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Re: [rss-media] Re: HTML 5 video and mRSS 1.5 attribute

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  • Nilesh Gattani
    Hi Chris, Then may be something like
    Message 1 of 7 , Aug 30, 2009
      Hi Chris,

      Then may be something like

      <media:scenes>
      <media:scene>
      <sceneTitle> </sceneTitle>
      <sceneDescription> </sceneDescription>
      <sceneStartTime> </sceneStartTime>
      <sceneEndTime> </sceneEndTime>
      </media:scene>
      .
      .
      .
      <media:scenes>

      should work. What do you say?

      Thanks
      -Nilesh


      ------------------------------------------------------------------------
      *From:* chrisnew51 <chris@...>
      *To:* rss-media@yahoogroups.com
      *Sent:* Saturday, 29 August, 2009 6:07:25 AM
      *Subject:* [rss-media] Re: HTML 5 video and mRSS 1.5 <scene> attribute



      Hi Nilesh,

      >Defining a hierarchy of parent mRSS document of entire media - child
      mRSS documents of media objects of scenes in mRSS spec would be very
      complicated, and it might result in a lot of redundent information which
      may not be a good thing to have.

      Sure. Perhaps I was getting a little carried away...

      >On ther other hand, adding one flat <media:scenes> element to the
      existing spec is a good idea. But other than "start" and "end", I am
      quite unsure of what other properties this element should have.
      Actually, in my opinion, it would make more sense if the properties of
      this node are in accordance with HTML 5 video object.

      Great.

      In the UK a lot of full length TV programs are put online by the BBC for
      use with their iPlayer. I see HTML5 video as a move to make the browser
      itself a media player. If a content provider such as the BBC adopts
      HTML5 video I can imagine how an RSS feed like this:

      http://feeds. bbc.co.uk/ iplayer/highligh ts/tv
      <http://feeds.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/highlights/tv>

      ...could be presented by a browser plugin as a media stream comprised of
      all the media objects rather than a list of content because it is also a
      player. I think of mRSS for multiple purposes. Firstly it can be used to
      archive information about all of the programs. Secondly it can provide a
      standard list of new content additions. Thirdly a meta mRSS feed can be
      created which is essentially a playlist. The reason I need the
      <media:scenes> element is that I want the user to be able to pick and
      choose content from multiple programs to create a new meta mRSS feed
      which is used as a playlist to play an entirely new program sequence
      that is made up of scenes from all of the other programs.

      The flaw is that with a collection of scenes from different programs
      each whole video file will need to be downloaded to just watch an
      individual scene which is wasteful. However at least if <media:scenes>
      is in mRSS 1.5 I can ask questions about this on the relevant forums.

      On my previous post I don't actually need the HTML5 video tag to have
      start and end attributes as long as the mRSS document does have start
      and end because a browser plugin will drive the mRSS parsing and so
      control the video object directly which does contain the described
      playback position variable.

      >HTML 5 still seems to be in its evolution phase, so I would suggest
      let HTML5 become more widespread, so that we are fairly aware of all the
      properties of video object in HTML5, and then add it to the current mRSS
      spec.

      Specs tend to stay fixed for a relatively large period of time so I
      think if mRSS 1.5 doesn't include the <media:scenes> element there will
      be a long wait for the next one and then all of the following time to
      see if content providers adopt it. Firefox 3.5 already supports the
      HTML5 video object so if <media:scenes> is included in mRSS 1.5 I think
      I can do what I want just with title, description, start and end attributes.

