Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [SCA-JML] Pennisc

Expand Messages
  • Barbara Nostrand
    Lady Cynwise æt Sceaduwode! Greetings from Solveig! ... I do not recall anything in the RfS which restricts registration of Society names to those who are 18
    Message 1 of 22 , Jul 2, 2000
    • 0 Attachment
      Lady Cynwise æt Sceaduwode!

      Greetings from Solveig!

      >the SCA. Of course, I realize that she can't even really register a
      >name until
      >she is 18, and that this might be a phase that she could grow out
      >of, but I feel
      >very reticent to squelch her curiousity.

      I do not recall anything in the RfS which restricts registration of Society
      names to those who are 18 or older.

      Now then. Your child is 9 years old. She is not expected to wear court
      robes yet. In fact, it is rather inappropriate for her to do so as she
      would not receive a court appointment until she was at least 12 or 13
      at the very earliest.

      Concerning heat and humidity. Parts of Japan are quite hot and humid during
      the Summer. The Japanese wore clothing which would allow people to survive
      that sort of weather.

      Japanese clothing can be just about as simple as a T-tunic. As for Japanese
      names. I can try to find my copy of History of Japanese Female Names by
      Pennsic and bring it with me. I will be giving a class on the Origin of
      Japanese Names. Incidentally, your daughter would have a childhood name
      at this point. Japanese customarily took new names at their coming of age
      ceremony. For that matter, an active life could give a Japanese person lots
      of opportunities to change their name or collect new ones to add to old ones.

      Your Humble Servant
      Solveig Thronardottir
      Amateur Scholar

      Sorry for not being of greater help reight now. I have to vacate my office
      within the next two days. (The perilous life of the itinerant academic. I
      am off to a new post in the Autumn. Strange things happen. A place whose
      temporary job I turned down a few weeks ago called at the end of last
      week to offer a tenure track job. If the current tenure track offer falls
      trough, then I will take the newly offered one. *SIGH*)

      --
      +---------------------------------------------------------------------+
      | Barbara Nostrand, Ph.D. | Solveig Throndardottir, CoM |
      | de Moivre Institute | Carolingia Statis Mentis Est |
      | mailto:nostrand@... | mailto:bnostran@... |
      +---------------------------------------------------------------------+
      | Ignored domains: bestbiz.net, pop.net, hotmail.com, aibusiness.com |
      | vdi.net, usa.net, tpnet.pl, myremarq.com |
      | netscape.net, excite.com, bigfoot.com, public.com |
      | com.tw, eranet.net, yahoo.com, success.net |
      | mailcity.com, net.tw, twac.com, netcenter.com |
      | techie.com, msn.com |
      +---------------------------------------------------------------------+
    • Barbara Nostrand
      Noble Cousin! Yes, there are a lot of auxiliary verbs and joshi and all sorts of other stuff that was around in classical Japanese, but isn t now. By 1500,
      Message 2 of 22 , Jul 2, 2000
      • 0 Attachment
        Noble Cousin!

        Yes, there are a lot of auxiliary verbs and joshi and all sorts of
        other stuff that was around in classical Japanese, but isn't now.
        By 1500, Japanese starts looking pretty recognizeable. Even so,
        there is a "translation" into modern Japanese of Ryorimonogatari
        (17c) Regardless, a good text is:

        The Guide to Japanese Literature
        Shogakukan
        ISBN 4-09-504501-9

        Your Humble Servant
        Solveig Throndardottir
        Amateur Scholar

        --
        +---------------------------------------------------------------------+
        | Barbara Nostrand, Ph.D. | Solveig Throndardottir, CoM |
        | de Moivre Institute | Carolingia Statis Mentis Est |
        | mailto:nostrand@... | mailto:bnostran@... |
        +---------------------------------------------------------------------+
        | Ignored domains: bestbiz.net, pop.net, hotmail.com, aibusiness.com |
        | vdi.net, usa.net, tpnet.pl, myremarq.com |
        | netscape.net, excite.com, bigfoot.com, public.com |
        | com.tw, eranet.net, yahoo.com, success.net |
        | mailcity.com, net.tw, twac.com, netcenter.com |
        | techie.com, msn.com |
        +---------------------------------------------------------------------+
      • Anthony J. Bryant
        ... We re not talking about now. We re talking about 16th Century Japanese. ... Shakespeare is fairly recognizable too, but there are many points of grammar
        Message 3 of 22 , Jul 3, 2000
        • 0 Attachment
          Barbara Nostrand wrote:

          > Noble Cousin!
          >
          > Yes, there are a lot of auxiliary verbs and joshi and all sorts of
          > other stuff that was around in classical Japanese, but isn't now.

