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RE: [rootsradicals] Can you attach an Xtracycle to a single-speed cruiser bicycle?

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  • Leifert, Jesse - BLS
    One thing with a coaster brake is that if you drop the chain, you aint stoppin (especially with a heavy load)...so be careful when you install it. :)
    Message 1 of 20 , Jan 22, 2007
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      One thing with a coaster brake is that if you drop the chain, you aint stoppin (especially with a heavy load)...so be careful when you install it.  :)


      From: rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com [mailto:rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gary green
      Sent: Friday, January 19, 2007 7:19 PM
      To: rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [rootsradicals] Can you attach an Xtracycle to a single-speed cruiser bicycle?

      Hello,

      I own a 26" wheel Trek beach cruiser bike with a single-speed gear and
      coaster brake like thousands of other typical beach cruisers with no
      derailleur or internal hub setup.

      My question is: Will the 26" model Xtracycle attach to the rear axle
      holders (dropouts?) OK?

      I want to purchase one for my Trek cruiser and Xtracycle is closed now
      for the weekend so i was hoping someone could give me an accurate
      answer about this question. Thanks. gary

    • messtime
      Thanks Ray for your help. Problem is solved. I will use my Giant Cypress ST for adaptation to the Xtracycle. I will buy a 700c size from Xtracycle and use
      Message 2 of 20 , Jan 22, 2007
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        Thanks Ray for your help.
         
        Problem is solved.  I will use my Giant Cypress ST for adaptation to the Xtracycle.   I will buy a 700c size from Xtracycle and use that.  I love the 700c size wheel.  I use my hybrid for hauling anyway.  I will make it a dedicated hauling bicycle.  The only thing i am presently concerned about is the kickstand plate area which is not standard as you might find on most other bikes.  The Giant Cypress ST is in my opinion a low cost minimal bicycle.  But i like it anyway. 
         
        Thanks for mentioning braking problem with my cruiser bike.  If i had decided to use that bike i was thinking of buying the additional rear brake kit (v-brakes) to supplement the coaster brake.
         
        I will not use my beach cruiser for use with the Xtracycle. 
         
        Thanks for the picture of your bicycle - the Avanti.
         
        Sincerely,  gary
         
         


         
        On 1/22/07, Cathode Ray <ray@...> wrote:

        At 12:18 PM -0800 20/1/07, messtime wrote:
        >I just measured my Trek cruiser and the inside o.l.d. seems to be
        >110mm with about a 4mm dropout thickness.
        >
        >And my other bike (giant cypress st 700c wheel) has a o.l.d. of
        >135mm with dropouts 6mm thick

        Which bike do you use more? I would recommend fitting the Xtracycle
        to the bike you use most often.

        The dimensions of the cruiser are not an ideal fit for the Xtracycle.
        The frame would have to be spread to fit.

        I did a web search and saw a pic of the Giant Cypress. The geometry
        looks quite similar to my Avanti Explorer 700c. I installed a 26"
        xtracycle on my 700c because I wanted more choice of tire on the
        back. At present I use a fat slick. The 700c front gives a very good
        ride.

        I have been using the Xtracycle for more than a year now and it has
        been truly revolutionary to my lifestyle. Here's a pic with one of
        the freeloaders removed:

        http://www.retrovox.com.au/hpv/images/xcycle_1.jpg

        Hope this helps

        ray




        --
        GARY GREEN
        1301-B NORTHCREST DR #105
        CRESCENT CITY  CA   95531
        707-464-4113 RM 35

        Websites:
        www.bicycleandbeach.com
        www.shedandshelter.com
      • Cathode Ray
        ... The Xtracycle freeradical kit comes with a kickstand, although I d prefer a centre stand. Normal stands that mount between the chainstays won t fit because
        Message 3 of 20 , Jan 22, 2007
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          At 8:21 AM -0800 22/1/07, messtime wrote:
          >I will buy a 700c size from Xtracycle and use that. I love the 700c
          >size wheel. I use my hybrid for hauling anyway. I will make it a
          >dedicated hauling bicycle. The only thing i am presently concerned
          >about is the kickstand plate area which is not standard as you might
          >find on most other bikes

          The Xtracycle freeradical kit comes with a kickstand, although I'd
          prefer a centre stand. Normal stands that mount between the
          chainstays won't fit because the xtracycle uses that space. Other
          stand options are available.

