have written some haiku in English, but haven't yet
            > learned how to write them in kana.
            >
            > Thanks,
            > Keiaiji no Nyudo Nyodai





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          • Elizabeth Chase
            Oh, get up here to Minnesota and we ll set you straight, lol...... quite frankly, we could use your knowledge and influence up here. Would you mind if I
            Message 5 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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              Oh, get up here to Minnesota and we'll set you straight, lol...... quite frankly, we could use your knowledge and influence up
              here.

              Would you mind if I asked you, privately, how to get some things done and points across about a particular group we briefly
              discussed elsewhere?

              For that matter, anyone who is willing to have a private discourse is welcome. I have some concerns and I'd just as soon not make
              them public.

              Rizii


              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Anthony Bryant
              To: sca-jml@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 3:38 PM
              Subject: [SCA-JML] New e-mail identity and stuff


              Hey, all!

              Well, the IU ISP finally axed my account so I've had to reset everything
              (and quite a hassle that's been!) to a new e-mail addy.

              My new e-mail address is ajbryant@... -- it's up and
              running and receiving mail. So far, it's mercifully been free of spam,
              but it's only been a few days.

              On another side; I've been offered a job in Japan (sort of a rep for a
              wood products company), and it's been tempting me. You all know about my
              thing with Japan and how depressed I've been about the jobless situation
              since the Great Academic Screwing. But there's a part of me that is...
              well, not really ready to move my entire life back across the big pond
              (unloading hundreds of books and electronic toys and car in the
              process). Maybe if I were 10 or 15 years younger, and less attached to
              my armour and swords and stuff, it would be more of a no-brainer. But
              now... I don't know.

              I've been pretty much of a hermit for several months (I can count the
              events I've hit on the fingers of a single maimed hand), but just last
              week having T'giving dinner with some SCA friends has kind of reminded
              me how nice it is to have friends around and people to talk to. So... I
              don't know. I'm thinking about giving Japan a pass and trying harder to
              land something here stateside (though Bloomington seems a wasteland) and
              get out to more events.

              Sorry for having been silent so long, but... well, I've been
              preoccupied. I'll try to do better.

              Effingham

              --

              Anthony J. Bryant
              Website: http://www.sengokudaimyo.com

              Effingham's Heraldic Avatars (...and stuff):
              http://www.sengokudaimyo.com/avatarbiz.html

              Grand Cross, Order of the Laurel:
              http://www.cafepress.com/laurelorder





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            • Date Saburou Yukiie
              Hiraizumi-sensei, Try Youngstown Ohio for a wasteland - we made the international dictionary for depressed...:-) Pining for the fields... PINING FOR THE
              Message 6 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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                Hiraizumi-sensei,
                Try Youngstown Ohio for a wasteland - we made the international
                dictionary for depressed...:-)

                "Pining for the fields..."
                "PINING FOR THE FIELDS!! IT IS A DEAD PARROT!!!"
                "No its not!"
                "YES IT IS!! IT IS DECEASED!!! DEAD!!! IT...IS...A...DEAD...PARROT!!"
                "Um...perhaps its just restin..."


                ...At least Bloomington has electrictity, and they speak a sort of
                passable Engrish...
                Our hopes and prayers, and smoke from incense burns for you...
                Three claps...

                Date Saburou Yukiie
                Yama Kaminari Ryu
                You know - your Deshi - the one who never hears from you...ahem...





                I'm thinking about giving Japan a pass and trying harder to
                > land something here stateside (though Bloomington seems a
                wasteland) and
                > get out to more events.
                >
              • Elaine Koogler
                ... Tony! Good to hear from you again...I ve missed your input. Just to let you know...Dame Hauviette and I are doing a class at the Middle Kingdom Cooks
                Message 7 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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                  Anthony Bryant wrote:

