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Re: [SCA-JML] Re: nunchaku, flails and tetsubo

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  • Andrew Leitch
    Toshinobu-dono, Interesting reply. Am I really coming across as if I have some kind of vested interest in all of this? I know that I ve got a bit of an
    Message 1 of 16 , May 3, 2004
      Toshinobu-dono,

      Interesting reply. Am I really coming across as if I have some kind of
      vested interest in all of this? I know that I've got a bit of an
      anti-authoritarian streak in me, so I can be a little "contrary" at times.

      Its just an *idea* I have - that it might be possible to make an SCA legal
      flail or morningstar (though not a nunchaku, or course...). I'm not out to
      hurt people or take risks at other people's expense. Its just that when
      someone tells me I *can't* do something, my natural reaction is to at least
      ask why... and if I'm not satsified with the answer, to try and do it
      anyway. :)

      That said, I'm not actually interested in doing that right now. I'm too
      absorbed with the latest fechtbuch to worry about building the perfect
      flail (one day though, I just *know* it can be done....:)).

      And of course we must keep our safety in mind. When someone suggests we
      try something new and dangerous (like grappling or grabbing swords for
      instance), I'm usually the first to say "no way"! I've got a regular job to
      do that involves me being on call to restrain someone at a moment's notice.
      I can't really afford to carry around any injuries. However, if it can be
      proved to me that a new weapon or technique can be used safely, then I'm
      all for it.

      snip

      "Also remember we are "guests" of our Occidental friends in the SCA and
      some weapons of the orient will not conform easily or at all to the Rules
      of the List."

      snip

      Ahhh... actually, I'm one of those "Occidental friends" at the moment. :)
      I've been playing a Frenchman for the last seven years. But don't worry,
      I'm not about to put together my oriental persona, march out onto the field
      with a dangerous tetsubo or nunchaku or other untried weapon and demand
      that people accept my weapon along with my new persona - thus ruining for
      everyone else who wants to be Japanese. :p

      Anyway... I'm perhaps getting a little overwrought over nothing. Sorry if I
      got anyone else worried that I was about to test my opinions about the
      potential safety of flails or tetsubos by trying one out on an unsuspecting
      opponent at the next tourney. I'm sure my knight and my lady would be most
      displeased if I did.

      - Andre le hyakusho
    • Yama Kaminari no Date Saburou Yukiie
      Konnichi wa, tomodachi, Having replied earlier, I think it might be of interest that I once convinced a local Marshalate to let me try, under rigid
      Message 2 of 16 , May 3, 2004
        Konnichi wa, tomodachi,
        Having replied earlier, I think it might be of interest that I once
        convinced a local Marshalate to let me try, under "rigid
        restrictions..." the use of an SCA version of a san setu bo - a
        chinese style three sectional staff.
        I was under no conditions allowed to flail it, or use it in "pinching
        manouvers..."...but I was allowed to use it under trial conditins as a
        sort of two weapon with a connected brace in the center.
        I am well versed in real three sectional staff use, and know probably
        all of the real applications for the thing. Knowing such, I was
        allowed to "confine myself" to using only certain aspects of the weapon.
        Did Samurai use it? - no. Could it be lethal against an armored
        opponent? I doubt it would be any more effective than any other real
        wooden weapon...
        Was it fun? Hells yes!
        The experiment went on for a summer, and I have to say, even trained
        in the real uses, it was often "tempting" to use it beyond the SCA
        constraints impositions...
        In the end, we gave it up as an interesting, but not particularly
        productive experiment.
        No one was harmed, and all went well. I like experimental weapons
        forms - provided all possible "safty measures" are accounted for.

        Date Saburou Yukiie
        Yama Kaminari Ryu
        Shi wa hei to de aru - all are equal in the grave
        http://www.kabutographics (still under re-construction)

        >
        > Interesting reply. Am I really coming across as if I have some kind of
        > vested interest in all of this? I know that I've got a bit of an
        > anti-authoritarian streak in me, so I can be a little "contrary" at
        times.
        >
        > Its just an *idea* I have - that it might be possible to make an SCA
        legal
        > flail or morningstar (though not a nunchaku, or course...) <hacked
        the rest off...>
      • Ii Saburou
        I guess my thought on the whole experimental weapons is that you can do just about any weapon, up to live steel, as long as your rules and skill required fit
        Message 3 of 16 , May 3, 2004
          I guess my thought on the whole experimental weapons is that you can do
          just about any weapon, up to live steel, as long as your rules and skill
          required fit that weapon. SCA goes for LCD, so we tend to not allow a lot
          of weapons, require lots of armor, and carefully define where people can
          and cannot hit.

          Kendo, Fencing, and Atarashii Naginata have solved many problems (and
          created others) by making light weapons and teaching people to control
          themselves.

          Shindo Muso Ryu Jodo, from what I've seen, teaches control, has set forms,
          but allows for variations on the forms as skill level increases to deal
          with threatening situations.

          Nakamura Ryu Happo Giri Toho relegates combat to two-man forms (kumitachi)
          where the 'combatants' are doing set moves. As skill increases, live
          blades are used.

          Just a bit of comparison. All of them have their points and flaws, and it
          has a lot to do with how things are meant to be. I do wish that we could
          do more 'dojo' like classes with real or wooden weapons, test cutting, and
          choreographed demos, and then have another part of the SCA for tournament
          fighting, but because of the problems regulating such things, only the
          last is really done all that much in the SCA (although the rules do not
          strictly prohibit the others, if I read them correctly).

          -Ii
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