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Another wild creation...the Green Machine

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  • Morgan
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqEGkmGWMzo (I suggest selecting high quality mode if your internet connection allows) Brief explanation: This Big Dummy setup
    Message 1 of 8 , Mar 1, 2009
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      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqEGkmGWMzo

      (I suggest selecting "high quality" mode if your internet connection allows)

      Brief explanation:
      This Big Dummy setup was designed for a guy who lives in the mountains of Virginia, and
      due to physical limitations, he cannot always pedal. So it needed to provide sufficient
      power to haul cargo up the (steep) hills when not being pedaled. He will be pulling
      a trailer as well.

      He didn't want a Stokemonkey for personal reasons, so we came up with this as an
      alternative, using dual hub motors.

      I wouldn't regularly ride a bike like this, because I'd get no exercise. But it sure
      is fun to ride once in a while :) I especially liked taking it out "cruising" one Sat night
      after working late on it, and zooming around cars containing surprised teens.
      (He asked us to ride it around before he picks it up, to ensure adequate testing. I
      don't mind!).

      Since it has so much power, he's going to take it down to his DMV to register it as a
      "motor vehicle." That should be interesting.

      Morgan
    • David Dannenberg
      Nice machine! How long will it run on a charge (roughly, I know that will depend on speed, load, and grade)? What a practical errand/ delivery vehicle--cheap
      Message 2 of 8 , Mar 2, 2009
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        Nice machine! How long will it run on a charge (roughly, I know that
        will depend on speed, load, and grade)? What a practical errand/
        delivery vehicle--cheap to operate, quiet, energy efficient.

        Also how heavy are those hub motors and battery?

        David
      • adventureboyseven
        ... I am responding to posts on adding electric power to your bike or in this case XtraCycle. I use a power trailer I made using a 700 watt 20 hub motor
        Message 3 of 8 , Mar 2, 2009
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          --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, David Dannenberg
          <ddannenberg@...> wrote:
          >
          > Nice machine! How long will it run on a charge (roughly, I know that
          > will depend on speed, load, and grade)? What a practical errand/
          > delivery vehicle--cheap to operate, quiet, energy efficient.
          >
          > Also how heavy are those hub motors and battery?
          >
          > David
          >
          I am responding to posts on adding electric power to your bike or in
          this case XtraCycle. I use a power trailer I made using a 700 watt
          20" hub motor wheel, with a 36 volt batt pak. Wear a helmet as you
          get going faster than is safe from time to time.

          Regarding range, that is a function of your batteries and riding
          style. I get about 12-16 miles per charge, as I am 240 lbs. and ride
          fast mostly.
          Originally I had the electric wheel on a 20 inch folding bike.
          This lead to back injury and physio for several weeks due the pounding
          to my lower back.
          The reason I went to power trailer is the weight of the motor and battery's has a very negative effect on handling. I would always use
          a suspension bike, for added assist, especially gas, which I had in
          the past. Even a suspension seat post can help significantly. I had a
          Golden Eagle 25cc 2 cycle set up. Downside of their system is belts
          go fast with heavy use and are about 30 bucks with shipping.
          I just found a junked 55cc chainsaw motor which I will be putting
          into a power trailer with suspension in the future. The motor needs
          some work.
          If you are considering powering up with gas see Staton Inc. for a
          gear reduction unit with lifetime warranty. Go garage saling to get a
          motor. Most whipper snipper, and leaf blower engines will attach to
          this drive box easily. Staton has all the parts you will need and
          then some.
          I will be sharing my trailer plans when I have gotten the bugs
          out of the prototype which I will be rebuilding in the very near
          future. Adding some boogie wheels, suspension and new hitch design.

          Cheers, Phil aka adventureboyseven staton-inc.com for gearboxs,
          engines, wheels, gears and more...

          my fun mail is adventureboyseven@... home base is Niagara
          Falls, Canada
        • Jeff Snavely
          Junked chainsaw engines... I suppose that s one approach On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 9:03 AM, adventureboyseven
          Message 4 of 8 , Mar 2, 2009
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            Junked chainsaw engines... I suppose that's one approach



            On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 9:03 AM, adventureboyseven <adventureboyseven@...> wrote:

            --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, David Dannenberg

            <ddannenberg@...> wrote:
            >
            > Nice machine! How long will it run on a charge (roughly, I know that
            > will depend on speed, load, and grade)? What a practical errand/
            > delivery vehicle--cheap to operate, quiet, energy efficient.
            >
            > Also how heavy are those hub motors and battery?
            >
            > David
            >
            I am responding to posts on adding electric power to your bike or in
            this case XtraCycle. I use a power trailer I made using a 700 watt
            20" hub motor wheel, with a 36 volt batt pak. Wear a helmet as you
            get going faster than is safe from time to time.