          We're not talking about now. We're talking about 16th Century Japanese.

          >
          > By 1500, Japanese starts looking pretty recognizeable. Even so,
          > there is a "translation" into modern Japanese of Ryorimonogatari
          > (17c)

          Shakespeare is "fairly recognizable" too, but there are many points of
          grammar and syntax in Shakespeare that are not common in contemporary
          English. The same with elements of Shakespearean vocabulary. Ask Lord
          Goderic about those Kyogen and Noh texts he's been trying to work on.
          That's *not* modern Japanese.

          Let me quote something as an example.

          Let's be specific, too, since we're talking about letters. Here's a letter
          in its entirety which was sent from Ieyasu to Hideyoshi who was in the
          midst of a campaign (my apologies to those who don't speak Japanese and
          can't catch why this is different):

          "Tsusshinde gonjou. Somosomo kondo Kishuu omote ni oite kakushuu to shite
          goriun no dan omowazariki ni, shojin botsuraku su. Kore mata gokenryo no
          hoka nari. Iyoiyo bangun genke taigen no ittou kijiku shi, tokoshinae ni
          tsuranatte taishi taiyou ne ni kashite chouken nari. Naozari ni rikkoku,
          narabi ni kitaru koto kaku no gotoshi. Jin'i wo Kyuushuu ni furui, ikioi
          nao moppara nari. Hatamata gokikan sottaku tsusshinde hofuku su. Yotte,
          kudan no tou. Sonkou sonhitsu uyamatt mousu.
          "Nangatsu itsuka Nanigashi
          "Fujiwara Hideyoshi-kou
          "Teishou shitatematsuru gobandokoro."

          The translation:

          "With deep respect, I report to you. Just when I did not expect you to be
          victorious in your present campaign in Kii province, the opponent being so
          persistently hostile, all enemy camps collapsed. This again is nothing but
          [evidence of] your wisdom. More and more, all armies have no option but to
          vanish before you like apparitions. Entwined for all eternity, branches and
          leaves become roots, healthy and strong. It happened just as easy as
          conquering the Six Provinces all at once. When you extend your divine might
          to Kyushu, your strength will become even more complete. Moreover, I
          prostrate myself in anticipation of the propitious occasion of your return.
          Thus the foregoing. With deep respect, I remain your humble servant.
          "Some month, some day X
          "Lord Fujiwara Hideyoshi
          "To the guardhouse that will present this letter."

          Does that look very modern? No desu. No gozaru. Hell, no sourou. Inflected
          verbs and adjectives. Honorific joshi.

          That's kobun showing there.

          If you've not had any exposure to bungo, reading or writing 16th C.
          Japanese won't make very much sense at all.

          Effingham
        • Kass McGann
          ... facial ... on ... headwear? ... about ... I personally have made a tsuboshozoku, commonly referred to as a bug hat . Basically it s a big basket-like hat
          Message 4 of 22 , Jul 5, 2000
          • 0 Attachment
            --- In sca-jml@egroups.com, "Anthony J. Bryant" <ajbryant@i...> wrote:
            > Mikazuchi Ukyo wrote:
            >
            > > With the summer months here now, and having suffered a nice
            facial
            > > sunburn from the East Kingdom War Camp day...anyone have any idea
            on
            > > where I can purchase, or preferably make some nice Japanese
            headwear?
            > > I have a late 16th century persona that is still being worked on
            > > heavily, but I'm dying for some shade. =)
            >
            > Well, some martial arts stores sell the conical straw hats. That's
            about
            > as close as you'll get this side of the pond. Unless you make a big
            > jingasa out of metal or leather and lacquer it all up.
            >
            > Effingham

            I personally have made a tsuboshozoku, commonly referred to as a "bug
            hat". Basically it's a big basket-like hat with a strange
            cylindrical protrusion at the center and "curtains" of silk gauze to
            keep the bugs (and the eyes of on-lookers) away. It ties onto the
            head in a way that makes it very stable. It's still rather heavy,
            however. But since I'm used to wearing all those Heian robes, I
            don't much mind a heavy hat.