          The only difference between the 700c and 26" xtracycle kits is the
          position of the V-brake mounts. A 26" wheel with disc brakes can be
          used with a 700c xtracycle. I started with a 700c xtracycle, but
          found that tire choice was limited. The maximum 700c tire size that
          will fit is 38mm. I found that this wasn't enough air or rubber for
          carrying big loads, and was very bumpy for any passengers. A fat back
          tire is the only way to get any kind of suspension on the rear.

          I tried a number of different 26" slicks on the rear and settled on a
          2" slick. Recommended pressure is 35-65 lbs. At maximum pressure the
          actual contact area with the pavement is a centre strip about 20mm
          wide. and rolling resistance is very low, probably lower than a 700c
          x 35. When my back tire need replacing I want to try Maxxis Hookworm

          The slicks are not a true slick, they do have some tread, I think it
          is called inverse tread (holes instead of bumps). Forget about those
          ridiculous knobby tires that are fitted to most 26" bikes.

          ray
        • Devian Gilbert
          I ve been using my Cdale F900 MTB as my Xtra convert. currently it has a set of MAVIC Speedcity 700c wheels with Kenda Kwik CX 35c tyres on it and 203mm rotors
          Message 4 of 20 , Jan 22, 2007
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            I've been using my Cdale F900 MTB as my Xtra convert.
            currently it has a set of MAVIC Speedcity 700c wheels with Kenda Kwik CX 35c tyres on it and 203mm rotors with Avid Mechs
            i really dig the MAVIC MP3 program, which is basically "taco wheel" insurance.

            on the note of Hookworms...
            uhh....
            i WAS running a set of UST tyres on my Salsa
            then loaded it up with Oldman Mountain racks, front and rear, panniers...
            went for a 2-3 day trip road/dirt...
            what happened was...
            the rear tyre started to blister...
            the tread actually started to separate from the carcass...
            i ended up putting it on the front, as the front has less weight...and limping home some +60 miles.
            pumping the tyre every 30minutes or so.

            on that note...im not a big fan of Hookworms
            i had thought they'd be awesome tyres...but not.

            as for passenger comfort...
            how about simply a foam pad to sit on?
            or how crazy over kill/pimp my ride would it be to have the deck upholstered?

            peace...d

            "Every time I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the human race." H.G. Wells
            http://www.mac.com/asanacycles

            On Jan 22, 2007, at 2:45 PM, Cathode Ray wrote:

            At 8:21 AM -0800 22/1/07, messtime wrote:
            >I will buy a 700c size from Xtracycle and use that. I love the 700c
            >size wheel. I use my hybrid for hauling anyway. I will make it a
            >dedicated hauling bicycle. The only thing i am presently concerned
            >about is the kickstand plate area which is not standard as you might
            >find on most other bikes

            The Xtracycle freeradical kit comes with a kickstand, although I'd
            prefer a centre stand. Normal stands that mount between the
            chainstays won't fit because the xtracycle uses that space. Other
            stand options are available.

            The only difference between the 700c and 26" xtracycle kits is the
            position of the V-brake mounts. A 26" wheel with disc brakes can be
            used with a 700c xtracycle. I started with a 700c xtracycle, but
            found that tire choice was limited. The maximum 700c tire size that
            will fit is 38mm. I found that this wasn't enough air or rubber for
            carrying big loads, and was very bumpy for any passengers. A fat back
            tire is the only way to get any kind of suspension on the rear.

            I tried a number of different 26" slicks on the rear and settled on a
            2" slick. Recommended pressure is 35-65 lbs. At maximum pressure the
            actual contact area with the pavement is a centre strip about 20mm
            wide. and rolling resistance is very low, probably lower than a 700c
            x 35. When my back tire need replacing I want to try Maxxis Hookworm

            The slicks are not a true slick, they do have some tread, I think it
            is called inverse tread (holes instead of bumps). Forget about those
            ridiculous knobby tires that are fitted to most 26" bikes.

            ray


          • messtime
            Dear Ray, I mentioned the kick stand area because it is my understanding that it is the area where the tongue of the Xtracycle is attached and my bike does not
            Message 5 of 20 , Jan 22, 2007
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              Dear Ray,
               
              I mentioned the kick stand area because it is my understanding that it is the area where the tongue of the Xtracycle is attached and my bike does not have an open hole in the top of the tube for a bolt to go through.  "Laughter" (name of customer service lady) at Xtracycle suggested i drill a hole into the tube to allow the bolt which secures the tongue to the frame to pass through.  
               