      chris

      --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>,
      Nilesh Gattani <nilesh_gattani@ ...> wrote:
      >
      > Hi Chris,
      >
      > Thanks for your feedback.
      >
      > Defining a hierarchy of parent mRSS document of entire media - child
      mRSS documents of media objects of scenes in mRSS spec would be very
      complicated, and it might result in a lot of redundent information which
      may not be a good thing to have.
      >
      > On ther other hand, adding one flat <media:scenes> element to the
      existing spec is a good idea. But other than "start" and "end", I am
      quite unsure of what other properties this element should have.
      Actually, in my opinion, it would make more sense if the properties of
      this node are in accordance with HTML 5 video object. HTML 5 still seems
      to be in its evolution phase, so I would suggest let HTML5 become more
      widespread, so that we are fairly aware of all the properties of video
      object in HTML5, and then add it to the current mRSS spec.
      >
      > Let us know what do you think.
      >
      > Thanks
      > -Nilesh
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ____________ _________ _________ __
      > From: chrisnew51 <chris@...>
      > To: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Sunday, 23 August, 2009 7:18:22 AM
      > Subject: [rss-media] HTML 5 video and mRSS 1.5 <scene> attribute
      >
      >
      > Hi,
      > the HTML 5 video object includes the facility to set the current
      playback position:
      >
      > http://www.w3. org/TR/html5/ video.html# current-playback -position
      >
      > I can't find the optional start and end attributes in the spec that
      are indicated here:
      >
      > http://www.w3school s.com/tags/ html5_video. asp
      >
      > However, if the video tag does eventually include start and end
      attributes I'd really like a <scene> tag in mRSS to provide rich
      granular detail of the content. In this way each scene itself can be
      identified as a media object - maybe even a whole mRSS document for each
      scene within the parent mRSS document.
      >
      > I found a post from 2005 below that worries that this kind of thing
      adds additional complexity but I think the sub-document approach
      optionally enables flexibility.
      >
      > I see the 1.5 spec is in review so could this be considered? I'll
      research the HTML 5 video tag some more because I can't understand why
      start and end values aren't global attributes like width and height.
      >
      > chris
      >
      >
      > http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ rss-media/ message/680
      >
      > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com, "Patrick Schmitz" <cogit@> wrote:
      > >
      > > There are clipbegin and end mechanisms in many players, but I do not
      > > think you want to have player or media specific parameters in a general
      > > interchange format like this if you can avoid it. I think we can
      specify
      > > something quite simple that does the job. We're working on a proposal
      > > right now.
      > >
      > > Patrick
      > >
      > > -----Original Message-----
      > > From: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:rss- media@yahoogroup
      s.com] On
      > > Behalf Of David Hall
      > > Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 9:47 AM
      > > To: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com
      > > Subject: [rss-media] Re: indexing into media files? (resend)
      > >
      > >
      > > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com, "Patrick Schmitz" <cogit@l...>
      wrote:
      > > >
      > > > I think SMIL is much too heavyweight for what Rich (and many others)
      > > is
      > > > after. We should be able to describe temporal extents within
      MediaRSS,
      > > > IMO.
      > > >
      > > > See also http://www.id3. org/drafts/ id3v2_chapters- 2005101201.
      txt for
      > > > some related work at the ID3 header level.
      > > >
      > > > Patrick
      > >
      > > I wrote Rich off list, but isn't there a way for some of the various
      > > media types to directly specify where you want the content to start
      > > playing? I thought both Real and MS had such capabilities. Either url
      > > or playlist based? Then you'd treat the various segments just like any
      > > other media type within Media RSS.
      > >
      > > My fear is the opposite of yours - turning Media RSS into something
      > > much too heavyweight for the majority of users and needs.
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > See the Web's breaking stories, chosen by people like you. Check
      out Yahoo! Buzz. http://in.buzz. yahoo.com/ <http://in.buzz.yahoo.com/>
      >
    • chrisnew51
      Hi Nilesh, ... Looks good. Is it ok to include in mRSS 1.5 then? thanks chris
      Message 2 of 7 , Sep 1, 2009
        Hi Nilesh,

        > Then may be something like
        >
        > <media:scenes>
        > <media:scene>
        > <sceneTitle> </sceneTitle>
        > <sceneDescription> </sceneDescription>
        > <sceneStartTime> </sceneStartTime>
        > <sceneEndTime> </sceneEndTime>
        > </media:scene>
        > .
        > .
        > .
        > <media:scenes>
        >
        > should work. What do you say?

        Looks good. Is it ok to include in mRSS 1.5 then?

