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Re: [rootsradicals] My bike broke! :(

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  • Tone@moon-shine.net
    Cara Lin, No need to send spokes... I have Aerospoke 5-spoke poly-carbon fiber mag wheels. :)
    Message 1 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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      Cara Lin,

      No need to send spokes... I have Aerospoke 5-spoke poly-carbon fiber
      mag wheels. :)
    • stoutag
      At least according to Xtracycles web site they still have 16 and 18 framesets in stock. Certainly worth a call over to them. Anthony ... say ... make do ...
      Message 2 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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        At least according to Xtracycles web site they still have 16" and 18"
        framesets in stock. Certainly worth a call over to them.

        Anthony

        --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, Cara Lin Bridgman <cara.lin@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Hi Tone,
        >
        > I feel for your loss. When is the funeral? Do we send spokes?
        >
        > Email, heck phone!, the Surly people and tell them your history. Some
        > of them have probably read your postings on this list. Maybe if you
        say
        > pretty please they'll work something out for you--older model, put at
        > the head of the new production list.
        >
        > If they can't come up with anything, then grab the first 10-dollar
        > mountain bike you see at a yard sale, on ebay, at craigslist and
        make do
        > until its your turn for a big dummy.
        >
        > For me, top tube length was more important than seat tube length. If
        > the top tube is too long, I end up with too much pressure on my hands.
        >
        > Aluminum frames should be 100% recyclable. In fact, aluminum is one of
        > those materials where it is more energy and cost effective to
        recycle it
        > than to dig new out of the ground.
        >
        > CL
        >
      • Dane Buson
        ... I feel your pain, I m waiting for the warranty replacement frame for my Crosscheck. This is the second frame I ve broken in the same place (right rear
        Message 3 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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          On Jun 2, Antonio tripped the electrons lexically so:

          > I suppose, if I get a replacement used bike frame and swap out the
          > bike parts, that might as well be the same as sending my aluminum
          > horse's body to the "glue factory."
          >
          > For those of you, who can still hop on their bikes and ride off into
          > the sunset...

          I feel your pain, I'm waiting for the warranty replacement frame for my
          Crosscheck. This is the second frame I've broken in the same place
          (right rear dropout). Thankfully, I have my Xtracycle (built on an old
          Schwinn MTB) and my Sunny Day bike (which was cobbled together out of
          pieces about 48 hours after the CrossChecks demise) to keep me on the
          road.

          Sunny Day bike: http://zuvembi.livejournal.com/37950.html

          --
          Dane Buson - Buson@...
          "We must respect the other fellow's religion, but only in hte
          sense and to the extent that we respect his theory that his
          wife is beautiful and his children smart." -H. L. Mencken
        • phaedrus
          ... If Xtracycle can t help you out, I ve seen a couple around at bike shops in Minneapolis. Unfortunately, I can t recall which ones. It was one or more of
          Message 4 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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            > At least according to Xtracycles web site they still have 16" and 18"
            > framesets in stock. Certainly worth a call over to them.
            >

            If Xtracycle can't help you out, I've seen a couple around at bike
            shops in Minneapolis. Unfortunately, I can't recall which ones.

            It was one or more of the Hub, Freewheel, and Hiawatha Cyclery

            http://thehubbikecoop.org/
            http://freewheelbike.com/
            http://hiawathacyclery.com/cart/

            - phaedrus
          • Phil Good-Elliott
            Tone, you and I share the same inseam. My Trek 4300 is an 18 frame and works fine for me. Beware: prices on bikes are taking a 10 - 15% hike with increased
            Message 5 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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              Tone,

              you and I share the same inseam. My Trek 4300 is an 18" frame and works
              fine for me.

              Beware: prices on bikes are taking a 10 - 15% hike with increased
              demand.

              Best wishes for a solution that fits well and functions better!

              -Phil
            • tda0818
              I don t know any Big Dummy sources, Tone, but I ve got a 16 Giant Iguana which would probably take a FreeRad just peachy; it s a CrMo frame, and no shocks.
              Message 6 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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                I don't know any Big Dummy sources, Tone, but I've got a 16" Giant
                Iguana which would probably take a FreeRad just peachy; it's a CrMo
                frame, and no shocks. The frame and wheels are in great shape, but
                the other components need replacing (which is why I don't ride it
                anymore -- that and it's too small for me, now). It's just collecting
                dust in the garage.

                You're welcome to borrow it until you can get a BD, if you can't get
                one right away.

