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Re: [sl] Confirming Special Cosmic Substances (was Soul and Mortality)

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  • Dan Washburn
    ... Jesus - The poor will always be with you, and you can do good things for them anytime you like. ... I would like to point out that it didn t work. There
    Message 1 of 7 , Jul 1, 2002
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      "Stephen J." wrote:
      >
      > Dan,
      >
      > Indeed, "by their fruits shall ye know them" - the masons contribute so much to
      > charity to help perpetuate the (very strong) illusion that the human race must
      > always rely on money. The more they contribute, the more they force their ways
      > on those who do not know better.
      >
      Jesus - 'The poor will always be with you, and you can do
      good things for them anytime you like.'


      > I would like to point out, that at the onset of the original 'Christian'
      > church, which was started by the Jews, those belonging to the church (full
      > confirmed members) held all possessions in common, because they each had become
      > fully illumined by the light that shines within.
      >
      I would like to point out that it didn't work. There was a
      division between the Palestinian Jews and the Hellenistic
      Jews with the hellenists complaining that their widows and
      orphans weren't getting their fair share. They created a
      separate group of seven to administer to the needs of the
      hellenists.


      > Once this happens, everything else, kingdoms, realms, politics, money, becomes
      > as 'dust of the earth' - in fact, the early church used to have a 'collection
      > for the poor' which is still carried forward in the rituals of the catholic
      > church to day - the main difference being that in those days - ALL the money
      > was given away because within the church there is no measure - so the
      > collection for the poor was all moneys given to the poor - the 'poor' being all
      > those that had not yet come into the light of life.
      >
      > The human race will once again come into this understanding, all Moneys, all
      > material riches, all 'kingdoms' all 'rulers', politicians will come to naught -
      > when people awaken to the realisation that they have been duped - even those
      > perpetuating the system will voluntarily change their ways when they realise
      > the light - then, the 'greatest among you shall be your servant.' because the
      > 'servant,' is the one that connects to the waters of life and expresses it
      > though the spoken WORD.
      >
      Nice idea but it ain't going to happen soon. Give us
      another billion years of evolution and it might be possible.


      > For the light to shine brightly and illumine the whole world, one must dedicate
      > oneself to it wholly, completely and without doubt, then, "the sun shall rise"
      > in your heart and will never go out again.
      >
      > The children of the light transcend the duality of this world, that which
      > appears as 'good' and 'evil' but which is ALL darkness, until the light begins
      > to shine in the inner regions.
      >
      Scary. Being wholly dedicated, without doubt, to that which
      transcends good and evil. Sounds like a raving fanatic
      ready to throw over all ethical considerations for the sake
      of the TRUTH. Fire up the pyre, Torquemada!


      > The fruit of the spirit is Perfect health, LOVE, joy, No consciousness of
      > nationalities (in Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek) No division, no
      > problem that cannot be solved, because the values of the children of this
      > world, and the values of the Mind of Christ are worlds apart.
      >
      No consciousness of nationalities, huh. Remember the story
      of the syrophoenician woman. She asks Jesus to cast a demon
      out of her child and he replies - Nope, Let the children (of
      Israel) first be fed. She says Yes, but the dogs under the
      table eat of the children's scraps. He is amused by this,
      so he heals her child.


      > So while it appears that the 'masons' are 'doing good' they are perpetuating
      > the misery caused by creating a need and reliance on money, that imprisons the
      > majority of the race.

      You gotta be kidding, Stephen. I come to you, down to 98
      lbs from starvation, every rib showing on my nearly
      fleshless body, saying Please, give me some money so I can
      buy food, and you say, Nope, it would just perpetuate the
      misery of the world by creating a need and reliance on
      money.

      The good samaritan gave two dinarii to the innkeeper with
      whom he left the injured man. You sound like one of the
      priests that left the poor guy by the roadside.

      >
      > This is why Jesus drives the money changers out of the temple. The 'temple' is
      > your mind, the need to 'change money' is the belief that you need to take
      > divine ideas and translate them into monetary value before they can be of use
      > in this world.
      >
      > Whereas, Jesus speaks and it is so...

      Actually he spits in your eye before he heals it. See some
      of the miracle stories.


      >
      > Furthermore, the word Mason, originated from the knowledge that one shapes
      > one's life by the power of the spoken WORD, if the Masons were to remember
      > this, and put it into practice, there is no problem of sickness, disease, lack
      > of housing or any other humanitarian problem that we could not solve within
      > three years. (You must remember that the masons, and their ilk retain the
      > highest positions in the spurious world systems of today)
      >

      People of this ilk took my sister in law's child with cystic
      fibrosis into their Masonic hospital and treated him
      absolutely without cost until he died.

      Padre Pio, stigmatist, just the other day cannonized by the
      catholic church, built a free hospital for the poor.

      The shining of the light within leads to love of your
      neighbor whithout.