              Anyway i have already ordered the 700c Xtracycle, but i might be able to change the order to a 26" tire size if i hurry.
               
              Would you agree that buying a 700c Xtracycle gives you the option of use with both a 700c and a 26" size tire if i decided to use the Xtracycle with a 26" tire bicycle equipped with a disc brake?  
               
              Meaning you can go down in size but not up in size?
               
              Can you use a 26" Xtracycle with a 700c wheel?  I guess you would not be able to use v-brakes at all and maybe you can install a disc brake onto the 700c wheel?   
               
              I will be using a "snap deck" on the Xtracycle. 
               
              As for 26" tires i like the:
               
              Ritcheylogic  MOBY-BITE 26"x2.1" (Fat Slick Tires) These tires are really big!
              Item Specifications
              Tire BeadSteel
              ISO Diameter559
              ISO Width53 mm
              Color Tread/SideBlack/Black
              Tire TypeClincher
              Tire Diameter26"
              Tire UseRoad
              Weight620 g
              PSI45-60 PSI
               
              I do not like knobby tires either.  I do not understand how people can do any street riding with them - i tried it once and could not stand the vibration.
               
              I will look at the Maxxis Hookworm.
               
              Thanks again Ray for the help and education.  Much appreciated.  I will probably be working on the Xtracycle project for awhile.  gary


               
              On 1/22/07, Cathode Ray <ray@...> wrote:

              At 8:21 AM -0800 22/1/07, messtime wrote:
              >I will buy a 700c size from Xtracycle and use that. I love the 700c
              >size wheel. I use my hybrid for hauling anyway. I will make it a
              >dedicated hauling bicycle. The only thing i am presently concerned
              >about is the kickstand plate area which is not standard as you might
              >find on most other bikes

              The Xtracycle freeradical kit comes with a kickstand, although I'd
              prefer a centre stand. Normal stands that mount between the
              chainstays won't fit because the xtracycle uses that space. Other
              stand options are available.

              The only difference between the 700c and 26" xtracycle kits is the
              position of the V-brake mounts. A 26" wheel with disc brakes can be
              used with a 700c xtracycle. I started with a 700c xtracycle, but
              found that tire choice was limited. The maximum 700c tire size that
              will fit is 38mm. I found that this wasn't enough air or rubber for
              carrying big loads, and was very bumpy for any passengers. A fat back
              tire is the only way to get any kind of suspension on the rear.

              I tried a number of different 26" slicks on the rear and settled on a
              2" slick. Recommended pressure is 35-65 lbs. At maximum pressure the
              actual contact area with the pavement is a centre strip about 20mm
              wide. and rolling resistance is very low, probably lower than a 700c
              x 35. When my back tire need replacing I want to try Maxxis Hookworm

              The slicks are not a true slick, they do have some tread, I think it
              is called inverse tread (holes instead of bumps). Forget about those
              ridiculous knobby tires that are fitted to most 26" bikes.

              ray




              --
              GARY GREEN
              1301-B NORTHCREST DR #105
              CRESCENT CITY  CA   95531
              707-464-4113 RM 35

              Websites:
              www.bicycleandbeach.com
              www.shedandshelter.com
            • Cathode Ray
              ... O, I see. I thought you meant the kickstand plate of the xtracycle. A hole is not required in the chainstay bridge. The tongue rests on the chainstay
              Message 6 of 20 , Jan 22, 2007
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                At 3:53 PM -0800 22/1/07, messtime wrote:
                >I mentioned the kick stand area because it is my understanding that
                >it is the area where the tongue of the Xtracycle is attached and my
                >bike does not have an open hole in the top of the tube for a bolt to
                >go through.

                O, I see. I thought you meant the kickstand plate of the xtracycle.