                -- urbino


                --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, "Antonio" <Tone@...> wrote:
                >
                > Today on the way to work my bicycle had a catastrophic failure right
                > through the frame tubing behind the headset. For a couple of seconds
                > it felt like I had some major air leak going on in my tires then the
                > frame just tore right through itself. I am perfectly fine except for a
                > slight grease smudge on my white shirt, but my bike is irreparable.
                >
                > I would not at all consider the breakage a fault in the frame. It was
                > a fat-tube aluminum frame, which I had for about ten years. I estimate
                > I easily put over 30,000 miles on it with much of that working as a
                > bike messenger in New York City (30+ miles a day, five days a week,
                > low-ball-50 weeks in a year for even only five years = 37,500 miles).
                > Considering I also had the Xtracycle attached to it for most of those
                > years and I have hauled some SERIOUS cargo at times... it is a wonder
                > it lasted this long. I know a number of my bike mechanics over the
                > years will not be surprised, although they hardly believe I have
                > actually ridden on the same aluminum frame for this long.
                >
                > In any case, this bike is the only one I have and I do not drive.
                > Heck, I do not even have a driver's license, and just this past
                > Saturday was in fact the FIRST time I ever stepped into a DMV. My
                > passport is about to expire in August and I needed to get a
                > non-driver's state ID as an official identification while my passport
                > is sent away for renewal. Maybe stepping into a DMV jinxed my
                bicycle. :)
                >
                > My wife has a bike I can borrow VERY temporarily, but for long term
                > usage it definitely is not for me. Ideally I would like to get Surly's
                > Big Dummy, but unfortunately their first batch sold out pretty quick
                > _as_far_as_I_know_. My wife and I are trying to buy a house, so back
                > when the Big Dummy was released I could not justify the $800 plus to
                > build a secondary cargo bike. Sadly now, the next batch of Big
                > Dummies is only available some time in the Fall _as_far_as_I_know_.
                > <Sigh>.
                >
                > Does anyone know differently in regards to the Big Dummy? Are there
                > ANY available Big Dummies still floating around??? To be honest I am
                > not even sure what frame size would be appropriate for me. My busted
                > bike had a low top-tube geometry and it has been SO long since I had
                > to worry about frame sizing. My pant-leg inseam is about 30-31" in
                > length, but other than that I am clueless. Maybe I should have had
                > myself at least sized up for a frame fitting at my bike shop in
                > preparation for eventually getting the Big Dummy, but I never bothered
                > since I thought I was not going to get a Big Dummy until at least the
                > Fall. After going to the DMV I even stopped in at my bike shop to pick
                > up one of those "Planet Bike" super-flash(?) lights, which a number of
                > people have given good reviews on this forum... and yes I agree; It is
                > VERY bright! Do NOT look directly at it! :) heh
                >
                > Anyway, does anyone out there have any tips on where to score a Big
                > Dummy. I would VERY much appreciate it! Also, if anyone can offer any
                > suggestions on what Big Dummy frame size would be appropriate for me
                > that would be great too!
                >
                > I still have my Xtracycle, so I could get a temporary used frame
                > somewhere, but what kind of sucks is my FreeRadical has had a crack
                > behind one of its dropouts for over a year now. Therefore I would be
                > swapping over a busted Xtracycle onto a different bike frame. I have
                > had a split pipe hose clamped over the cracked area to act as a brace
                > of sorts and I am quite sure it will hold up fine, but obviously
                > getting a brand new Big Dummy would be the ideal solution. <Sigh>
                >
                > Why can't things last forever? I guess the ride had to end sometime.
                > Rest in Peace Boxer.
                >
                > For those wondering, Boxer is my bike's name. The name is from the
                > symbolic proletariat Horse character in the book "Animal Farm", who
                > works almost religiously until he dies just to have his remains sent
                > to the glue factory. I suppose, if I get a replacement used bike frame
                > and swap out the bike parts, that might as well be the same as sending
                > my aluminum horse's body to the "glue factory."
                >
                > For those of you, who can still hop on their bikes and ride off into
                > the sunset...
                > Ride safe,
                > _TONE_
                >
              • Roger Munk
                Clever Cycles had 2 18 frames left last week when I ordered mine. :) They say on their website that they reserve the right to sell only as part of a complete
                Message 7 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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                  Clever Cycles had 2 18" frames left last week when I ordered mine. :)
                  They say on their website that they reserve the right to sell only as
                  part of a complete build though, so you may want to call them and find
                  out.

                  Good luck!

                  -Rog.
                • Tone@moon-shine.net
                  Good news fellow Xtracyclists! I just bought a Big Dummy! I called our friendly folks at Xtracycle and they still had ONE 16 Big Dummy left. After much
                  Message 8 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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                    Good news fellow Xtracyclists!

                    I just bought a Big Dummy! I called our friendly folks at Xtracycle
                    and they still had ONE 16" Big Dummy left. After much discussion with
                    them and debate with myself I decided to buy it. The 16" size might
                    be JUST a bit small for me, but my current frame is 17" (measured
                    according to how Surly defines their "seatpost" based frame sizes.)

                    The other various measurements of the different Big Dummy sizes were a
                    bit harder to determine on my bike when comparing my Univega 750 FS.
                    My bike has a rather odd geometry with the fat down-tube being the one
                    to join into the head-tube, then the horizontal/level top tube
                    connects only to the downtube a few inches away from the head tube. Of
                    course having a broken frame did not help any when trying to take
                    those other measurements to compare them to Surly's Big Dummy blog
                    specification page.

                    Either way, Nate at Xtracycle was fairly confident the 16" would fit
                    me good enough, and I would not mind a smaller bike if it meant the
                    next size up was right at the fringe of being too big for me. As it is
                    Nate is 6' tall and feels an 18" frame is just right for him and I am
                    5' 7.5". I think it should be fine. It better be at a price tag of
                    $1005 with S/H included. Apart from hoping the sizing will be suitable
                    I also hope it gets to my local bike shop in time for them to set it
                    all up by the weekend of the 14th. I have a 63 mile (100k) charity
                    ride my company is sponsoring me to do. Having a fresh new Big Dummy
                    for that would be totally sweet!

                    Anyway, if any of you out there have any suggestions, advice,
                    encouragement, criticism, or comments about whether I made the right
                    choice in Big Dummy sizing I would like to hear it. I am SO excited
                    either way!

                    Ride safe everyone!
                    _TONE_
                  • Tone
                    Urbino, Thanks for writing back with an offer to lend me your 16 Giant bike, but apart from me already ordering a Big Dummy. I do not think you are close
                    Message 9 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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                      Urbino,

                                  Thanks for writing back with an offer to lend me your 16” Giant bike, but apart from me already ordering a Big Dummy… I do not think you are close enough for me to just stop by and borrow your ride. J I am in York, PA. I thought you were somewhere on the West Coast. Either way it is cool to know people on this list are so supportive of each other!

                       

                      Everyone else,

                                  By the way folks, while on the phone ordering my Big Dummy I had a nice long conversation with Nate. One of the things we spoke about was the snap deck. Apparently Xtracycle will be selling a new synthetic snap deck within the next few months. The topic came up when he asked if there was anything else I wanted to buy. I told him my snap deck was looking pretty sad since it was the original one, but I did not want to buy one because I have been thinking of making one myself out of plastic kitchen cutting board material. That is when Nate told me their upcoming snap decks will be made of practically the same exact material, but be in a different color (or colors?.. I know he said black). Unfortunately I could not order one on the spot since he had no release date yet, but it is cool to know Xtracycle is continuing their innovational improvements. J Nate also told me the newer FreeRadical model will have beefier frame tubing behind the dropouts to better avoid the dreaded cracks that sometime develop there from putting too much weight behind the rear axle. As it is my current Xtracycle is the third one I have because of that problem and it too started developing a crack behind the rear left drop out. L Hence the great desire to upgrade to a Big Dummy.