            Regarding range, that is a function of your batteries and riding
            style. I get about 12-16 miles per charge, as I am 240 lbs. and ride
            fast mostly.
            Originally I had the electric wheel on a 20 inch folding bike.
            This lead to back injury and physio for several weeks due the pounding
            to my lower back.
            The reason I went to power trailer is the weight of the motor and battery's has a very negative effect on handling. I would always use
            a suspension bike, for added assist, especially gas, which I had in
            the past. Even a suspension seat post can help significantly. I had a
            Golden Eagle 25cc 2 cycle set up. Downside of their system is belts
            go fast with heavy use and are about 30 bucks with shipping.
            I just found a junked 55cc chainsaw motor which I will be putting
            into a power trailer with suspension in the future. The motor needs
            some work.
            If you are considering powering up with gas see Staton Inc. for a
            gear reduction unit with lifetime warranty. Go garage saling to get a
            motor. Most whipper snipper, and leaf blower engines will attach to
            this drive box easily. Staton has all the parts you will need and
            then some.
            I will be sharing my trailer plans when I have gotten the bugs
            out of the prototype which I will be rebuilding in the very near
            future. Adding some boogie wheels, suspension and new hitch design.

            Cheers, Phil aka adventureboyseven staton-inc.com for gearboxs,
            engines, wheels, gears and more...

            my fun mail is adventureboyseven@... home base is Niagara
            Falls, Canada


          • adventureboyseven
            ... , ... that ... pounding ... battery s ... a ... a ... adventureboyseven@... home base is
            Message 5 of 8 , Mar 2, 2009
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              --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Snavely <jsnavely@...> wrote:
              >
              > Junked chainsaw engines... I suppose that's one approach
              >
              >
              >
              > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 9:03 AM, adventureboyseven <
              > adventureboyseven@... wrote:
              >
              > > --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com
              <rootsradicals%40yahoogroups.com>,
              > > David Dannenberg
              > > ddannenberg@ wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Nice machine! How long will it run on a charge (roughly, I know
              that
              > > > will depend on speed, load, and grade)? What a practical errand/
              > > > delivery vehicle--cheap to operate, quiet, energy efficient.
              > > >
              > > > Also how heavy are those hub motors and battery?
              > > >
              > > > David
              > > >
              > > I am responding to posts on adding electric power to your bike or in
              > > this case XtraCycle. I use a power trailer I made using a 700 watt
              > > 20" hub motor wheel, with a 36 volt batt pak. Wear a helmet as you
              > > get going faster than is safe from time to time.
              > >
              > > Regarding range, that is a function of your batteries and riding
              > > style. I get about 12-16 miles per charge, as I am 240 lbs. and ride
              > > fast mostly.
              > > Originally I had the electric wheel on a 20 inch folding bike.
              > > This lead to back injury and physio for several weeks due the
              pounding
              > > to my lower back.
              > > The reason I went to power trailer is the weight of the motor and
              battery's
              > > has a very negative effect on handling. I would always use
              > > a suspension bike, for added assist, especially gas, which I had in
              > > the past. Even a suspension seat post can help significantly. I had
              a
              > > Golden Eagle 25cc 2 cycle set up. Downside of their system is belts
              > > go fast with heavy use and are about 30 bucks with shipping.
              > > I just found a junked 55cc chainsaw motor which I will be putting
              > > into a power trailer with suspension in the future. The motor needs
              > > some work.
              > > If you are considering powering up with gas see Staton Inc. for a
              > > gear reduction unit with lifetime warranty. Go garage saling to get
              a
              > > motor. Most whipper snipper, and leaf blower engines will attach to
              > > this drive box easily. Staton has all the parts you will need and
              > > then some.
              > > I will be sharing my trailer plans when I have gotten the bugs
              > > out of the prototype which I will be rebuilding in the very near
              > > future. Adding some boogie wheels, suspension and new hitch design.
              > >
              > > Cheers, Phil aka adventureboyseven staton-inc.com for gearboxs,
              > > engines, wheels, gears and more...
              > >
              > > my fun mail is
              adventureboyseven@...<adventureboyseven%40hotmail.com>home base is
              Niagara
              > > Falls, Canada
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
            • Morgan
              Hi David, I figure that if the user is moderately conservative, the range will be about 50 miles. If the user goes all out as if being on a motorcycle, it
              Message 6 of 8 , Mar 2, 2009
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                Hi David,
                I figure that if the user is moderately conservative, the range will be about 50 miles.
                If the user goes all out as if being on a motorcycle, it would be more like 25 miles.
                If being very conservative and only using assist to help with hills, it would be as much
                as 75-90 miles.