                A hole is not required in the chainstay bridge. The tongue rests on
                the chainstay bridge and the bolt goes through the tongue and the
                front attachment place supplied with the kit.
              • messtime
                Thanks Ray, I will have to see how the Xtracycle is made before i can comment further on whether it will fit or not. My bike has a weird frame configuration
                Message 7 of 20 , Jan 22, 2007
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                  Thanks Ray,
                   
                  I will have to see how the Xtracycle is made before i can comment further on whether it will fit or not.  My bike has a weird frame configuration which may make it a little difficult to install.   I do not know until i actually see the Xtracycle.  I found out they - Xtracycle are very close to where i live so it will probably not be long before i receive my order and i will let you know how it turns out.   Sincerely, gary
                   


                   
                  On 1/22/07, Cathode Ray <ray@...> wrote:

                  At 3:53 PM -0800 22/1/07, messtime wrote:
                  >I mentioned the kick stand area because it is my understanding that
                  >it is the area where the tongue of the Xtracycle is attached and my
                  >bike does not have an open hole in the top of the tube for a bolt to
                  >go through.

                  O, I see. I thought you meant the kickstand plate of the xtracycle.

                  A hole is not required in the chainstay bridge. The tongue rests on
                  the chainstay bridge and the bolt goes through the tongue and the
                  front attachment place supplied with the kit.




                  --
                  GARY GREEN
                  1301-B NORTHCREST DR #105
                  CRESCENT CITY  CA   95531
                  707-464-4113 RM 35

                  Websites:
                  www.bicycleandbeach.com
                  www.shedandshelter.com
                • Cathode Ray
                  ... The actual xtracycle frame is the same for 700c and 26 versions. The only difference is the position of the V brake mounts. The disc brake mounts are the
                  Message 8 of 20 , Jan 22, 2007
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                    At 3:53 PM -0800 22/1/07, messtime wrote:
                    >Would you agree that buying a 700c Xtracycle gives you the option of
                    >use with both a 700c and a 26" size tire if i decided to use the
                    >Xtracycle with a 26" tire bicycle equipped with a disc brake?
                    >

                    The actual xtracycle frame is the same for 700c and 26" versions. The
                    only difference is the position of the V brake mounts. The disc brake
                    mounts are the same. With disk brakes you can use either 700c or 26"
                    wheels.

                    The only issue for 700c wheels on an xtracycle is clearance for
                    larger tires sizes. Width is not a problem, but diameter. Even 700c x
                    38 tires run very close to the frame.

                    I use 700c on the front and 26" on the rear.

                    ray
                  • messtime
                    Thanks again Ray for your kind help. Much appreciated. I guess i will have to experiment and get some experience with using the Xtracycle. I do not really
                    Message 9 of 20 , Jan 22, 2007
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                      Thanks again Ray for your kind help.  Much appreciated.
                       
                      I guess i will have to experiment and get some experience with using the Xtracycle.  I do not really know what to do right now as i have never even seen this hauling system except in pictures.  Basing my decision on the information you just sent me i will probably let the order stand for now and then make changes later if need be.  Since i no longer own a car i am glad to spend time working with bicycle stuff.  Your set-up sounds very efficient and i may have to use the same thing in order to get good results and tire size options as you pointed out.  Sincerely,   gary
                       


                       
                      On 1/22/07, Cathode Ray <ray@...> wrote:

                      At 3:53 PM -0800 22/1/07, messtime wrote:
                      >Would you agree that buying a 700c Xtracycle gives you the option of
                      >use with both a 700c and a 26" size tire if i decided to use the
                      >Xtracycle with a 26" tire bicycle equipped with a disc brake?
                      >

                      The actual xtracycle frame is the same for 700c and 26" versions. The
                      only difference is the position of the V brake mounts. The disc brake
                      mounts are the same. With disk brakes you can use either 700c or 26"
                      wheels.

                      The only issue for 700c wheels on an xtracycle is clearance for
                      larger tires sizes. Width is not a problem, but diameter. Even 700c x
                      38 tires run very close to the frame.

                      I use 700c on the front and 26" on the rear.

                      ray




                      --
                      GARY GREEN
                      1301-B NORTHCREST DR #105
                      CRESCENT CITY  CA   95531
                      707-464-4113 RM 35

                      Websites:
                      www.bicycleandbeach.com
                      www.shedandshelter.com
                    • Rainbow Flight
                      Hi Folks For those who ve not done so yet and are contemplating disc brakes on the rear (as I just found out) you ll need to put on an 8 (203mm) rotor, which
                      Message 10 of 20 , Jan 22, 2007
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                        Hi Folks
                        For those who've not done so yet and are contemplating disc brakes on the rear (as I just found out) you'll need to put on an 8" (203mm) rotor, which is bigger than a lot of MTB rear brakes (usually 6"). I've just done this on my new(er) set up a Kona Caldera MTB with Hayes hydrolic disc on the front and an Avid mechanical disc on the rear. As I've been going to the local art & craft market every Saturday fully loaded (big roll of kites and fire staff and umbrellas and collapsable flag poles on one wide/long loader, 2 folding tables on the other, gazzebo on the snap deck, CoolStop Cargo trailer loaded with stock off the back ("streched limo bicycle road train!")) I really noticed the need for good brakes!
                         