                       

                      Ride safe all,

                      _TONE_

                       

                       

                       

                       

                       

                       

                       

                       

                       

                    • tda0818
                      I m in Memphis, so, yeah, too far to just swing by, but I woulda shipped it to you. I hate to see a bike person go bikeless, especially when I have one just
                      Message 10 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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                        I'm in Memphis, so, yeah, too far to just swing by, but I woulda
                        shipped it to you. I hate to see a bike person go bikeless,
                        especially when I have one just sitting around. I've only been riding
                        6-7 months, and already I'd be *extremely* unhappy if I had to go
                        completely without for even a few days.

                        I hope the X-dogs come up with a color other than black for the new
                        SnapDeck. That thing'd get hot enough to burn flesh around here.

                        -- urbino

                        --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, "Tone" <Tone@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Urbino,
                        > Thanks for writing back with an offer to lend me your 16"
                        > Giant bike, but apart from me already ordering a Big Dummy. I do not
                        > think you are close enough for me to just stop by and borrow your ride.
                        > :-) I am in York, PA. I thought you were somewhere on the West Coast.
                        > Either way it is cool to know people on this list are so supportive of
                        > each other!
                        >
                        > Everyone else,
                        > By the way folks, while on the phone ordering my Big Dummy I
                        > had a nice long conversation with Nate. One of the things we spoke about
                        > was the snap deck. Apparently Xtracycle will be selling a new synthetic
                        > snap deck within the next few months. The topic came up when he asked if
                        > there was anything else I wanted to buy. I told him my snap deck was
                        > looking pretty sad since it was the original one, but I did not want to
                        > buy one because I have been thinking of making one myself out of plastic
                        > kitchen cutting board material. That is when Nate told me their upcoming
                        > snap decks will be made of practically the same exact material, but be
                        > in a different color (or colors?.. I know he said black). Unfortunately
                        > I could not order one on the spot since he had no release date yet, but
                        > it is cool to know Xtracycle is continuing their innovational
                        > improvements. :-) Nate also told me the newer FreeRadical model will
                        > have beefier frame tubing behind the dropouts to better avoid the
                        > dreaded cracks that sometime develop there from putting too much weight
                        > behind the rear axle. As it is my current Xtracycle is the third one I
                        > have because of that problem and it too started developing a crack
                        > behind the rear left drop out. :-( Hence the great desire to upgrade to
                        > a Big Dummy.
                        >
                        > Ride safe all,
                        > _TONE_
                        >
                      • Tone
                        I seem to recall someone on this list about a month or two ago asking to buy broken Xtracycles for some experimentation project they were working on? Is that
                        Message 11 of 29 , Jun 2, 2008
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                                      I seem to recall someone on this list about a month or two ago asking to buy broken Xtracycles for some experimentation project they were working on? Is that person still looking to buy a busted Xtracycle? Now that my bike has totally broken, I have gone ahead and ordered the last Big Dummy Xtracycle has. Once I get the Big Dummy and swap over all the components from my busted bike that will leave me with a busted bike and a somewhat busted FreeRadical frame. I say somewhat because for over a year now it has had a crack halfway through the tubing directly behind the left dropout. It has not gotten any worse because I braced it very securely by sandwiching a split metal pipe around the tubing with a number of hose clamps. I ride my bike every day to go to work (5.5 miles each way), and obviously the brace has worked fine ever since I applied it.

                           

                          _TONE_

                           

                        • Victor Khong
                          Small frames like 16 work well with the FreeRadical. Makes for a very solid feeling setup. tda0818 wrote: I
                          Message 12 of 29 , Jun 3, 2008
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                            Small frames like 16" work well with the FreeRadical.  Makes for a very solid feeling setup.



                            tda0818 <tda0818@...> wrote:
                            I don't know any Big Dummy sources, Tone, but I've got a 16" Giant
                            Iguana which would probably take a FreeRad just peachy; it's a CrMo
                            frame, and no shocks. The frame and wheels are in great shape, but
                            the other components need replacing (which is why I don't ride it
                            anymore -- that and it's too small for me, now). It's just collecting
                            dust in the garage.

                            You're welcome to borrow it until you can get a BD, if you can't get
                            one right away.

                            -- urbino


                            --- In rootsradicals@ yahoogroups. com, "Antonio" <Tone@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > Today on the way to work my bicycle had a catastrophic failure right
                            > through the frame tubing behind the headset. For a couple of seconds
                            > it felt like I had some major air leak going on in my tires then the
                            > frame just tore right through itself. I am perfectly fine except for a
                            > slight grease smudge on my white shirt, but my bike is irreparable.
                            >
                            > I would not at all consider the breakage a fault in the frame. It was
                            > a fat-tube aluminum frame, which I had for about ten years. I estimate
                            > I easily put over 30,000 miles on it with much of that working as a
                            > bike messenger in New York City (30+ miles a day, five days a week,
                            > low-ball-50 weeks in a year for even only five years = 37,500 miles).
                            > Considering I also had the Xtracycle attached to it for most of those
                            > years and I have hauled some SERIOUS cargo at times... it is a wonder
                            > it lasted this long. I know a number of my bike mechanics over the
                            > years will not be surprised, although they hardly believe I have
                            > actually ridden on the same aluminum frame for this long.
                            >
                            > In any case, this bike is the only one I have and I do not drive.
                            > Heck, I do not even have a driver's license, and just this past
                            > Saturday was in fact the FIRST time I ever stepped into a DMV. My
                            > passport is about to expire in August and I needed to get a
                            > non-driver's state ID as an official identification while my passport
                            > is sent away for renewal. Maybe stepping into a DMV jinxed my
                            bicycle. :)
                            >
                            > My wife has a bike I can borrow VERY temporarily, but for long term
                            > usage it definitely is not for me. Ideally I would like to get Surly's
                            > Big Dummy, but unfortunately their first batch sold out pretty quick
                            > _as_far_as_I_ know_. My wife and I are trying to buy a house, so back
                            > when the Big Dummy was released I could not justify the $800 plus to
                            > build a secondary cargo bike. Sadly now, the next batch of Big
                            > Dummies is only available some time in the Fall _as_far_as_I_ know_.
                            > <Sigh>.
                            >
                            > Does anyone know differently in regards to the Big Dummy? Are there
                            > ANY available Big Dummies still floating around??? To be honest I am
                            > not even sure what frame size would be appropriate for me. My busted
                            > bike had a low top-tube geometry and it has been SO long since I had
                            > to worry about frame sizing. My pant-leg inseam is about 30-31" in
                            > length, but other than that I am clueless. Maybe I should have had
                            > myself at least sized up for a frame fitting at my bike shop in
                            > preparation for eventually getting the Big Dummy, but I never bothered
                            > since I thought I was not going to get a Big Dummy until at least the
                            > Fall. After going to the DMV I even stopped in at my bike shop to pick
                            > up one of those "Planet Bike" super-flash( ?) lights, which a number of
                            > people have given good reviews on this forum... and yes I agree; It is
                            > VERY bright! Do NOT look directly at it! :) heh
                            >
                            > Anyway, does anyone out there have any tips on where to score a Big
                            > Dummy. I would VERY much appreciate it! Also, if anyone can offer any
                            > suggestions on what Big Dummy frame size would be appropriate for me
                            > that would be great too!
                            >
                            > I still have my Xtracycle, so I could get a temporary used frame
                            > somewhere, but what kind of sucks is my FreeRadical has had a crack
                            > behind one of its dropouts for over a year now. Therefore I would be
                            > swapping over a busted Xtracycle onto a different bike frame. I have
                            > had a split pipe hose clamped over the cracked area to act as a brace
                            > of sorts and I am quite sure it will hold up fine, but obviously
                            > getting a brand new Big Dummy would be the ideal solution. <Sigh>
                            >
                            > Why can't things last forever? I guess the ride had to end sometime.
                            > Rest in Peace Boxer.
                            >
                            > For those wondering, Boxer is my bike's name. The name is from the
                            > symbolic proletariat Horse character in the book "Animal Farm", who
                            > works almost religiously until he dies just to have his remains sent
                            > to the glue factory. I suppose, if I get a replacement used bike frame
                            > and swap out the bike parts, that might as well be the same as sending
                            > my aluminum horse's body to the "glue factory."
                            >
                            > For those of you, who can still hop on their bikes and ride off into
                            > the sunset...
                            > Ride safe,
                            > _TONE_
                            >