                That particular battery is heavy - around 30 lbs, but it carries a lot of energy - 1 KwH.
                This battery is designed to focus on long-life and high current output, with the tradeoff
                of being heavier and more expensive. There are LiFePO4 batteries that are substantially
                lighter and less expensive, but their lifespan will not be close to the life of this. It all
                depends on what is important to the user, and for this user, long term life and reliability
                was paramount.

                Each hub motor adds about 7 lbs to the bike, so both together are 14 lbs, and the
                controllers/wiring adding another 1-2 pounds.

                Best regards,
                Morgan



                --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, David Dannenberg <ddannenberg@...> wrote:
                >
                > Nice machine! How long will it run on a charge (roughly, I know that
                > will depend on speed, load, and grade)? What a practical errand/
                > delivery vehicle--cheap to operate, quiet, energy efficient.
                >
                > Also how heavy are those hub motors and battery?
                >
                > David
                >
              • Victor Khong
                Morgan, What type of battery is that?  Sealed lead acid,  Nimh, Nicad or something else? This is my version of an e.xtracycle which I use to transport myself
                Message 7 of 8 , Mar 2, 2009
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                  Morgan,

                  What type of battery is that?  Sealed lead acid,  Nimh, Nicad or something else?

                  This is my version of an e.xtracycle which I use to transport myself and my wife.
                  http://tinyurl.com/df95tr

                  I use SLA right now because its simple, cheap and does the job for the range I need. Build thread is here: http://tinyurl.com/c5g7z8

                • Morgan
                  Hi Victor, That s a LifeBatt LiFePO4 battery (48V 20Ah, equivalent to 8-9 of the 10Ah/12V SLA batteries in terms of power output). It uses the PSI LiFePO4
                  Message 8 of 8 , Mar 2, 2009
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                    Hi Victor,
                    That's a LifeBatt LiFePO4 battery (48V 20Ah, equivalent to 8-9 of the 10Ah/12V
                    SLA batteries in terms of power output).

                    It uses the "PSI" LiFePO4 cells, which are one of the best cells available
                    (those and A123). These cells can handle
                    up to 10C current, which for this 20Ah battery would mean 200 amps
                    continuous! The bike uses a max of about 40A, so this gives a nice
                    cushion, which will make the battery last longer. The PSI cells have
                    been tested to last for up to 3,000 cycles, so I suspect this battery
                    will be around for a long time.... (3,000 cycles * 20 miles per cycle =
                    60,000 miles!)

                    For all my ebikes up until about 2004 I used lead acids, then for
                    a short while NiMH. They worked fine...
                    but now I've been spoiled by LiFePO4. It is a lot lighter, delivers a flatter
                    power curve with little sag at the end of discharge, and lasts a lot longer...
                    Of course, it is much more expensive upfront (in the short term - over its life, it
                    is actually less expensive...). And the technology is new.

                    You've got a nice setup, thanks for sharing!

                    Morgan


                    --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, Victor Khong <victorkhong@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Morgan,
                    >
                    > What type of battery is that?  Sealed lead acid,  Nimh, Nicad or something else?
                    >
                    > This is my version of an e.xtracycle which I use to transport myself and my wife.
                    > http://tinyurl.com/df95tr
                    >
                    > I use SLA right now because its simple, cheap and does the job for the range I need.
                    Build thread is here: http://tinyurl.com/c5g7z8
                    >
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