        thanks
        chris


        --- In rss-media@yahoogroups.com, Nilesh Gattani <nileshg@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi Chris,
        >
        > Then may be something like
        >
        > <media:scenes>
        > <media:scene>
        > <sceneTitle> </sceneTitle>
        > <sceneDescription> </sceneDescription>
        > <sceneStartTime> </sceneStartTime>
        > <sceneEndTime> </sceneEndTime>
        > </media:scene>
        > .
        > .
        > .
        > <media:scenes>
        >
        > should work. What do you say?
        >
        > Thanks
        > -Nilesh
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
        > *From:* chrisnew51 <chris@...>
        > *To:* rss-media@yahoogroups.com
        > *Sent:* Saturday, 29 August, 2009 6:07:25 AM
        > *Subject:* [rss-media] Re: HTML 5 video and mRSS 1.5 <scene> attribute
        >
        >
        >
        > Hi Nilesh,
        >
        > >Defining a hierarchy of parent mRSS document of entire media - child
        > mRSS documents of media objects of scenes in mRSS spec would be very
        > complicated, and it might result in a lot of redundent information which
        > may not be a good thing to have.
        >
        > Sure. Perhaps I was getting a little carried away...
        >
        > >On ther other hand, adding one flat <media:scenes> element to the
        > existing spec is a good idea. But other than "start" and "end", I am
        > quite unsure of what other properties this element should have.
        > Actually, in my opinion, it would make more sense if the properties of
        > this node are in accordance with HTML 5 video object.
        >
        > Great.
        >
        > In the UK a lot of full length TV programs are put online by the BBC for
        > use with their iPlayer. I see HTML5 video as a move to make the browser
        > itself a media player. If a content provider such as the BBC adopts
        > HTML5 video I can imagine how an RSS feed like this:
        >
        > http://feeds. bbc.co.uk/ iplayer/highligh ts/tv
        > <http://feeds.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/highlights/tv>
        >
        > ...could be presented by a browser plugin as a media stream comprised of
        > all the media objects rather than a list of content because it is also a
        > player. I think of mRSS for multiple purposes. Firstly it can be used to
        > archive information about all of the programs. Secondly it can provide a
        > standard list of new content additions. Thirdly a meta mRSS feed can be
        > created which is essentially a playlist. The reason I need the
        > <media:scenes> element is that I want the user to be able to pick and
        > choose content from multiple programs to create a new meta mRSS feed
        > which is used as a playlist to play an entirely new program sequence
        > that is made up of scenes from all of the other programs.
        >
        > The flaw is that with a collection of scenes from different programs
        > each whole video file will need to be downloaded to just watch an
        > individual scene which is wasteful. However at least if <media:scenes>
        > is in mRSS 1.5 I can ask questions about this on the relevant forums.
        >
        > On my previous post I don't actually need the HTML5 video tag to have
        > start and end attributes as long as the mRSS document does have start
        > and end because a browser plugin will drive the mRSS parsing and so
        > control the video object directly which does contain the described
        > playback position variable.
        >
        > >HTML 5 still seems to be in its evolution phase, so I would suggest
        > let HTML5 become more widespread, so that we are fairly aware of all the
        > properties of video object in HTML5, and then add it to the current mRSS
        > spec.
        >
        > Specs tend to stay fixed for a relatively large period of time so I
        > think if mRSS 1.5 doesn't include the <media:scenes> element there will
        > be a long wait for the next one and then all of the following time to
        > see if content providers adopt it. Firefox 3.5 already supports the
        > HTML5 video object so if <media:scenes> is included in mRSS 1.5 I think
        > I can do what I want just with title, description, start and end attributes.
        >
        > chris
        >
        > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>,
        > Nilesh Gattani <nilesh_gattani@ ...> wrote:
        > >
        > > Hi Chris,
        > >
        > > Thanks for your feedback.
        > >
        > > Defining a hierarchy of parent mRSS document of entire media - child
        > mRSS documents of media objects of scenes in mRSS spec would be very
        > complicated, and it might result in a lot of redundent information which
        > may not be a good thing to have.
        > >
        > > On ther other hand, adding one flat <media:scenes> element to the