                  > Hey, all!
                  >
                  > Well, the IU ISP finally axed my account so I've had to reset everything
                  > (and quite a hassle that's been!) to a new e-mail addy.
                  >
                  > My new e-mail address is ajbryant@... -- it's up and
                  > running and receiving mail. So far, it's mercifully been free of spam,
                  > but it's only been a few days.
                  >
                  > On another side; I've been offered a job in Japan (sort of a rep for a
                  > wood products company), and it's been tempting me. You all know about my
                  > thing with Japan and how depressed I've been about the jobless situation
                  > since the Great Academic Screwing. But there's a part of me that is...
                  > well, not really ready to move my entire life back across the big pond
                  > (unloading hundreds of books and electronic toys and car in the
                  > process). Maybe if I were 10 or 15 years younger, and less attached to
                  > my armour and swords and stuff, it would be more of a no-brainer. But
                  > now... I don't know.
                  >
                  > I've been pretty much of a hermit for several months (I can count the
                  > events I've hit on the fingers of a single maimed hand), but just last
                  > week having T'giving dinner with some SCA friends has kind of reminded
                  > me how nice it is to have friends around and people to talk to. So... I
                  > don't know. I'm thinking about giving Japan a pass and trying harder to
                  > land something here stateside (though Bloomington seems a wasteland) and
                  > get out to more events.
                  >
                  > Sorry for having been silent so long, but... well, I've been
                  > preoccupied. I'll try to do better.
                  >
                  > Effingham
                  >
                  > --
                  >
                  > Anthony J. Bryant
                  > Website: http://www.sengokudaimyo.com
                  >
                  > Effingham's Heraldic Avatars (...and stuff):
                  > http://www.sengokudaimyo.com/avatarbiz.html
                  >
                  > Grand Cross, Order of the Laurel:
                  > http://www.cafepress.com/laurelorder
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
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                  >
                  Tony!

                  Good to hear from you again...I've missed your input. Just to let you
                  know...Dame Hauviette and I are doing a class at the Middle Kingdom
                  Cooks' Symposium (Kalamazoo, MI...Dec 4) on Japanese cooking...and we're
                  going to talk about the Ryori Monogotari. Josh has translated a fair
                  amount of it...enough for us to do something fairly intelligible and I
                  have a copy of Naomichi Ishige's History and Culture of Japanese Food.
                  Wish you could be there! If you're interested, we'll send you a copy of
                  our notes and what we have of Josh's translation.

                  Elaine
                • Date Saburou Yukiie
                  Hiraizumi-sensei... Please feel free to come and stay at my house, and shoot with me... Not wanting people to think I habitually um... String up your bow...
                  Message 8 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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                    Hiraizumi-sensei...
                    Please feel free to come and stay at my house, and shoot with me...
                    Not wanting people to think I habitually um..."String up your bow..."
                    ahem...I would be glad to have you stay here for however long to
                    shoot...Bring your bow...bring your armor and your Suikan...
                    I just made a full scale set of paper targets (not A.N.K.F. - heh heh
                    heh) that have cool Samurai trying to shoot you back...so you better
                    hit them first!!

                    > Eep... OTOH, you have all that wide open space to go out and shoot.
                    I
                    > can't remember the last time my bow was strung

                    I am real good at making a Lobster Risque...It is like a rue, but
                    does not reduce as much...pretty pinkish color, slightly milkey...

                    (damn, that sounds like a
                    > risque euphemism). We're not legally permitted to shoot a bow in
                    the
                    > "city" anyway... I'd have to find an archery range or something.
                    >

                    Why would you want to shoot a lobster with a bow? Send scantilly clad
                    pearl divers after them!!
                    Silly Barons...You have got to drop that Western Persona and come to
                    the dark side once and for all......


                    > Ah, the Classics. :)
                    >
                    > Move over Genji. Meet Python.

                    Ain't life grand! The Classics indeed!



                    Date - who is now likely in trouble!!!
                  • Anthony Bryant
                    Hey, all! Well, the IU ISP finally axed my account so I ve had to reset everything (and quite a hassle that s been!) to a new e-mail addy. My new e-mail
                    Message 9 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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                      Hey, all!

                      Well, the IU ISP finally axed my account so I've had to reset everything
                      (and quite a hassle that's been!) to a new e-mail addy.

                      My new e-mail address is ajbryant@... -- it's up and
                      running and receiving mail. So far, it's mercifully been free of spam,
                      but it's only been a few days.

                      On another side; I've been offered a job in Japan (sort of a rep for a
                      wood products company), and it's been tempting me. You all know about my
                      thing with Japan and how depressed I've been about the jobless situation
                      since the Great Academic Screwing. But there's a part of me that is...
                      well, not really ready to move my entire life back across the big pond
                      (unloading hundreds of books and electronic toys and car in the
                      process). Maybe if I were 10 or 15 years younger, and less attached to
                      my armour and swords and stuff, it would be more of a no-brainer. But
                      now... I don't know.

                      I've been pretty much of a hermit for several months (I can count the
                      events I've hit on the fingers of a single maimed hand), but just last
                      week having T'giving dinner with some SCA friends has kind of reminded
                      me how nice it is to have friends around and people to talk to. So... I
                      don't know. I'm thinking about giving Japan a pass and trying harder to
                      land something here stateside (though Bloomington seems a wasteland) and
                      get out to more events.

                      Sorry for having been silent so long, but... well, I've been
                      preoccupied. I'll try to do better.