                          • Victor Khong
                            Congrats! The BD is the peach! Even if the 16 is just a tiny bit small, its no bad thing if you will be carrying passengers and cargo. Tone@moon-shine.net
                            Message 13 of 29 , Jun 3, 2008
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                              Congrats!   The BD is the peach!   Even if the 16" is just a tiny bit small, its no bad thing if you will be carrying passengers and cargo.



                              Tone@... wrote:
                              Good news fellow Xtracyclists!

                              I just bought a Big Dummy! I called our friendly folks at Xtracycle
                              and they still had ONE 16" Big Dummy left.

                            • David Chase
                              If you don t find that person, you could probably get it welded and reinforced. Wouldn t be pretty, but it still ought to be worth twice the cost of welding,
                              Message 14 of 29 , Jun 3, 2008
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                                If you don't find that person, you could probably get it welded and
                                reinforced. Wouldn't be pretty, but it still ought to be worth twice
                                the cost of welding, and would be of good use to someone. "Owned by
                                former NY bike messenger Tone, 30,000 miles, took a licking, still
                                ticking," that might sell it :-). Or send it to the Cooper-Hewitt, as-
                                is.

                                On 2008-06-03, at 12:50 AM, Tone wrote:

                                > I seem to recall someone on this list about a month or
                                > two ago asking to buy broken Xtracycles for some experimentation
                                > project they were working on?
                              • Mark Garvey
                                ... DUDE!!! Oh man! TONE! How awful! sorry to hear that! I am not going to rub it in or anything, because the C-dale did Yeoman s service (wasn t the
                                Message 15 of 29 , Jun 3, 2008
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                                  On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 11:10 AM, Antonio <Tone@...> wrote:
                                  Today on the way to work my bicycle had a catastrophic failure right
                                  through the frame tubing behind the headset.

                                  DUDE!!!  Oh man!  TONE!  How awful!  sorry to hear that!   I am not going to rub it in or anything, because the C-dale did Yeoman's service (wasn't the Yeoman ALWAYS the one who got killed  first on Star Trek every episode??)

                                  But remember....STEEL is real!  It will slowly bend and break, giving you some warning while Aluminumiunm will not show anything then simply FAIL!  Also, if it were a STEEL frame, it could be repaired.  A sleeve and a braze would do it...not perminent, but you could get by for a while untnil you could get another frame at least!  wish I were closer!  I have a couple of frames that would work at least.  Not GREAT  but if you were close by, I would simply GIVE you one!



                                  Sorry to hear about your loss!

                                  Best of luck to you sir!

                                  mark
                                • Cathode Ray
                                  ... My aluminium frame cracked through the downtube, starting at the weld right behind the headset. I really punished my Xtracycle , lots of jumping up and
                                  Message 16 of 29 , Jun 6, 2008
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                                    At 4:10 PM +0000 2/6/08, Antonio wrote:
                                    >catastrophic failure right
                                    >through the frame tubing behind the headset......
                                    >I would not at all consider the breakage a fault in the frame. It was
                                    >a fat-tube aluminum frame,


                                    My aluminium frame cracked through the downtube, starting at the weld
                                    right behind the headset. I really punished my Xtracycle , lots of
                                    jumping up and down kerbs and frequently overloaded. The frame itself
                                    is about six years old, and I had the Xtracycle fitted for about two
                                    years.

                                    Close up of the failure:
                                    http://www.retrovox.com.au/hpv/images/framecrack.jpg

                                    Yet I think that what caused the stress leading to the crack was that
                                    I was using only the front brake to stop the bike! After ruining many
                                    rims I bought the biggest rim I could find: Sun Ringle Double Wide,
                                    46mm wide, disk brake only rim. However I didn't upgrade to disk
                                    brakes.

                                    After my frame cracked I fitted the Xtracycle to my wife's Townie.
                                    Still concerned about long-term use with aluminium frame. I am using
                                    the standard Townie rims, which are holding up pretty well. My riding
                                    style is now a little more relaxed as well. I really love the crank
                                    forward geometry with the upright posture.

                                    What I really want is an Electra RAT FINK with the Xtracycle
                                    attached. There are both alloy and steel version of the rat fink
                                    available, and I want the steel for strength. Even though the rear
                                    wheel of the rat fink is 24", the dimensions of the frame fit the
                                    freeradical.