        > existing spec is a good idea. But other than "start" and "end", I am
        > quite unsure of what other properties this element should have.
        > Actually, in my opinion, it would make more sense if the properties of
        > this node are in accordance with HTML 5 video object. HTML 5 still seems
        > to be in its evolution phase, so I would suggest let HTML5 become more
        > widespread, so that we are fairly aware of all the properties of video
        > object in HTML5, and then add it to the current mRSS spec.
        > >
        > > Let us know what do you think.
        > >
        > > Thanks
        > > -Nilesh
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > ____________ _________ _________ __
        > > From: chrisnew51 <chris@>
        > > To: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > Sent: Sunday, 23 August, 2009 7:18:22 AM
        > > Subject: [rss-media] HTML 5 video and mRSS 1.5 <scene> attribute
        > >
        > >
        > > Hi,
        > > the HTML 5 video object includes the facility to set the current
        > playback position:
        > >
        > > http://www.w3. org/TR/html5/ video.html# current-playback -position
        > >
        > > I can't find the optional start and end attributes in the spec that
        > are indicated here:
        > >
        > > http://www.w3school s.com/tags/ html5_video. asp
        > >
        > > However, if the video tag does eventually include start and end
        > attributes I'd really like a <scene> tag in mRSS to provide rich
        > granular detail of the content. In this way each scene itself can be
        > identified as a media object - maybe even a whole mRSS document for each
        > scene within the parent mRSS document.
        > >
        > > I found a post from 2005 below that worries that this kind of thing
        > adds additional complexity but I think the sub-document approach
        > optionally enables flexibility.
        > >
        > > I see the 1.5 spec is in review so could this be considered? I'll
        > research the HTML 5 video tag some more because I can't understand why
        > start and end values aren't global attributes like width and height.
        > >
        > > chris
        > >
        > >
        > > http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ rss-media/ message/680
        > >
        > > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com, "Patrick Schmitz" <cogit@> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > There are clipbegin and end mechanisms in many players, but I do not
        > > > think you want to have player or media specific parameters in a general
        > > > interchange format like this if you can avoid it. I think we can
        > specify
        > > > something quite simple that does the job. We're working on a proposal
        > > > right now.
        > > >
        > > > Patrick
        > > >
        > > > -----Original Message-----
        > > > From: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:rss- media@yahoogroup
        > s.com] On
        > > > Behalf Of David Hall
        > > > Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 9:47 AM
        > > > To: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com
        > > > Subject: [rss-media] Re: indexing into media files? (resend)
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com, "Patrick Schmitz" <cogit@l...>
        > wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > I think SMIL is much too heavyweight for what Rich (and many others)
        > > > is
        > > > > after. We should be able to describe temporal extents within
        > MediaRSS,
        > > > > IMO.
        > > > >
        > > > > See also http://www.id3. org/drafts/ id3v2_chapters- 2005101201.
        > txt for
        > > > > some related work at the ID3 header level.
        > > > >
        > > > > Patrick
        > > >
        > > > I wrote Rich off list, but isn't there a way for some of the various
        > > > media types to directly specify where you want the content to start
        > > > playing? I thought both Real and MS had such capabilities. Either url
        > > > or playlist based? Then you'd treat the various segments just like any
        > > > other media type within Media RSS.
        > > >
        > > > My fear is the opposite of yours - turning Media RSS into something
        > > > much too heavyweight for the majority of users and needs.
        > > >
        > > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > See the Web's breaking stories, chosen by people like you. Check
        > out Yahoo! Buzz. http://in.buzz. yahoo.com/ <http://in.buzz.yahoo.com/>
        > >
        >
      • Nilesh Gattani
        Yes. Check http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/rss-media/files/mrss-1.5.0.html . Thanks -Nilesh
        Message 3 of 7 , Sep 1, 2009
          Yes. Check
          http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/rss-media/files/mrss-1.5.0.html .