                      Effingham

                      --

                      Anthony J. Bryant
                      Website: http://www.sengokudaimyo.com

                      Effingham's Heraldic Avatars (...and stuff):
                      http://www.sengokudaimyo.com/avatarbiz.html

                      Grand Cross, Order of the Laurel:
                      http://www.cafepress.com/laurelorder
                    • Anthony Bryant
                      ... How s the job market? ;) ... Sure, anytime. You know where to find me. Effingham -- Anthony J. Bryant Website: http://www.sengokudaimyo.com Effingham s
                      Message 10 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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                        Elizabeth Chase wrote:

                        >Oh, get up here to Minnesota and we'll set you straight, lol...... quite frankly, we could use your knowledge and influence up
                        >here.
                        >
                        >
                        How's the job market? ;)

                        >Would you mind if I asked you, privately, how to get some things done and points across about a particular group we briefly
                        >discussed elsewhere?
                        >
                        >
                        Sure, anytime. You know where to find me.


                        Effingham

                        --

                        Anthony J. Bryant
                        Website: http://www.sengokudaimyo.com

                        Effingham's Heraldic Avatars (...and stuff):
                        http://www.sengokudaimyo.com/avatarbiz.html

                        Grand Cross, Order of the Laurel:
                        http://www.cafepress.com/laurelorder
                      • Date Saburou Yukiie
                        Muahaa haa haa... ... Date
                        Message 11 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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                          Muahaa haa haa...
                          > You're very scarey sometimes. ;)
                          >
                          > >
                          Date
                        • Anthony Bryant
                          ... Eep... OTOH, you have all that wide open space to go out and shoot. I can t remember the last time my bow was strung (damn, that sounds like a risque
                          Message 12 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Date Saburou Yukiie wrote:

                            >Hiraizumi-sensei,
                            >Try Youngstown Ohio for a wasteland - we made the international
                            >dictionary for depressed...:-)
                            >
                            >
                            Eep... OTOH, you have all that wide open space to go out and shoot. I
                            can't remember the last time my bow was strung (damn, that sounds like a
                            risque euphemism). We're not legally permitted to shoot a bow in the
                            "city" anyway... I'd have to find an archery range or something.

                            >"Pining for the fields..."
                            >"PINING FOR THE FIELDS!! IT IS A DEAD PARROT!!!"
                            >"No its not!"
                            >"YES IT IS!! IT IS DECEASED!!! DEAD!!! IT...IS...A...DEAD...PARROT!!"
                            >"Um...perhaps its just restin..."
                            >
                            >
                            Ah, the Classics. :)

                            Move over Genji. Meet Python.

                            >
                            >...At least Bloomington has electrictity, and they speak a sort of
                            >passable Engrish...
                            >Our hopes and prayers, and smoke from incense burns for you...
                            >Three claps...
                            >
                            >Date Saburou Yukiie
                            >Yama Kaminari Ryu
                            >You know - your Deshi - the one who never hears from you...ahem...
                            >
                            >
                            Actually, NO one hears from me these days. My apologies. I feel bad
                            about that. It's a viscious cycle (no, not a Harley) that I really don't
                            want to go into, but suffice to say that I'm struggling to work my way
                            out of it.

                            Effingham

                            --

                            Anthony J. Bryant
                            Website: http://www.sengokudaimyo.com

                            Effingham's Heraldic Avatars (...and stuff):
                            http://www.sengokudaimyo.com/avatarbiz.html

                            Grand Cross, Order of the Laurel:
                            http://www.cafepress.com/laurelorder
                          • Anthony Bryant
                            ... Hold that thought. I might be able to work something out. :) ... Mmmm.... scantily clad pearl divers..... ... You re very scarey sometimes. ;) ... Oh,
                            Message 13 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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                              Date Saburou Yukiie wrote:

                              >Hiraizumi-sensei...
                              >Please feel free to come and stay at my house, and shoot with me...
                              >Not wanting people to think I habitually um..."String up your bow..."
                              >ahem...I would be glad to have you stay here for however long to
                              >shoot...Bring your bow...bring your armor and your Suikan...
                              >I just made a full scale set of paper targets (not A.N.K.F. - heh heh
                              >heh) that have cool Samurai trying to shoot you back...so you better
                              >hit them first!!
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              Hold that thought. I might be able to work something out. :)

                              >Why would you want to shoot a lobster with a bow? Send scantilly clad
                              >pearl divers after them!!
                              >
                              Mmmm.... scantily clad pearl divers.....