                        Even the salesman at the local bike shop was very impressed that Xtracyle had set up the rear for 8" not 6" disc brakes, makes so much sense with a load on. I managed to get a brand new mechanical disc set up off a bike where a customer wanted to go up to better gear (hydrolics), but my impression after a week is discs are great, and mechanical are probably fine, at least for the rear.
                         
                        The other big improvement I added today was a quality seat suspension post (Post Modern). As there's not really  way to use an Xtracycle on a full suspension bike, this was definitely a more comfortable way to travel, especially with a load on and dealing with curbs, driveways, uneven surfaces, bike tracks etc.
                         
                        Now I've just to convince my wife that I need that Stokemonkey....I'll be intouch with you sometime Todd!
                         
                        Spreading the Xtracycle message in Nelson, NZ
                        Ted
                         
                         
                      • David Chase
                        ... Depending on what you carry, you might want a wideloader or two (I need to order one myself). The last load I carried (a folding ladder, 43 inches long)
                        Message 11 of 20 , Jan 23, 2007
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                          On 2007-01-22, at 10:13 PM, messtime wrote:
                          > I guess i will have to experiment and get some experience with
                          > using the Xtracycle. I do not really know what to do right now as
                          > i have never even seen this hauling system except in pictures.

                          Depending on what you carry, you might want a wideloader or two (I
                          need to order one myself). The last load I carried (a folding
                          ladder, 43 inches long) strapped to the top of the deck was
                          noticeably whippy, and would have worked better strapped in lower and
                          tighter to the frame. But the stuff you see carried in those crazy
                          pictures, that's entirely believeable to me now, because I've done
                          some of that myself (towing a bike turns out to be dead easy -- a
                          bike is light, and supports half its weight anyhow). I am sure that
                          the heaviest loads move a little more slowly.

                          David
                        • messtime
                          Sorry to bother you Ray but as an afterthought i realized that anyone who is sure in their mind about the best wheel set-up for themselves like yourself would
                          Message 12 of 20 , Jan 23, 2007
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                            Sorry to bother you Ray but as an afterthought i realized that anyone who is sure in their mind about the best wheel set-up for themselves like yourself would probably buy the xtracycle matching their philosophy.   In your case a 700c wheel in the front and a 26" wheel in the back attached to the 26" xtracycle therefore giving a person the ability to use either the v-brake or a disc brake.   In other words if a person is going to use a 26" wheel on a permanent basis then it is probably efficient or best to install the 26" xtracycle.  gg
                             
                             


                             
                            On 1/22/07, Cathode Ray <ray@...
                            > wrote:

                            At 3:53 PM -0800 22/1/07, messtime wrote:
                            >Would you agree that buying a 700c Xtracycle gives you the option of
                            >use with both a 700c and a 26" size tire if i decided to use the
                            >Xtracycle with a 26" tire bicycle equipped with a disc brake?
                            >

                            The actual xtracycle frame is the same for 700c and 26" versions. The
                            only difference is the position of the V brake mounts. The disc brake
                            mounts are the same. With disk brakes you can use either 700c or 26"
                            wheels.

                            The only issue for 700c wheels on an xtracycle is clearance for
                            larger tires sizes. Width is not a problem, but diameter. Even 700c x
                            38 tires run very close to the frame.

                            I use 700c on the front and 26" on the rear.

                            ray




                            --
                            GARY GREEN
                            1301-B NORTHCREST DR #105
                            CRESCENT CITY  CA   95531
                            707-464-4113 RM 35

                            Websites:
                            www.bicycleandbeach.com
                            www.shedandshelter.com
                          • messtime
                            Thanks David for the comments. You are right. I need to order the wideloaders. I was under the mistaken impression that they came with the kit. The kit
                            Message 13 of 20 , Jan 23, 2007
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                              Thanks David for the comments. 
                               
                              You are right.  I need to order the wideloaders.
                               