          Thanks
          -Nilesh
          <http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/0PudSt9hlMEsOn5PB7gA9EtBLKca1GMmxz_7lJ22TfpGBVnZ1R_Svd6P2hOnagF7leAHO0fdu0dBcAprm3y_wg/mrss-1.5.0.html>
          chrisnew51 wrote:
          >
          >
          > Hi Nilesh,
          >
          > > Then may be something like
          > >
          > > <media:scenes>
          > > <media:scene>
          > > <sceneTitle> </sceneTitle>
          > > <sceneDescription> </sceneDescription>
          > > <sceneStartTime> </sceneStartTime>
          > > <sceneEndTime> </sceneEndTime>
          > > </media:scene>
          > > .
          > > .
          > > .
          > > <media:scenes>
          > >
          > > should work. What do you say?
          >
          > Looks good. Is it ok to include in mRSS 1.5 then?
          >
          > thanks
          > chris
          >
          > --- In rss-media@yahoogroups.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>,
          > Nilesh Gattani <nileshg@...> wrote:
          > >
          > > Hi Chris,
          > >
          > > Then may be something like
          > >
          > > <media:scenes>
          > > <media:scene>
          > > <sceneTitle> </sceneTitle>
          > > <sceneDescription> </sceneDescription>
          > > <sceneStartTime> </sceneStartTime>
          > > <sceneEndTime> </sceneEndTime>
          > > </media:scene>
          > > .
          > > .
          > > .
          > > <media:scenes>
          > >
          > > should work. What do you say?
          > >
          > > Thanks
          > > -Nilesh
          > >
          > >
          > > ----------------------------------------------------------
          > > *From:* chrisnew51 <chris@...>
          > > *To:* rss-media@yahoogroups.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>
          > > *Sent:* Saturday, 29 August, 2009 6:07:25 AM
          > > *Subject:* [rss-media] Re: HTML 5 video and mRSS 1.5 <scene> attribute
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Hi Nilesh,
          > >
          > > >Defining a hierarchy of parent mRSS document of entire media - child
          > > mRSS documents of media objects of scenes in mRSS spec would be very
          > > complicated, and it might result in a lot of redundent information
          > which
          > > may not be a good thing to have.
          > >
          > > Sure. Perhaps I was getting a little carried away...
          > >
          > > >On ther other hand, adding one flat <media:scenes> element to the
          > > existing spec is a good idea. But other than "start" and "end", I am
          > > quite unsure of what other properties this element should have.
          > > Actually, in my opinion, it would make more sense if the properties of
          > > this node are in accordance with HTML 5 video object.
          > >
          > > Great.
          > >
          > > In the UK a lot of full length TV programs are put online by the BBC
          > for
          > > use with their iPlayer. I see HTML5 video as a move to make the browser
          > > itself a media player. If a content provider such as the BBC adopts
          > > HTML5 video I can imagine how an RSS feed like this:
          > >
          > > http://feeds. bbc.co.uk/ iplayer/highligh ts/tv
          > > <http://feeds.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/highlights/tv
          > <http://feeds.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/highlights/tv>>
          > >
          > > ...could be presented by a browser plugin as a media stream
          > comprised of
          > > all the media objects rather than a list of content because it is
          > also a
          > > player. I think of mRSS for multiple purposes. Firstly it can be
          > used to
          > > archive information about all of the programs. Secondly it can
          > provide a
          > > standard list of new content additions. Thirdly a meta mRSS feed can be
          > > created which is essentially a playlist. The reason I need the
          > > <media:scenes> element is that I want the user to be able to pick and
          > > choose content from multiple programs to create a new meta mRSS feed
          > > which is used as a playlist to play an entirely new program sequence
          > > that is made up of scenes from all of the other programs.
          > >
          > > The flaw is that with a collection of scenes from different programs
          > > each whole video file will need to be downloaded to just watch an
          > > individual scene which is wasteful. However at least if <media:scenes>
          > > is in mRSS 1.5 I can ask questions about this on the relevant forums.
          > >
          > > On my previous post I don't actually need the HTML5 video tag to have
          > > start and end attributes as long as the mRSS document does have start
          > > and end because a browser plugin will drive the mRSS parsing and so
          > > control the video object directly which does contain the described
          > > playback position variable.
          > >
          > > >HTML 5 still seems to be in its evolution phase, so I would suggest
          > > let HTML5 become more widespread, so that we are fairly aware of all
          > the
          > > properties of video object in HTML5, and then add it to the current
          > mRSS
          > > spec.
          > >
          > > Specs tend to stay fixed for a relatively large period of time so I
          > > think if mRSS 1.5 doesn't include the <media:scenes> element there will
          > > be a long wait for the next one and then all of the following time to
          > > see if content providers adopt it. Firefox 3.5 already supports the
          > > HTML5 video object so if <media:scenes> is included in mRSS 1.5 I think
          > > I can do what I want just with title, description, start and end
          > attributes.
          > >
          > > chris