            I highly recommend making one. Someone taught me how to basketweave
            and I made a reasonable replica on my first attempt.

            If you'd like to try it, email me privately and I'll give you some
            instruction. Or perhaps I'll see you at the next EK Warcamp in
            Eisental?

            Fujiwara no Aoi
          • Anthony J. Bryant
            My apologies for not getting back to you sooner! ... { snippage } ... Welcome to the madhouse. Pull up a zabuton, have some sake, and sit back for the ride.
            Message 5 of 22 , Jul 6, 2000
            • 0 Attachment
              My apologies for not getting back to you sooner!


              Eva Grammer wrote:

              > My name is Cynwise 誥 Sceaduwode. I am joining this list due to a nine-year-old's
              > insatiable curiousity for all things Japanese. She wants a Japanese persona in
              > the SCA.

              { snippage }

              > Therefore, I have joined this list to learn how Japanese is done in the SCA.

              Welcome to the madhouse. Pull up a zabuton, have some sake, and sit back for the
              ride.

              > We
              > have done some preliminary research, and while she is interested in the Heian
              > period, I have real reticence about all those robes, especially in Meridies summer
              > heat! (read: humidity, humidity, humidity!) She already has problems dealing
              > with the heat as it is.
              >

              Well, the japanese survived it... and in Kyoto. A more muggy and humidly icky place I
              have never visited. Actually, multi-layering of loose clothing is remarkably cool;
              more layers to catch a breeze or wick heat away or some such idea. I'm really not too
              clear on it.

              Fortunately, for kids, you don't have to deal with all those layers. If your computer
              can read JPEGs or GIFs, I can scan in and send you a couple of color photos of
              Heian-era girlchild garments. And they're really easy to make, too, being almost
              entirely composed of rectangles.

              It's possibly a bit beyond a nine-year-old, but you might want to get and read (if
              only for your own edification) a copy of Ivan Morris' "The World of the Shining
              Prince." It's starting to show its age (c. 30+ years) but it's still arguably the
              best popular look at Heian life and custom. It's in paperback, and you can get it
              from Amazon.com.

              >
              > Anyway, if any gentles on the list could give me an idea of "Japanese lite" for
              > my daughter, I'd really appreciate it. I sew marginally well, but have not tried
              > anything more complicated than a T-tunic yet. I would like to get info on a
              > period Japanese name for her, as well as some simple garb. And who knows, she
              > might like it enough that she continues with the Japanese persona for the rest of
              > her life, you never know.
              >

              You should also grab Compleat Anachronist #65, "A Japanese Miscellany" -- it's got a
              lot of basic info on doing Japanese in the SCA, including a section on naming
              patterns.

              Effingham
            • kujika@aol.com
              Solveig this is Kuji you where kind enuff to do Tea at my camp last year , I will have Igo at war
              Message 6 of 22 , Jul 7, 2000
              • 0 Attachment
                Solveig this is Kuji you where kind enuff to do Tea at my camp last year , I
                will have Igo at war
              • Kass McGann
                ... year , I ... Kuji! You unapologetic lurker! Fujiwara no Aoi
                Message 7 of 22 , Jul 7, 2000
                • 0 Attachment
                  --- In sca-jml@egroups.com, kujika@a... wrote:
                  > Solveig this is Kuji you where kind enuff to do Tea at my camp last
                  year , I
                  > will have Igo at war


                  Kuji! You unapologetic lurker!

                  <in a huff>
                  Fujiwara no Aoi
                Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.