                                    Here is the Electra PINK FINK with Xtracycle and bike blender:
                                    http://www.flickr.com/photos/juicepeddler/285816804/

                                    Also check out this DIY longtail cargo bike:
                                    http://flickr.com/photos/kstoerz/440268085/
                                  • Mark Garvey
                                    ... Believe it or not, My only degree.. is in welding and welding inspection, including NDT testing.. x ray, ultrasound, Magnaflux that sort of thing...Also
                                    Message 17 of 29 , Jun 6, 2008
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                                      On Fri, Jun 6, 2008 at 8:03 AM, Cathode Ray <ray@...> wrote:


                                      My aluminium frame cracked through the downtube, starting at the weld
                                      right behind the headset.

                                      Believe it or not, My only degree.. is in welding and welding inspection, including NDT testing..  x ray, ultrasound, Magnaflux  that sort of thing...Also destructive testing...but that is another story...you HAVE managed to do this!(OK, I have 160+ college credit hours, not counting my welding technical credits....but I have no degree.  since this, I have added audit courses in History and environmental sciences totaling another 20-30 hours if I remember correctly....but nothing COUNTS you understand!   Of course, since there is no "real" degree on a diploma, I am officially "uneducated" and hence "stupid. My HOBBY, or one of them anyway,  is taking college courses or getting tapes of lectures from friends because I am INTERESTED in them...but I digress!)

                                      ANYWAY, what you have here is a classic case of the crack propagating from an undercut in the weld bead.  Take a look at the weld where the break started and it starts RIGHT on the edge of the  weld where the  bead ends and the tube  begins.  there is probably some sort of inclusion or void in the weld bead right there. If you look at it microscopically you will likely see a tiny spot where there is a bubble, or a chunk of something RIGHT where it started.

                                      The problem, AS I SEE IT (!!!) is that Aluminum does not "give" much. It is amazingly strong for it's weight, but it is soft unless tempered or heat treated...properly.  An expensive and time consuming process.

                                      Anyway, this is one reason that I prefer steel.  Just a PREFERENCE on my part and no bad on Alum frames!  catastrophic failure SUCKS!!

                                      Hope you can find a cool frame for yourself!

                                      mark
                                    • David Bole
                                      Hi Tone, Our shop has one 16 big dummy left. A couple guys at our shop upgraded to the big D this year and have been very happy... Dave Bicycle Chain St
                                      Message 18 of 29 , Jun 9, 2008
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                                        Hi Tone,

                                        Our shop has one 16" big dummy left. A couple guys at our shop
                                        upgraded to the big D this year and have been very happy...

                                        Dave
                                        Bicycle Chain
                                        St Paul, Mn
                                        bicyclechain at gmail.com

                                        --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, "Antonio" <Tone@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Today on the way to work my bicycle had a catastrophic failure right
                                        > through the frame tubing behind the headset. For a couple of seconds
                                        > it felt like I had some major air leak going on in my tires then the
                                        > frame just tore right through itself. I am perfectly fine except
                                        for a
                                        > slight grease smudge on my white shirt, but my bike is irreparable.
                                        >
                                        > I would not at all consider the breakage a fault in the frame. It
                                        was
                                        > a fat-tube aluminum frame, which I had for about ten years. I
                                        estimate
                                        > I easily put over 30,000 miles on it with much of that working as a
                                        > bike messenger in New York City (30+ miles a day, five days a week,
                                        > low-ball-50 weeks in a year for even only five years = 37,500
                                        miles).
                                        > Considering I also had the Xtracycle attached to it for most of
                                        those
                                        > years and I have hauled some SERIOUS cargo at times... it is a
                                        wonder
                                        > it lasted this long. I know a number of my bike mechanics over the
                                        > years will not be surprised, although they hardly believe I have
                                        > actually ridden on the same aluminum frame for this long.
                                        >
                                        > In any case, this bike is the only one I have and I do not drive.
                                        > Heck, I do not even have a driver's license, and just this past
                                        > Saturday was in fact the FIRST time I ever stepped into a DMV. My
                                        > passport is about to expire in August and I needed to get a
                                        > non-driver's state ID as an official identification while my
                                        passport
                                        > is sent away for renewal. Maybe stepping into a DMV jinxed my
                                        bicycle. :)
                                        >
                                        > My wife has a bike I can borrow VERY temporarily, but for long term
                                        > usage it definitely is not for me. Ideally I would like to get
                                        Surly's
                                        > Big Dummy, but unfortunately their first batch sold out pretty quick
                                        > _as_far_as_I_know_. My wife and I are trying to buy a house, so back
                                        > when the Big Dummy was released I could not justify the $800 plus to
                                        > build a secondary cargo bike. Sadly now, the next batch of Big
                                        > Dummies is only available some time in the Fall _as_far_as_I_know_.
                                        > <Sigh>.
                                        >
                                        > Does anyone know differently in regards to the Big Dummy? Are there
                                        > ANY available Big Dummies still floating around??? To be honest I am
                                        > not even sure what frame size would be appropriate for me. My busted
                                        > bike had a low top-tube geometry and it has been SO long since I had
                                        > to worry about frame sizing. My pant-leg inseam is about 30-31" in
                                        > length, but other than that I am clueless. Maybe I should have had
                                        > myself at least sized up for a frame fitting at my bike shop in
                                        > preparation for eventually getting the Big Dummy, but I never
                                        bothered
                                        > since I thought I was not going to get a Big Dummy until at least
                                        the
                                        > Fall. After going to the DMV I even stopped in at my bike shop to
                                        pick
                                        > up one of those "Planet Bike" super-flash(?) lights, which a number
                                        of
                                        > people have given good reviews on this forum... and yes I agree; It
                                        is
                                        > VERY bright! Do NOT look directly at it! :) heh
                                        >
                                        > Anyway, does anyone out there have any tips on where to score a Big
                                        > Dummy. I would VERY much appreciate it! Also, if anyone can offer
                                        any
                                        > suggestions on what Big Dummy frame size would be appropriate for me
                                        > that would be great too!
                                        >
                                        > I still have my Xtracycle, so I could get a temporary used frame
                                        > somewhere, but what kind of sucks is my FreeRadical has had a crack
                                        > behind one of its dropouts for over a year now. Therefore I would be
                                        > swapping over a busted Xtracycle onto a different bike frame. I have
                                        > had a split pipe hose clamped over the cracked area to act as a
                                        brace
                                        > of sorts and I am quite sure it will hold up fine, but obviously
                                        > getting a brand new Big Dummy would be the ideal solution. <Sigh>
                                        >
                                        > Why can't things last forever? I guess the ride had to end sometime.
                                        > Rest in Peace Boxer.
                                        >
                                        > For those wondering, Boxer is my bike's name. The name is from the
                                        > symbolic proletariat Horse character in the book "Animal Farm", who
                                        > works almost religiously until he dies just to have his remains sent
                                        > to the glue factory. I suppose, if I get a replacement used bike
                                        frame
                                        > and swap out the bike parts, that might as well be the same as
                                        sending
                                        > my aluminum horse's body to the "glue factory."
                                        >
                                        > For those of you, who can still hop on their bikes and ride off into
                                        > the sunset...
                                        > Ride safe,
                                        > _TONE_
                                        >
                                      • Tone@moon-shine.net
                                        Dave, Thanks for giving me the info for the 16 Big Dummy at your shop. However, I actually ordered the last Big Dummy Xtracycle had in stock (16 ). It is
                                        Message 19 of 29 , Jun 10, 2008
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                                          Dave,