          > >
          > > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>,
          > > Nilesh Gattani <nilesh_gattani@ ...> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > Hi Chris,
          > > >
          > > > Thanks for your feedback.
          > > >
          > > > Defining a hierarchy of parent mRSS document of entire media - child
          > > mRSS documents of media objects of scenes in mRSS spec would be very
          > > complicated, and it might result in a lot of redundent information
          > which
          > > may not be a good thing to have.
          > > >
          > > > On ther other hand, adding one flat <media:scenes> element to the
          > > existing spec is a good idea. But other than "start" and "end", I am
          > > quite unsure of what other properties this element should have.
          > > Actually, in my opinion, it would make more sense if the properties of
          > > this node are in accordance with HTML 5 video object. HTML 5 still
          > seems
          > > to be in its evolution phase, so I would suggest let HTML5 become more
          > > widespread, so that we are fairly aware of all the properties of video
          > > object in HTML5, and then add it to the current mRSS spec.
          > > >
          > > > Let us know what do you think.
          > > >
          > > > Thanks
          > > > -Nilesh
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > ____________ _________ _________ __
          > > > From: chrisnew51 <chris@>
          > > > To: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>
          > > > Sent: Sunday, 23 August, 2009 7:18:22 AM
          > > > Subject: [rss-media] HTML 5 video and mRSS 1.5 <scene> attribute
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > Hi,
          > > > the HTML 5 video object includes the facility to set the current
          > > playback position:
          > > >
          > > > http://www.w3. org/TR/html5/ video.html# current-playback -position
          > > >
          > > > I can't find the optional start and end attributes in the spec that
          > > are indicated here:
          > > >
          > > > http://www.w3school s.com/tags/ html5_video. asp
          > > >
          > > > However, if the video tag does eventually include start and end
          > > attributes I'd really like a <scene> tag in mRSS to provide rich
          > > granular detail of the content. In this way each scene itself can be
          > > identified as a media object - maybe even a whole mRSS document for
          > each
          > > scene within the parent mRSS document.
          > > >
          > > > I found a post from 2005 below that worries that this kind of thing
          > > adds additional complexity but I think the sub-document approach
          > > optionally enables flexibility.
          > > >
          > > > I see the 1.5 spec is in review so could this be considered? I'll
          > > research the HTML 5 video tag some more because I can't understand why
          > > start and end values aren't global attributes like width and height.
          > > >
          > > > chris
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ rss-media/ message/680
          > > >
          > > > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com, "Patrick Schmitz" <cogit@> wrote:
          > > > >
          > > > > There are clipbegin and end mechanisms in many players, but I do not
          > > > > think you want to have player or media specific parameters in a
          > general
          > > > > interchange format like this if you can avoid it. I think we can
          > > specify
          > > > > something quite simple that does the job. We're working on a
          > proposal
          > > > > right now.
          > > > >
          > > > > Patrick
          > > > >
          > > > > -----Original Message-----
          > > > > From: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:rss- media@yahoogroup
          > > s.com] On
          > > > > Behalf Of David Hall
          > > > > Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 9:47 AM
          > > > > To: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com
          > > > > Subject: [rss-media] Re: indexing into media files? (resend)
          > > > >
          > > > >
          > > > > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com, "Patrick Schmitz" <cogit@l...>
          > > wrote:
          > > > > >
          > > > > > I think SMIL is much too heavyweight for what Rich (and many
          > others)
          > > > > is
          > > > > > after. We should be able to describe temporal extents within
          > > MediaRSS,
          > > > > > IMO.
          > > > > >
          > > > > > See also http://www.id3. org/drafts/ id3v2_chapters- 2005101201.
          > > txt for
          > > > > > some related work at the ID3 header level.
          > > > > >
          > > > > > Patrick
          > > > >
          > > > > I wrote Rich off list, but isn't there a way for some of the various
          > > > > media types to directly specify where you want the content to start
          > > > > playing? I thought both Real and MS had such capabilities.
          > Either url
          > > > > or playlist based? Then you'd treat the various segments just
          > like any
          > > > > other media type within Media RSS.
          > > > >
          > > > > My fear is the opposite of yours - turning Media RSS into something
          > > > > much too heavyweight for the majority of users and needs.
          > > > >
          > > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > See the Web's breaking stories, chosen by people like you. Check
          > > out Yahoo! Buzz. http://in.buzz. yahoo.com/
          > <http://in.buzz.yahoo.com/ <http://in.buzz.yahoo.com/>>
          > > >
          > >
          >
          >
        • chrisnew51
          Awesome! thanks chris
          Message 4 of 7 , Sep 3, 2009
            Awesome!