      Dan

      > Namaste
      >
      > Stephen J Serva Dei
      >
      > Dan Washburn wrote:
      >
      > > The traditional method is 'by their fruits you shall know
      > > them.' I don't know how reproducible it is, since there is
      > > some disagreement in what's good and what's bad. But if the
      > > teaching is leading to people loving eachother, smiling a
      > > lot, and helping eachother out in a spirit of genuine
      > > generosity, then i'd say the light is scintillating a bit.
      > >
      > > Hence I tend to think of locked door masonry as a source of
      > > light because there is so much good that they do in the
      > > world - about a million dollars a day for charity.
      > >
      > > Dan
      > >
      > > 333 wrote:
      > > >
      > > > 50020629 VII
      > > >
      > > > "Stephen J." <servadei@...>:
      > > > >>> The LIGHT does not shine behind locked doors.
      > > >
      > > > 333:
      > > > >> how were you able to determine this? as far as I know there is no
      > > > >> repeatable way to 'verify' "where the Light (/light/LIGHT/etc.)
      > > > >> shines["]. have you ascertained a reliable way? thanks.
      > > >
      > > > "Stephen J." <servadei@...>:
      > > > > YES! there is a reliable way.
      > > >
      > > > wonderful. I hope that I can come to understand it. I don't
      > > > yet understand how what you say below describes such a method.
      > > >
      > > > > The Light shines within you, but due to inherited beliefs
      > > > > and erroneous thought processes, the vast majority of people
      > > > > are not aware of it - ("the light shines in the darkness,
      > > > > but the darkness apprehended it not") - located in your heart
      > > > > is the most beautiful, most sublime, beauty, a beauty that
      > > > > words cannot describe. However, a separation exists in
      > > > > consciousness which you must learn to remove (rent the veil).
      > > >
      > > > so within us must not be "behind locked doors", ok. I'm still
      > > > not sure what method you're using that we could duplicate to
      > > > discern where this light does and does not shine.
      > > >
      > > > > I know that the light does not shine behind closed doors
      > > >
      > > > wait, I thought you said there was a means of determining this.
      > > > here you're just re-stating that you know it. I'm not really
      > > > questioning that part, only whether you can point to a way
      > > > that we can confirm your knowledge with our own senses.
      > > > otherwise, observation of said light is not be REPRODUCED.
      > > >
      > > > > because the light and truth are one, and the truth is for
      > > > > everyone. The moment you separate yourself from others
      > > > > through supposed knowledge, you cut yourself off from the very
      > > > > source of the light. (there is no division in light, and those
      > > > > that create division have no light).
      > > >
      > > > oh, I see. you're saying that *by definition* you have ascertained
      > > > it. I thought you'd figured out a way to peek behind all locked
      > > > doors to see if "the light" was shining. :>
      > > >
      > > > > This is exactly what 'secret society's do, they cut themselves
      > > > > off from the light, because their own motives deceive them.
      > > >
      > > > the problem with special substances and "light" which may be
      > > > perceivable only by a select few is that it may be used in a
      > > > way to dismiss whom the speaker biasedly opposes merely with
      > > > a contention about "where it shines".
      > > >
      > > > I'm not saying that you are doing this, only that it is
      > > > subject to abuse, and I'm asking you whether you've
      > > > discovered a method of identifying where this light is
      > > > shining and where it is not that WE can reproduce after
      > > > you, so as to verify your assertions. otherwise how would
      > > > we know whether you're one of those non-light-shining
      > > > folks who is merely posing as an authority?
      > > >
      > > > > If you are invited to join a 'secret society' avoid it as
      > > > > you would a very serious infectious disease, for they are
      > > > > blind guides, leading only the blind.
      > > >
      > > > I tend to agree.
      > > >
      > > > > Strong words I know, but then again, once you have tasted
      > > > > the light and drunk from the well of living water that
      > > > > flows from deep within, there is no man (or women) that
      > > > > can ever deceive you - regardless of what 'title' they use
      > > > > to try to get you to accept their authority.
      > > >
      > > > so are there 'light-meters' we might use, some kind of
      > > > mechanism like that which works for real visible physical photons?
      > > >
      > > > > (All authority is erroneous, we are ALL offspring of the
      > > > > Almighty and Everliving God and as soon as someone exhalts
      > > > > themselves and poses as an 'authority over others' you know
      > > > > that the light of life does not shine within them.)
      > > >
      > > > this sounds too subjective to be used with any regularity.
      > > > I mean, you sound to me like you are posing in your authority,
      > > > so by your standard I should consider that the "light of life"
      > > > does not shine within you. but I'd rather avoid presupposition
      > > > and get to the part where we observe the light ourselves
      > > > instead of just taking other people's word for where it shines.
      > > >
      > > > I'm asking whether there might be a REPRODUCEABLE means of
      > > > discerning where this light is and is not shining. i.e. a
      > > > method that will work for ANYONE that uses it and will yield
      > > > the correct results.
      > > >
      > > > thanks.
      > > >
      > > > 333
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      >
      >
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
    • 333
      ... any particular Gospels? there are numerous translations, scriptures, etc., etc. ... this sounds like a way to prejudice yourself into seeing light by
      Message 2 of 7 , Jul 5, 2002
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        "Stephen J." <servadei@...>:
        >>>>> The LIGHT does not shine behind locked doors.