                                          Thanks for giving me the info for the 16" Big Dummy at your shop.
                                          However, I actually ordered the last Big Dummy Xtracycle had in stock
                                          (16"). It is actually suppose to arrive at my local bike shop today!

                                          Yesterday after work when my bike shop is closed (every Monday) I
                                          brought my broken bike over to them. I locked my bike up to a pipe
                                          outside their shop and hid the key to the lock nearby. My hope is the
                                          Big Dummy will arrive sooner than later today. Then I can just give
                                          them a call while I am at work to let them know where the key is so
                                          they can start swapping over parts right away.

                                          I know it is rather a rather unconventional method of dropping off a
                                          bike, but Big Dummies are not exactly conventional. :) Also, there is
                                          a 63 mile charity ride this coming Saturday, which I am already
                                          registered to ride in through the company I work at. I am really
                                          hoping to be able to sport the Big Dummy on that ride. The Big Dummy
                                          will be my only bike. I have been riding my wife's
                                          built-up-from-scraps (Frankenstein) bike to work since my original
                                          bike broke, but it is just not the same. :(

                                          Oh, and if I do manage to get my new Big Dummy up and running in time
                                          for the charity ride this weekend, I have confirmed an Ace hardware
                                          store on my route to/from the event has one of those Xtracycle-sized
                                          Rubbermaid Slim Coolers for only $15.99. It would be funny to show up
                                          for the 63 mile ride on the Big Dummy with a cooler full of ice cold
                                          beverages to drink on the tour along side spandex wearing roadies
                                          barely carrying anything. :)
                                          _TONE_
                                        • Matt Gitchell
                                          Yeah, man, I rode a century last weekend and it was fun being the odd man out. Be ready for the later-distance comments ( that s like riding two bikes can I
                                          Message 20 of 29 , Jun 10, 2008
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                                            Yeah, man, I rode a century last weekend and it was fun being the odd man out. Be ready for the later-distance comments ("that's like riding two bikes" "can I get a ride?" "is that a skateboard?" etc.).
                                            Not sure I want to make a habit of it (some of those folks are so SERIOUS; let 'em have their day), but it was a blast.

                                            --Matt

                                            On Tue, Jun 10, 2008 at 5:24 AM, <Tone@...> wrote:

                                            Dave,

                                            Thanks for giving me the info for the 16" Big Dummy at your shop.
                                            However, I actually ordered the last Big Dummy Xtracycle had in stock
                                            (16"). It is actually suppose to arrive at my local bike shop today!

                                            Yesterday after work when my bike shop is closed (every Monday) I
                                            brought my broken bike over to them. I locked my bike up to a pipe
                                            outside their shop and hid the key to the lock nearby. My hope is the
                                            Big Dummy will arrive sooner than later today. Then I can just give
                                            them a call while I am at work to let them know where the key is so
                                            they can start swapping over parts right away.

                                            I know it is rather a rather unconventional method of dropping off a
                                            bike, but Big Dummies are not exactly conventional. :) Also, there is
                                            a 63 mile charity ride this coming Saturday, which I am already
                                            registered to ride in through the company I work at. I am really
                                            hoping to be able to sport the Big Dummy on that ride. The Big Dummy
                                            will be my only bike. I have been riding my wife's
                                            built-up-from-scraps (Frankenstein) bike to work since my original
                                            bike broke, but it is just not the same. :(

                                            Oh, and if I do manage to get my new Big Dummy up and running in time
                                            for the charity ride this weekend, I have confirmed an Ace hardware
                                            store on my route to/from the event has one of those Xtracycle-sized
                                            Rubbermaid Slim Coolers for only $15.99. It would be funny to show up
                                            for the 63 mile ride on the Big Dummy with a cooler full of ice cold
                                            beverages to drink on the tour along side spandex wearing roadies
                                            barely carrying anything. :)
                                            _TONE_


                                          • David Bole
                                            Tone, I am sure you are going to love it. One guy at our shop kept his old Xtracycle as a spare to the big dummy. Can you really have too many xtracycles?
                                            Message 21 of 29 , Jun 10, 2008
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                                              Tone,

                                              I am sure you are going to love it. One guy at our shop kept his old
                                              Xtracycle as a spare to the big dummy. Can you really have too many
                                              xtracycles? After riding the big d for a couple weeks he liked it so
                                              much better he ended up selling his old X.