            thanks
            chris

            --- In rss-media@yahoogroups.com, Nilesh Gattani <nileshg@...> wrote:
            >
            > Yes. Check
            > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/rss-media/files/mrss-1.5.0.html .
            >
            > Thanks
            > -Nilesh
            > <http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/0PudSt9hlMEsOn5PB7gA9EtBLKca1GMmxz_7lJ22TfpGBVnZ1R_Svd6P2hOnagF7leAHO0fdu0dBcAprm3y_wg/mrss-1.5.0.html>
            > chrisnew51 wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > > Hi Nilesh,
            > >
            > > > Then may be something like
            > > >
            > > > <media:scenes>
            > > > <media:scene>
            > > > <sceneTitle> </sceneTitle>
            > > > <sceneDescription> </sceneDescription>
            > > > <sceneStartTime> </sceneStartTime>
            > > > <sceneEndTime> </sceneEndTime>
            > > > </media:scene>
            > > > .
            > > > .
            > > > .
            > > > <media:scenes>
            > > >
            > > > should work. What do you say?
            > >
            > > Looks good. Is it ok to include in mRSS 1.5 then?
            > >
            > > thanks
            > > chris
            > >
            > > --- In rss-media@yahoogroups.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>,
            > > Nilesh Gattani <nileshg@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Hi Chris,
            > > >
            > > > Then may be something like
            > > >
            > > > <media:scenes>
            > > > <media:scene>
            > > > <sceneTitle> </sceneTitle>
            > > > <sceneDescription> </sceneDescription>
            > > > <sceneStartTime> </sceneStartTime>
            > > > <sceneEndTime> </sceneEndTime>
            > > > </media:scene>
            > > > .
            > > > .
            > > > .
            > > > <media:scenes>
            > > >
            > > > should work. What do you say?
            > > >
            > > > Thanks
            > > > -Nilesh
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > ----------------------------------------------------------
            > > > *From:* chrisnew51 <chris@>
            > > > *To:* rss-media@yahoogroups.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>
            > > > *Sent:* Saturday, 29 August, 2009 6:07:25 AM
            > > > *Subject:* [rss-media] Re: HTML 5 video and mRSS 1.5 <scene> attribute
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > Hi Nilesh,
            > > >
            > > > >Defining a hierarchy of parent mRSS document of entire media - child
            > > > mRSS documents of media objects of scenes in mRSS spec would be very
            > > > complicated, and it might result in a lot of redundent information
            > > which
            > > > may not be a good thing to have.
            > > >
            > > > Sure. Perhaps I was getting a little carried away...
            > > >
            > > > >On ther other hand, adding one flat <media:scenes> element to the
            > > > existing spec is a good idea. But other than "start" and "end", I am
            > > > quite unsure of what other properties this element should have.
            > > > Actually, in my opinion, it would make more sense if the properties of
            > > > this node are in accordance with HTML 5 video object.
            > > >
            > > > Great.
            > > >
            > > > In the UK a lot of full length TV programs are put online by the BBC
            > > for
            > > > use with their iPlayer. I see HTML5 video as a move to make the browser
            > > > itself a media player. If a content provider such as the BBC adopts
            > > > HTML5 video I can imagine how an RSS feed like this:
            > > >
            > > > http://feeds. bbc.co.uk/ iplayer/highligh ts/tv
            > > > <http://feeds.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/highlights/tv
            > > <http://feeds.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/highlights/tv>>
            > > >
            > > > ...could be presented by a browser plugin as a media stream
            > > comprised of
            > > > all the media objects rather than a list of content because it is
            > > also a
            > > > player. I think of mRSS for multiple purposes. Firstly it can be
            > > used to
            > > > archive information about all of the programs. Secondly it can
            > > provide a
            > > > standard list of new content additions. Thirdly a meta mRSS feed can be
            > > > created which is essentially a playlist. The reason I need the
            > > > <media:scenes> element is that I want the user to be able to pick and
            > > > choose content from multiple programs to create a new meta mRSS feed
            > > > which is used as a playlist to play an entirely new program sequence
            > > > that is made up of scenes from all of the other programs.
            > > >
            > > > The flaw is that with a collection of scenes from different programs
            > > > each whole video file will need to be downloaded to just watch an
            > > > individual scene which is wasteful. However at least if <media:scenes>
            > > > is in mRSS 1.5 I can ask questions about this on the relevant forums.
            > > >
            > > > On my previous post I don't actually need the HTML5 video tag to have
            > > > start and end attributes as long as the mRSS document does have start
            > > > and end because a browser plugin will drive the mRSS parsing and so
            > > > control the video object directly which does contain the described
            > > > playback position variable.
            > > >
            > > > >HTML 5 still seems to be in its evolution phase, so I would suggest
            > > > let HTML5 become more widespread, so that we are fairly aware of all
            > > the
            > > > properties of video object in HTML5, and then add it to the current
            > > mRSS
            > > > spec.
            > > >
            > > > Specs tend to stay fixed for a relatively large period of time so I
            > > > think if mRSS 1.5 doesn't include the <media:scenes> element there will
            > > > be a long wait for the next one and then all of the following time to
            > > > see if content providers adopt it. Firefox 3.5 already supports the
