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Tongue placement

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  • Phil Good-Elliott
    Keeping my tongue firmly in cheek... But seriously, I ve wondered about the benefits and/or drawbacks of placing the mounting tongue under the chainstay of
    Message 1 of 7 , Mar 1, 2008
      Keeping my tongue firmly in cheek...

      But seriously, I've wondered about the benefits and/or drawbacks of
      placing the mounting "tongue" under the chainstay of my Trek 4300
      (2005 model year). I've cranked the suspension down so it's fairly
      stiff and I still can't ride w/o hands. I did a search of the message
      archive and don't really find anything definitive about pros and cons
      of tongue placement.

      Your constructive comments are appreciated! :-)
    • Anne Littlebird
      Hum, so far I can ride no hands even with the X loaded on one side. I can t do it for a long period of time but long enough to zip up my jacket or put gloves
      Message 2 of 7 , Mar 1, 2008
        Hum, so far I can ride no hands even with the X loaded on one side. I
        can't do it for a long period of time but long enough to zip up my
        jacket or put gloves on.

        My headset is average tightness I guess. I can make the wheel turn with
        body shifting so I know it's not tight and it's definitely not too loose.

        My physical body balance is good though unlike some other people. I
        taught a class the other day where everyone had to come up on the balls
        of their feet for a few seconds, arms overhead. I was stunned that not a
        single person could manage it without falling over.

        How are you on standing/static stops? I think that's what they are
        called. Balancing long enough on a stopped bike at a light or stop sign.

        Phil Good-Elliott wrote:
        >
        > Keeping my tongue firmly in cheek...
        >
        > But seriously, I've wondered about the benefits and/or drawbacks of
        > placing the mounting "tongue" under the chainstay of my Trek 4300
        > (2005 model year). I've cranked the suspension down so it's fairly
        > stiff and I still can't ride w/o hands. I did a search of the message
        > archive and don't really find anything definitive about pros and cons
        > of tongue placement.
        >
        > Your constructive comments are appreciated! :-)
        >
        >
      • Phil Good-Elliott
        I think there s something about the geometry of the bike/X set-up that s making it difficult for me. If it s structurally sound to put the tongut under the
        Message 3 of 7 , Mar 1, 2008
          I think there's something about the geometry of the bike/X set-up that's making it difficult
          for me. If it's structurally sound to put the tongut under the chainstay to lower the center
          of gravity a bit, I think it might help. I have no problems with body control on a bike, so
          I'm sure that's not an issue (long time bike rider and long time dancer).

          -Phil

          --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, Anne Littlebird <issumatuq@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hum, so far I can ride no hands even with the X loaded on one side. I
          > can't do it for a long period of time but long enough to zip up my
          > jacket or put gloves on.
          >
          > My headset is average tightness I guess. I can make the wheel turn with
          > body shifting so I know it's not tight and it's definitely not too loose.
          >
          > My physical body balance is good though unlike some other people. I
          > taught a class the other day where everyone had to come up on the balls
          > of their feet for a few seconds, arms overhead. I was stunned that not a
          > single person could manage it without falling over.
          >
          > How are you on standing/static stops? I think that's what they are
          > called. Balancing long enough on a stopped bike at a light or stop sign.
          >
          > Phil Good-Elliott wrote:
          > >
          > > Keeping my tongue firmly in cheek...
          > >
          > > But seriously, I've wondered about the benefits and/or drawbacks of
          > > placing the mounting "tongue" under the chainstay of my Trek 4300
          > > (2005 model year). I've cranked the suspension down so it's fairly
          > > stiff and I still can't ride w/o hands. I did a search of the message
          > > archive and don't really find anything definitive about pros and cons
          > > of tongue placement.
          > >
          > > Your constructive comments are appreciated! :-)
          > >
          > >
          >
        • Anne Littlebird
          Then you should be good to go. Dancers are always good balancers. Hopefully someone who s played with the tongue placement will have an answer. Good luck! I m
          Message 4 of 7 , Mar 1, 2008
            Then you should be good to go. Dancers are always good balancers.

            Hopefully someone who's played with the tongue placement will have an
            answer. Good luck!

            I'm off to order new brakes.