                                              Dave
                                              --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, Tone@... wrote:
                                              >
                                              > Dave,
                                              >
                                              > Thanks for giving me the info for the 16" Big Dummy at your shop.
                                              > However, I actually ordered the last Big Dummy Xtracycle had in
                                              stock
                                              > (16"). It is actually suppose to arrive at my local bike shop today!
                                              >
                                              > Yesterday after work when my bike shop is closed (every Monday) I
                                              > brought my broken bike over to them. I locked my bike up to a pipe
                                              > outside their shop and hid the key to the lock nearby. My hope is
                                              the
                                              > Big Dummy will arrive sooner than later today. Then I can just
                                              give
                                              > them a call while I am at work to let them know where the key is
                                              so
                                              > they can start swapping over parts right away.
                                              >
                                              > I know it is rather a rather unconventional method of dropping off
                                              a
                                              > bike, but Big Dummies are not exactly conventional. :) Also, there
                                              is
                                              > a 63 mile charity ride this coming Saturday, which I am already
                                              > registered to ride in through the company I work at. I am really
                                              > hoping to be able to sport the Big Dummy on that ride. The Big
                                              Dummy
                                              > will be my only bike. I have been riding my wife's
                                              > built-up-from-scraps (Frankenstein) bike to work since my original
                                              > bike broke, but it is just not the same. :(
                                              >
                                              > Oh, and if I do manage to get my new Big Dummy up and running in
                                              time
                                              > for the charity ride this weekend, I have confirmed an Ace
                                              hardware
                                              > store on my route to/from the event has one of those Xtracycle-
                                              sized
                                              > Rubbermaid Slim Coolers for only $15.99. It would be funny to show
                                              up
                                              > for the 63 mile ride on the Big Dummy with a cooler full of ice
                                              cold
                                              > beverages to drink on the tour along side spandex wearing roadies
                                              > barely carrying anything. :)
                                              > _TONE_
                                              >
                                            • tismarcusone
                                              Tone, Does this Xtracyle have a lifetime warranty on the fram agains breakage call them and have them replace the X...then get your bike suggestion. ... for a
                                              Message 22 of 29 , Jun 11, 2008
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                                                Tone, Does this Xtracyle have a lifetime warranty on the fram agains
                                                breakage call them and have them replace the X...then get your bike
                                                suggestion.

                                                -- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, "Antonio" <Tone@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                > Today on the way to work my bicycle had a catastrophic failure right
                                                > through the frame tubing behind the headset. For a couple of seconds
                                                > it felt like I had some major air leak going on in my tires then the
                                                > frame just tore right through itself. I am perfectly fine except
                                                for a
                                                > slight grease smudge on my white shirt, but my bike is irreparable.
                                                >
                                                > I would not at all consider the breakage a fault in the frame. It
                                                was
                                                > a fat-tube aluminum frame, which I had for about ten years. I
                                                estimate
                                                > I easily put over 30,000 miles on it with much of that working as a
                                                > bike messenger in New York City (30+ miles a day, five days a week,
                                                > low-ball-50 weeks in a year for even only five years = 37,500
                                                miles).
                                                > Considering I also had the Xtracycle attached to it for most of
                                                those
                                                > years and I have hauled some SERIOUS cargo at times... it is a
                                                wonder
                                                > it lasted this long. I know a number of my bike mechanics over the
                                                > years will not be surprised, although they hardly believe I have
                                                > actually ridden on the same aluminum frame for this long.
                                                >
                                                > In any case, this bike is the only one I have and I do not drive.
                                                > Heck, I do not even have a driver's license, and just this past
                                                > Saturday was in fact the FIRST time I ever stepped into a DMV. My
                                                > passport is about to expire in August and I needed to get a
                                                > non-driver's state ID as an official identification while my
                                                passport
                                                > is sent away for renewal. Maybe stepping into a DMV jinxed my
                                                bicycle. :)
                                                >
                                                > My wife has a bike I can borrow VERY temporarily, but for long term
                                                > usage it definitely is not for me. Ideally I would like to get
                                                Surly's
                                                > Big Dummy, but unfortunately their first batch sold out pretty quick
                                                > _as_far_as_I_know_. My wife and I are trying to buy a house, so back
                                                > when the Big Dummy was released I could not justify the $800 plus to
                                                > build a secondary cargo bike. Sadly now, the next batch of Big
                                                > Dummies is only available some time in the Fall _as_far_as_I_know_.
                                                > <Sigh>.
                                                >
                                                > Does anyone know differently in regards to the Big Dummy? Are there
                                                > ANY available Big Dummies still floating around??? To be honest I am
                                                > not even sure what frame size would be appropriate for me. My busted
                                                > bike had a low top-tube geometry and it has been SO long since I had
                                                > to worry about frame sizing. My pant-leg inseam is about 30-31" in
                                                > length, but other than that I am clueless. Maybe I should have had
                                                > myself at least sized up for a frame fitting at my bike shop in
                                                > preparation for eventually getting the Big Dummy, but I never
                                                bothered
                                                > since I thought I was not going to get a Big Dummy until at least
                                                the
                                                > Fall. After going to the DMV I even stopped in at my bike shop to
                                                pick
                                                > up one of those "Planet Bike" super-flash(?) lights, which a number
                                                of
                                                > people have given good reviews on this forum... and yes I agree; It
                                                is
                                                > VERY bright! Do NOT look directly at it! :) heh
                                                >
                                                > Anyway, does anyone out there have any tips on where to score a Big
                                                > Dummy. I would VERY much appreciate it! Also, if anyone can offer
                                                any
                                                > suggestions on what Big Dummy frame size would be appropriate for me
                                                > that would be great too!
                                                >
                                                > I still have my Xtracycle, so I could get a temporary used frame
                                                > somewhere, but what kind of sucks is my FreeRadical has had a crack
                                                > behind one of its dropouts for over a year now. Therefore I would be
                                                > swapping over a busted Xtracycle onto a different bike frame. I have
                                                > had a split pipe hose clamped over the cracked area to act as a
                                                brace
                                                > of sorts and I am quite sure it will hold up fine, but obviously
                                                > getting a brand new Big Dummy would be the ideal solution. <Sigh>
                                                >
                                                > Why can't things last forever? I guess the ride had to end sometime.
                                                > Rest in Peace Boxer.
                                                >
                                                > For those wondering, Boxer is my bike's name. The name is from the
                                                > symbolic proletariat Horse character in the book "Animal Farm", who
                                                > works almost religiously until he dies just to have his remains sent
                                                > to the glue factory. I suppose, if I get a replacement used bike
                                                frame
                                                > and swap out the bike parts, that might as well be the same as
                                                sending
                                                > my aluminum horse's body to the "glue factory."
                                                >
                                                > For those of you, who can still hop on their bikes and ride off into
                                                > the sunset...
                                                > Ride safe,
                                                > _TONE_
                                                >
                                              • Tone@moon-shine.net
                                                tismarcusone
                                                Message 23 of 29 , Jun 11, 2008
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                                                  tismarcusone
                                                • Tone@moon-shine.net
                                                  tismarcusone, Xtracycles do come with a warranty. However, legally the manner in which I used my Xtracycle voids it. I was working as a bike messenger in New
                                                  Message 24 of 29 , Jun 11, 2008
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                                                    tismarcusone,

                                                    Xtracycles do come with a warranty. However, legally the manner in
                                                    which I used my Xtracycle voids it. I was working as a bike messenger
                                                    in New York City for a number of years with the FreeRadical extension
                                                    equipped. Technically speaking working with an Xtracycle is considered
                                                    a commercial or industrial usage and thus not covered by the warranty.