            > > > HTML5 video object so if <media:scenes> is included in mRSS 1.5 I think
            > > > I can do what I want just with title, description, start and end
            > > attributes.
            > > >
            > > > chris
            > > >
            > > > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>,
            > > > Nilesh Gattani <nilesh_gattani@ ...> wrote:
            > > > >
            > > > > Hi Chris,
            > > > >
            > > > > Thanks for your feedback.
            > > > >
            > > > > Defining a hierarchy of parent mRSS document of entire media - child
            > > > mRSS documents of media objects of scenes in mRSS spec would be very
            > > > complicated, and it might result in a lot of redundent information
            > > which
            > > > may not be a good thing to have.
            > > > >
            > > > > On ther other hand, adding one flat <media:scenes> element to the
            > > > existing spec is a good idea. But other than "start" and "end", I am
            > > > quite unsure of what other properties this element should have.
            > > > Actually, in my opinion, it would make more sense if the properties of
            > > > this node are in accordance with HTML 5 video object. HTML 5 still
            > > seems
            > > > to be in its evolution phase, so I would suggest let HTML5 become more
            > > > widespread, so that we are fairly aware of all the properties of video
            > > > object in HTML5, and then add it to the current mRSS spec.
            > > > >
            > > > > Let us know what do you think.
            > > > >
            > > > > Thanks
            > > > > -Nilesh
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __
            > > > > From: chrisnew51 <chris@>
            > > > > To: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com <mailto:rss-media%40yahoogroups.com>
            > > > > Sent: Sunday, 23 August, 2009 7:18:22 AM
            > > > > Subject: [rss-media] HTML 5 video and mRSS 1.5 <scene> attribute
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > Hi,
            > > > > the HTML 5 video object includes the facility to set the current
            > > > playback position:
            > > > >
            > > > > http://www.w3. org/TR/html5/ video.html# current-playback -position
            > > > >
            > > > > I can't find the optional start and end attributes in the spec that
            > > > are indicated here:
            > > > >
            > > > > http://www.w3school s.com/tags/ html5_video. asp
            > > > >
            > > > > However, if the video tag does eventually include start and end
            > > > attributes I'd really like a <scene> tag in mRSS to provide rich
            > > > granular detail of the content. In this way each scene itself can be
            > > > identified as a media object - maybe even a whole mRSS document for
            > > each
            > > > scene within the parent mRSS document.
            > > > >
            > > > > I found a post from 2005 below that worries that this kind of thing
            > > > adds additional complexity but I think the sub-document approach
            > > > optionally enables flexibility.
            > > > >
            > > > > I see the 1.5 spec is in review so could this be considered? I'll
            > > > research the HTML 5 video tag some more because I can't understand why
            > > > start and end values aren't global attributes like width and height.
            > > > >
            > > > > chris
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ rss-media/ message/680
            > > > >
            > > > > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com, "Patrick Schmitz" <cogit@> wrote:
            > > > > >
            > > > > > There are clipbegin and end mechanisms in many players, but I do not
            > > > > > think you want to have player or media specific parameters in a
            > > general
            > > > > > interchange format like this if you can avoid it. I think we can
            > > > specify
            > > > > > something quite simple that does the job. We're working on a
            > > proposal
            > > > > > right now.
            > > > > >
            > > > > > Patrick
            > > > > >
            > > > > > -----Original Message-----
            > > > > > From: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:rss- media@yahoogroup
            > > > s.com] On
            > > > > > Behalf Of David Hall
            > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 9:47 AM
            > > > > > To: rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com
            > > > > > Subject: [rss-media] Re: indexing into media files? (resend)
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > > --- In rss-media@yahoogrou ps.com, "Patrick Schmitz" <cogit@l...>
            > > > wrote:
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > > I think SMIL is much too heavyweight for what Rich (and many
            > > others)
            > > > > > is
            > > > > > > after. We should be able to describe temporal extents within
            > > > MediaRSS,
            > > > > > > IMO.
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > > See also http://www.id3. org/drafts/ id3v2_chapters- 2005101201.
            > > > txt for
            > > > > > > some related work at the ID3 header level.
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > > Patrick
            > > > > >
            > > > > > I wrote Rich off list, but isn't there a way for some of the various
            > > > > > media types to directly specify where you want the content to start
            > > > > > playing? I thought both Real and MS had such capabilities.
            > > Either url
            > > > > > or playlist based? Then you'd treat the various segments just
            > > like any
            > > > > > other media type within Media RSS.
            > > > > >
            > > > > > My fear is the opposite of yours - turning Media RSS into something
            > > > > > much too heavyweight for the majority of users and needs.
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > See the Web's breaking stories, chosen by people like you. Check
            > > > out Yahoo! Buzz. http://in.buzz. yahoo.com/
            > > <http://in.buzz.yahoo.com/ <http://in.buzz.yahoo.com/>>
            > > > >
            > > >
            > >
            > >
            >
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