            Anne

            Phil Good-Elliott wrote:
            >
            > I think there's something about the geometry of the bike/X set-up
            > that's making it difficult
            > for me. If it's structurally sound to put the tongut under the
            > chainstay to lower the center
            > of gravity a bit, I think it might help. I have no problems with body
            > control on a bike, so
            > I'm sure that's not an issue (long time bike rider and long time dancer).
            >
            > -Phil
            >
            > --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com
            > <mailto:rootsradicals%40yahoogroups.com>, Anne Littlebird
            > <issumatuq@...> wrote:
            > >
            > > Hum, so far I can ride no hands even with the X loaded on one side. I
            > > can't do it for a long period of time but long enough to zip up my
            > > jacket or put gloves on.
            > >
            > > My headset is average tightness I guess. I can make the wheel turn with
            > > body shifting so I know it's not tight and it's definitely not too
            > loose.
            > >
            > > My physical body balance is good though unlike some other people. I
            > > taught a class the other day where everyone had to come up on the balls
            > > of their feet for a few seconds, arms overhead. I was stunned that
            > not a
            > > single person could manage it without falling over.
            > >
            > > How are you on standing/static stops? I think that's what they are
            > > called. Balancing long enough on a stopped bike at a light or stop sign.
            > >
            > > Phil Good-Elliott wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Keeping my tongue firmly in cheek...
            > > >
            > > > But seriously, I've wondered about the benefits and/or drawbacks of
            > > > placing the mounting "tongue" under the chainstay of my Trek 4300
            > > > (2005 model year). I've cranked the suspension down so it's fairly
            > > > stiff and I still can't ride w/o hands. I did a search of the message
            > > > archive and don't really find anything definitive about pros and cons
            > > > of tongue placement.
            > > >
            > > > Your constructive comments are appreciated! :-)
            > > >
            > > >
            > >
            >
            >
          • Devian Gilbert
            thats what i did with my Cdale conversion... after some time of riding the bike the way the instruction advise... i put the tongue under the chainstay
            Message 5 of 7 , Mar 1, 2008
              thats what i did with my Cdale conversion...
              after some time of riding the bike the way the instruction advise...
              i put the tongue under the chainstay bridge...
              and VIOLA!
              now the geometry became more relaxed, and ultimately i could let go of the bars.

              when you do this...all it does is lowers the BB a very small amount, and now all the angles are relaxed.

              mechanically i never had a problem, but i was paranoid...and i checked it regularly for about a month, and forgot about it.

              peace...d

              "Every time I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the human race." H.G. Wells


              On Mar 1, 2008, at 5:33 AM, Phil Good-Elliott wrote:

              Keeping my tongue firmly in cheek...

              But seriously, I've wondered about the benefits and/or drawbacks of
              placing the mounting "tongue" under the chainstay of my Trek 4300
              (2005 model year). I've cranked the suspension down so it's fairly
              stiff and I still can't ride w/o hands. I did a search of the message
              archive and don't really find anything definitive about pros and cons
              of tongue placement. 

              Your constructive comments are appreciated! :-)


            • Sunny Keach
              I ve been flirting with putting the tongue under the chain stay, to get slacker angles.. I do know why the directions say not to. If the bolt that holds it in
              Message 6 of 7 , Mar 2, 2008
                I've been flirting with putting the tongue under the chain stay, to get
                slacker angles.. I do know why the directions say not to. If the bolt
                that holds it in place or the chunk of aluminum it's connected to fail,
                it wont be cataclysmic, meaning that the x rests on the chainstay. If
                the bolt should fail with the x under the chainstay, then there is
                little to stop it from going straight to the ground, possibly at speed.
                that could be a bit ugly. So I am just planning to beef up that
                connection or put some sort of back up strap or cord around it just in case.
                sunny
              • Cara Lin Bridgman
                Yes, I visualized that sort of accident, too--gouging out tarmac at the very least. Thinking about it some more, though, I m wondering just how strong the
                Message 7 of 7 , Mar 2, 2008
                  Yes, I visualized that sort of accident, too--gouging out tarmac at the
                  very least.

                  Thinking about it some more, though, I'm wondering just how strong the
                  forces are on that bolt. The real point of attachment is with the
                  bike's drop-outs.

                  On my Surly Instigator frame, the chain-stay bridge has a smaller
                  diameter than the chain stays. Since the aluminum plate is supposed to
                  bridge the chain stays, whether I put the tongue over or under the
                  chain-stay bridge, I had a gap in the aluminum plate and the chain-stay
                  bridge. This means, I found it really easy to bend the aluminum plate!
                  In other words, that's what happens when you keep cranking the nut on
                  that bolt... So, I bought a few back-up aluminum plates, but am still
                  using the bent one (it has a slight but noticeable curve). To keep from
                  bending it more or from bending future plates, I bought some steel
                  washers with about the same diameter as the gap between chain-stays and
                  stacked them to fill the space between chain-stay bridge and aluminum
                  plate. It's all tight and I've not noticed any shifting of tongue,
                  plate, or washers.

                  CL

                  Sunny Keach wrote:
                  > I've been flirting with putting the tongue under the chain stay, to get
                  > slacker angles.. I do know why the directions say not to. If the bolt
                  > that holds it in place or the chunk of aluminum it's connected to fail,
                  > it wont be cataclysmic, meaning that the x rests on the chainstay. If
                  > the bolt should fail with the x under the chainstay, then there is
                  > little to stop it from going straight to the ground, possibly at speed.
                  > that could be a bit ugly. So I am just planning to beef up that
                  > connection or put some sort of back up strap or cord around it just in case.
                  > sunny
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