                              >Silly Barons...You have got to drop that Western Persona and come to
                              >the dark side once and for all......
                              >
                              >
                              You're very scarey sometimes. ;)

                              >
                              >Ain't life grand! The Classics indeed!
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >Date - who is now likely in trouble!!!
                              >
                              >
                              Oh, yeah. ;)

                              Effingham

                              --

                              Anthony J. Bryant
                              Website: http://www.sengokudaimyo.com

                              Effingham's Heraldic Avatars (...and stuff):
                              http://www.sengokudaimyo.com/avatarbiz.html

                              Grand Cross, Order of the Laurel:
                              http://www.cafepress.com/laurelorder
                            • makiwara_no_yetsuko
                              ... Poetry ... Been there, done that, teased the daimyo without getting blood all over the shoji. ;- Looking forward to the next topic. Makiwara
                              Message 14 of 17 , Nov 29, 2004
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                                --- In sca-jml@yahoogroups.com, "Date Saburou Yukiie" <kabuto@c...>
                                wrote:
                                >
                                > Just so people know...
                                > I posted a bunch of new poetry gathered for the Yama Kaminari
                                Poetry
                                > Slam...cool stuff...check it out and submit some poetry!
                                > http://www.nb.net/~kmeg/kaminari/

                                Been there, done that, teased the daimyo without getting blood all
                                over the shoji. ;-> Looking forward to the next topic.

                                Makiwara
                              • Solveig
                                Noble Cousin! Greetings from Solveig! Poetry is more of a party game than a party favour. As for preasants. These typically need to be wrapped and should not
                                Message 15 of 17 , Nov 30, 2004
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                                  Noble Cousin!

                                  Greetings from Solveig! Poetry is more of a party game than a party favour.
                                  As for preasants. These typically need to be wrapped and should not be
                                  unwrapped in the presence of the giver.

                                  As for combat momentos. Those are typically souveneirs returned to loved
                                  one after the death of a warrior. These could be such things as a lock of
                                  hair. Victors in combat would take the heads for prominent warriors and
                                  would display them to their lords. The lord might then award the warrior
                                  with an appointment or promotion of some sort.
                                  --

                                  Your Humble Servant
                                  Solveig Throndardottir
                                  Amateur Scholar

                                  +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
                                  | Barbara Nostrand, Ph.D. | Solveig Throndardottir, CoM, CoS, Fleur |
                                  | deMoivre Institute | Carolingia Statis Mentis Est |
                                  | mailto:nostrand@... | mailto:bnostran@... |
                                  +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
                                  | Note. Many popular "free" email services are automatically routed to the |
                                  | trash by my email filters. |
                                  +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
                                • Solveig
                                  Baron Edward! Greetings from Solveig! You should definitely jump at the chance to move back to Japan. I should have jumped into the Pacific and started
                                  Message 16 of 17 , Nov 30, 2004
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                                    Baron Edward!

                                    Greetings from Solveig! You should definitely jump at the chance to move
                                    back to Japan. I should have jumped into the Pacific and started swimming
                                    when I had a chance several years ago. As for the matterial posessions
                                    that trouble you. The only one of any significance is your car which you
                                    will not need in Japan anyway. The books CAN be shipped to Japan. Just
                                    contact a freight broker. Most of your electronic toys will work just fine
                                    in Japan and you can ship those as well. The only thing which will not
                                    work is a U.S. HDTV.
                                    --

                                    Your Humble Servant
                                    Solveig Throndardottir
                                    Amateur Scholar

                                    +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
                                    | Barbara Nostrand, Ph.D. | Solveig Throndardottir, CoM, CoS, Fleur |
                                    | deMoivre Institute | Carolingia Statis Mentis Est |
                                    | mailto:nostrand@... | mailto:bnostran@... |
                                    +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
                                    | Note. Many popular "free" email services are automatically routed to the |
                                    | trash by my email filters. |
                                    +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
                                  • Park McKellop
                                    ... As for preasants. These typically need to be wrapped and should not be ... I would tend to agree with this, even in the modern world, it is more my style.
                                    Message 17 of 17 , Dec 1, 2004
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                                      Solveig <nostrand@...> wrote:
                                      >Noble Cousin!

                                      >Greetings from Solveig! Poetry is more of a party game than a party favour.
                                      As for preasants. These typically need to be wrapped and should not be
                                      >unwrapped in the presence of the giver.
                                      I would tend to agree with this, even in the modern world, it is more my style.


                                      >As for combat momentos. Those are typically souveneirs returned to loved
                                      one after the death of a warrior. These could be such things as a lock of
                                      hair. Victors in combat would take the heads for prominent warriors and
                                      would display them to their lords. The lord might then award the warrior
                                      with an appointment or promotion of some sort.
                                      --

                                      Your Humble Servant
                                      Solveig Throndardottir
                                      Amateur Scholar



                                      I keep thinking that it might be neat to present opponents with little 'kogai' in some form after memorable fights, or simpler ones for regular fights in tournaments or challenges.



                                      Alcyoneus



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