                                                    In reality though, most of the bigger loads I carried, like lumber and
                                                    CostCo bulk-grocery shopping, were for personal reasons not at all
                                                    associated with work. In actuality though it did not matter anyway.
                                                    The guys at Xtracycle are terrific.

                                                    I was one of the first Xtracyclists in New York, and definitely the
                                                    only bike messenger on an Xtracycle for many years. While working all
                                                    day I never hesitated to discuss and explain what the Xtracycle was. I
                                                    know for certain at least 2 or three cyclists, who bought an Xtracycle
                                                    after they met me, and I figure there were probably about half a dozen
                                                    more, who may have bought one after seeing my set-up.

                                                    In any case, after I broke my first FreeRadical frame (it always
                                                    cracked behind the rear drop outs) and e-mailed them photos the guys
                                                    at Xtracycle sent me a replacement even without me first sending them
                                                    my busted FreeRadical. They shipped me a replacement for free and I
                                                    paid to ship back my broken FreeRadical in the box the new one came
                                                    in. If that was not enough I had mentioned my kickstand also had
                                                    broken a couple of months before and sure enough they slipped a new
                                                    one in the box at no charge as well.

                                                    Eventually my second Xtracycle cracked too and when I e-mailed them to
                                                    let them know I corresponded with Laughter. She actually joked with me
                                                    in one of her messages saying something like, "Sure! We'll replace all
                                                    the Xtracycles you can go through? Should we send you an extra frame
                                                    as well to avoid another broken one later on?" Of course she signed
                                                    that e-mail with her name "Laughter", so for a week or two even
                                                    through other messages I thought she was joking with me in a very
                                                    sarcastic way. Eventually it all got cleared up and once again
                                                    Xtracycle sent me a replacement. This time around though, instead of a
                                                    new kickstand (the new one had not broken again) they sent me
                                                    replacement Freeloader bags since I had told them mine were looking
                                                    kind of ratty and they did not want me mis-representing their good
                                                    name and design. As before I sent them the cracked FreeRadical along
                                                    with the ratty Freeloaders in the box they sent me the replacements in.

                                                    The coolness of the Xtracycle folks does not end there though. A month
                                                    of two after getting the THIRD FreeRadical my second kickstand did
                                                    actually break. As usual I informed Xtracycle... not to get a
                                                    replacement, but simply to let them know of the possible defect in the
                                                    kickstands they were using. Well this time they did not send me a
                                                    replacement kickstand. Instead another month or two later while doing
                                                    my messenger job I get a random call on my cell phone from a strange
                                                    phone number. I did not answer it, but I eventually did listen to the
                                                    message. the call was actually from Kipchoge, who at that very moment
                                                    was down in Washington Square Park eating lunch and he wanted to hang
                                                    out for a bit if I could. I ran it by my dispatcher and work was slow,
                                                    so I was able to ride down there to meet up with Kipchoge. Sure enough
                                                    when I met up with him even though he and a friend both had Xtracycles
                                                    as a joke he tells me he is tired of carrying around three new
                                                    kickstands and was wondering if I could take them off his hand. It was
                                                    his amusing way of hooking me up with yet some more freebie
                                                    replacements.

                                                    The way I figure it is I must have really helped promote and sell
                                                    Xtracycles while working as a messenger in New York City. That at
                                                    least would justify how awesomely nice Kipchoge, Laughter, and
                                                    everyone else at Xtracycle is.

                                                    In any case, when my THIRD Xtracycle developed a crack I once again
                                                    informed the Xtracycle folks, but this time I refused them sending me
                                                    yet another replacement. By this time the first announced release date
                                                    of Surly's Big Dummy was suppose to happen within three months, so I
                                                    wanted to just upgrade to a Big Dummy then. For that time being
                                                    though, I braced the area developing a crack with a split pipe and
                                                    four hose clamps. Little did I know it would be another year or so
                                                    until the real Big Dummy Release date actually occurred. I just kept
                                                    riding my braced Xtracycle rig though.

                                                    So... that is where I am now. My 10 year old bicycle frame finally
                                                    broke and I did not intend to hook up a cracked FreeRadical onto
                                                    another bicycle. Instead I called Xtracycle and managed to order the
                                                    LAST Big Dummy they had. Of course they could not let me just slip by
                                                    with just a Big Dummy order. Nate asked if I needed anything else and
                                                    when I told him I still had the original Snap Deck, which was looking
                                                    REALLY beat up, he threw in a free replacement yet again along with
                                                    some little Velcro straps for various Long-Hauler/Wide-Loader
                                                    connections I had either worn down or lost. Oh yeah, when I also asked
                                                    to purchase a new long-length disc-brake cable he apparently included
                                                    that without charging me either.

                                                    So tismarcusone... there is no way in good conscience I could ever
                                                    expect or even ask the dope people at Xtracycle to replace my cracked
                                                    FreeRadical. In my mind they have gone above and beyond what I would
                                                    ever had expected them to do. If anything I will probably ship back my
                                                    broke FreeRadical and send them some freebie stuff of my own! :)

                                                    By the way, after developing a crack in my third FreeRadical and not
                                                    asking or getting a replacement, they actually told me the only people
                                                    who ever cracked their Xtracycles like I had were themselves during
                                                    testing, etc. and the dudes from that Riding the Spine group. The
                                                    "Riding the Spine" guys are hardcore cyclists, who ride long-tail
                                                    bikes from the Southern tip of South America all the way up to Alaska.
                                                    If you are unfamiliar with geography, that is practically ALL
                                                    mountainous, hence the "spine" reference.

                                                    _TONE_
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