                              I was under the mistaken impression that they came with the kit.   The kit comes with the following only:
                               
                              "The FreeRadical Hitchless Bicycle Trailer Kit comes with the FreeRadical base frame, two FreeLoaders, V-Racks, a SnapDeck , cables, chain, and all the small parts you will need to convert your bike into an S.U.B".
                               
                              Thanks for pointing this out to me.  I shall order the needed items today.  gg
                               
                               

                               
                              On 1/23/07, David Chase <dr2chase@...> wrote:


                              On 2007-01-22, at 10:13 PM, messtime wrote:
                              > I guess i will have to experiment and get some experience with
                              > using the Xtracycle. I do not really know what to do right now as
                              > i have never even seen this hauling system except in pictures.

                              Depending on what you carry, you might want a wideloader or two (I
                              need to order one myself). The last load I carried (a folding
                              ladder, 43 inches long) strapped to the top of the deck was
                              noticeably whippy, and would have worked better strapped in lower and
                              tighter to the frame. But the stuff you see carried in those crazy
                              pictures, that's entirely believeable to me now, because I've done
                              some of that myself (towing a bike turns out to be dead easy -- a
                              bike is light, and supports half its weight anyhow). I am sure that
                              the heaviest loads move a little more slowly.

                              David




                              --
                              GARY GREEN
                              1301-B NORTHCREST DR #105
                              CRESCENT CITY  CA   95531
                              707-464-4113 RM 35

                              Websites:
                              www.bicycleandbeach.com
                              www.shedandshelter.com
                            • Cathode Ray
                              ... I did a lot of looking at pictures and wondering how it might handle before I bought the xtracycle online. I had no opportunity to test ride, as I live in
                              Message 14 of 20 , Jan 23, 2007
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                                At 7:13 PM -0800 22/1/07, messtime wrote:
                                >I guess i will have to experiment and get some experience with using
                                >the Xtracycle. I do not really know what to do right now as i have
                                >never even seen this hauling system except in pictures

                                I did a lot of looking at pictures and wondering how it might handle
                                before I bought the xtracycle online. I had no opportunity to test
                                ride, as I live in inland Australia and the nearest dealer was 500 km
                                away.

                                When the bike shop assembled it for me and I started using it....WOW
                                ! Way better than I thought possible! Far exceeded my expectations,
                                and has changed my lifestyle.

                                ray
                              • messtime
                                Dear Ray, That s good to hear! That is interesting you live in Australia. Please open virus free attachment for picture of the best bicycle road in
                                Message 15 of 20 , Jan 23, 2007
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                                  Dear Ray,
                                   
                                  That's good to hear!  That is interesting you live in Australia.  Please open virus free attachment for picture of the best bicycle road in Australia! 
                                   
                                  The xtracycle looks like something i could have used 12 years ago when i was living the homeless lifestyle in Ft. Bragg CA.   Myself and another guy were always hauling food and water, camping gear and white buckets used to hold misc. junk all over the area on our bicycle's handlebars and rear baskets.  Now i am not homeless (living in a motel) but can still use it for groceries and maybe camping gear and hauling things between my motel room and mini-storage unit.  The xtracycle looks to be something a homeless person could put to good use.  I live in a northern california beach town (crescent city) and there is a lot of homeless people here riding bikes loaded down with all kinds of stuff.  They either load there bike down or make homemade bike trailers.  The xtracycle might be a better alternative for them and myself if i become homeless again.   Thanks for the comments!    gary
                                   
                                   


                                   
                                  On 1/23/07, Cathode Ray <ray@...> wrote:

                                  At 7:13 PM -0800 22/1/07, messtime wrote:
                                  >I guess i will have to experiment and get some experience with using
                                  >the Xtracycle. I do not really know what to do right now as i have
                                  >never even seen this hauling system except in pictures

                                  I did a lot of looking at pictures and wondering how it might handle
                                  before I bought the xtracycle online. I had no opportunity to test
                                  ride, as I live in inland Australia and the nearest dealer was 500 km
                                  away.

                                  When the bike shop assembled it for me and I started using it....WOW
                                  ! Way better than I thought possible! Far exceeded my expectations,
                                  and has changed my lifestyle.

                                  ray




                                  --
                                  GARY GREEN
                                  1301-B NORTHCREST DR #105
                                  CRESCENT CITY  CA   95531
                                  707-464-4113 RM 35

                                  Websites:
                                  www.bicycleandbeach.com
                                  www.shedandshelter.com
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