        333:
        >>>> how were you able to determine this? as far as I know there is no
        >>>> repeatable way to 'verify' "where the Light (/light/LIGHT/etc.)
        >>>> shines["]. have you ascertained a reliable way? thanks.

        "Stephen J." <servadei@...>:
        >>> YES! there is a reliable way.

        "Stephen J." <servadei@...>:
        > ...the Gospels are the means through which anyone that is
        > sincere can begin to understand the method.

        any particular Gospels? there are numerous translations,
        scriptures, etc., etc.

        > The WAY is to first believe that the light exists as the REAL
        > part of you, from which you create all things, and then take
        > a consensus of your mind, of who you are at present, and then
        > to look deeper and see who you REALLY are in Spirit and begin
        > the work of shedding personal beliefs and of coming into an
        > understanding of Universal principles. As you discover the
        > principles live by them so that you and they become ONE.

        this sounds like a way to prejudice yourself into 'seeing light'
        by merely believing in it. how did you discern that this was
        reproduceable if there is so much contention amongst those who
        view the New Testament as such a handbook and ascertain that
        different people are wielders of the spiritual light, but who
        are quite at odds with the others who have 'special vision'?

        i.e. what gives you the impression that this method is
        reproduceable, considering the variation in the results?

        > I have discovered ... a method of experiencing the light, but it
        > is so far removed from the behaviour of today's modern world,

        'believe-it-and-it-will-be-so' seems completely compatible with
        today's world, very common I'd say. in the New Age crowd it is
        regularly used to dismiss those who have fallen upon challenges
        (because the victim can't 'believe themselves out of it'.

        > The question you raise about being a poser or not is the oldest
        > question relating to religion (connecting to the source) the
        > ONLY answer is this: IF YOU FOLLOW THE PRINCIPLES OUTLINED HERE
        > AND IN THE GOSPELS, YOU WILL KNOW FOR YOURSELF. UNDER NO
        > CIRCUMSTANCES MUST YOU ACCEPT ANY OTHER AUTHORITY - "YOU WILL
        > KNOW THE TRUTH, AND THE TRUTH WILL MAKE YOU FREE" (FROM ALL ERROR).=

        you're still not explaining why different people using the same
        instructions (your Gospels) aren't arriving at the same
        conclusions (i.e. the reproduceability seems to be faulty).

        > There is no other answer, all those that ask you to attend
        > 'their church' or join their 'secret society' - may up to
        > a point appear sincere, but the light does not shine within
        > them.

        I'm not sure why 'believe our book' is much different than these.

        > ... you are an immortal spirit in search of your source,
        > which unbeknown to you, you carry within you. The reason
        > people suffer is that each carries within them the patterns
        > of thought that allow the spirit to create suffering and
        > few are they who teach how we may all overcome all
        > suffering, sickness and death.

        there seem to be very very many of them, all of them getting
        sick, suffering in trials, getting ill, and dying.

        > The ONLY authority I claim is that I KNOW how to produce
        > the light and if anyone follows the principles,

        read your book, believe that it is true, then look and see it?
        I think I understand.

        > So called 'secret societies' and 'churches' do not know
        > HOW OTHERWISE THEY WOULD TEACH IT OPENLY AND would not
        > allow the policies to becoem more important than the
        > message...

        this sounds the same as what I'd said earlier about dividing
        up the world into "those who know" and "those who do not" and
        making it plain that the speaker is one of the elite who know.
        the perception of the special substances is almost always
        belief-based and falls along expected political lines (all the
        competitors don't have the Special Formula, the Right Relation
        to the God, the proper eyes that see, ears that hear, etc.).

        > ...those teaching about the light, HAVE NO LIGHT,

        you're teaching about it too.

        >> I'm asking whether there might be a REPRODUCEABLE means of
        >> discerning where this light is and is not shining. i.e. a
        >> method that will work for ANYONE that uses it and will yield
        >> the correct results.

        > ...accept the FACT that the light is shining within you
        > right now and IF you accept the undertaking to commit
        > yourself without ever returning to the process of
        > transformation, in that very moment, the living waters
        > will reveal themselves to you and lead you on the WAY
        > to experience the LIGHT.

        I have a difficult time accepting that anyone who shuts off
        their mind and just has faith that this light exists will be
        able to rationally discern between imagination and fact.

        I was asking for a way to refine our perceptors, rather than
        a way to convince ourselves to imagine the things you're
        describing. self-hypnosis works wonders to impede and colour
        perception. I don't see any difference between it and what
        you're suggesting ('close your mind and believe what I'm
        saying is true').

        if nothing else it is a good Christian conversion technique! :>
        get 'em yearning for special substances becoming available to
        their perception, prime them for it by telling them that if
        they believe the right things (about spirits, 'light', a god,
        etc., etc.), then they'll join the elite Light-Perceivers.

        thanks for explaining your method. no doubt by this method we
        could have all manner of fabulosity confirmed! ("close your
        mind and believe yourself to be rich beyond your wildest
        dreams!!").

        333
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